Price of ZF Transmission Fluid (CRAZY)

[ctrcbob]

You guys are not going to believe this.

The V8 Sedan (and the V6 Coupe) uses the German made ZF 6 Speed Transmission. This is the same transmission that is used in many BMW's and Jaguars. This Transmission fluid is the M-1375.4 Fluid. Well, in reading posts in www.bobistheoilguy.com (go in that site and in search, enter 1375.4 fluid).
I saw where guys were saying that the cost of this fluid at BMW dealers is out of this world, and they posted other fluids that meet the specs, and will work in the ZF 6 Speed.

OK, I decided to phone my Hyundai Dealer Parts Department and spoke with my favorate parts guy. First off, he had trouble finding the fluid in his parts directory. (They never had a ZF problem or fluid change up to now) Once he did fined the fluid, he said he could not believe the cost.

Are you ready? ARE YOU READY?

$75.00 a quart! Yes, you see that correct. $75.00 a quart.

I don't see me getting the transmission serviced before my owners manual says I have to get it serviced - If anything goes wrong, before the 10 year 100,000 mile warranty is up, I'll let Hyundai eat it. After that, I'll get it serviced using other fluids that meet the M-1375.4 specs.

$75.00 a quart. I just can't believe it. (Cost is about the same at BMW and Jaguar Parts Departments).

 

[crupp]

i had my tranny drained and refilled...total; cost $1300

 

[wallymn]

Can I ask why you had the tranny flushed? and what else was done?

 

[ctrcbob]

Wally,

I believe that Crupps car is the one that tried to drive through a flood and now has a new engine and had the transmission flushed out.

 

[ctrcbob]

At the rate I'm putting on milage, I will reach the 100,000 mile mark in less then six years. (perhaps five)

Going out to Roswell in a couple weeks, and when I return in mid December, I will have 20,000 miles on her since last mid January.

 

[TJPark01]

At the rate I'm putting on milage, I will reach the 100,000 mile mark in less then six years. (perhaps five)

Going out to Roswell in a couple weeks, and when I return in mid December, I will have 20,000 miles on her since last mid January.

The short answer is that the fluid in the ZF does not need to be changed, unless something that is happening internally to cause the transmission to be problematic. Then the tranny needs to be serviced, at which time the fluid would be changed along with a host of other things involved. There is a reason there is no dipstick...it's not a drain and fill procedure. It's dangerous,messy, and you need the right tools.

 

[crupp]

Wally,

I believe that Crupps car is the one that tried to drive through a flood and now has a new engine and had the transmission flushed out.

you are correct. mine was done as a precaution

 

[ctrcbob]

The transmission in our V8 Sedans (and V6 Coupes) is the ZF 6HP26. I did some checking around in various ATF websites and found the following that meet the M-1375.4 specs.

Castrol Import Multi-Vehicle Automatic Transmission Fluid.
RedLine D4 ATF. Also Redline D6 ATF.
Amalie Universal Synthetic ATF.
Wolf's Head Super Universal Synthetic AFT.

Note that Amalie and Wolf's Head are the same company.

All the above cost MUCH less than the Hyundai M-1375.4 fluid. On the previous mentioned oil website, it was mentioned that BMW sells theirs for $16.00 a HALF liter, but they only have it in bulk, not in individual bottles. (this could be wrong).

I have a few quarts of the Wolf's Head mentioned above, that I use in my Continental. Although I know it would work in the Genesis, I will just leave the Genesis alone as long as it is in warranty. After I pass the 100,000 mile mark, I will use one of the above products. I purchased the Wolf's Head for $3.79 a quart two years ago. Last I saw, it was selling at a neighborhood auto parts store (not a national chain) for just over $4.00 a quart.

There is no reason for the Hyundai Genesis V6 (ZF) ATF Fluid to sell for $75.00 a quart, unless it has gold flakes floating in it. I hope my parts guy was wrong on the price.

 

[Mark_888]

There is no reason for the Hyundai Genesis V6 (ZF) ATF Fluid to sell for $75.00 a quart, unless it has gold flakes floating in it. I hope my parts guy was wrong on the price.

I believe you mean "V8". The V6 uses an Aisin transmission, which also uses synthetic (but a different synthetic according to owners manual), and also does not need to be changed under normal circumstances.

 

[Sayantsi]

Wow, I'm glad I went with the Aisin! That price is ridiculous though - I'd personally just get a fluid that is the spec Hyundai requires from a reputable company like Shell or Amsoil.

edit - nevermind - I checked and Shell is the ZF supplier for this pricey oil!

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[OBCT]

Wow, I'm glad I went with the Aisin! That price is ridiculous though - I'd personally just get a fluid that is the spec Hyundai requires from a reputable company like Shell or Amsoil.

edit - nevermind - I checked and Shell is the ZF supplier for this pricey oil!

...and according to it's website, Amsoil does not offer a replacement fluid for the M-1375.4 concoction.

Thanks to ctrcbob for listing a few possible compromises at a much cheaper price. Not that I hope to ever need to walk across that bridge with my Genesis.

 

[ctrcbob]

I believe you mean "V8". The V6 uses an Aisin transmission, which also uses synthetic (but a different synthetic according to owners manual), and also does not need to be changed under normal circumstances.

Mark,

The V6 Sedan uses the Aisin Transmission. The V6 COUPE uses the ZF.

Without looking in my manual, I don't know what fluid the Aisin Transmission uses in the Sedan, HOWEVER, other Aisin transmissions (in other cars) use the fluid that meet 3309 specs. Very easy to find. Mobil has it (Mobil 3309 ATF), Ford has it (Motorcraft Special Automatic Transmission Fluid - used in the Fusion/Milan/MKZ), and the easiest to find is the Toyota T-IV. In addition, many other manufacturers, like those previously mentioned, (Castrol, Amilie, Wolfs Head) plus Mobil-1 and AmsOil have synthetic fluids that meet the 3309 specs.

A few weeks ago, I spoke with some techs at a Jaguar repair shop, (only works on Jags) and they did mention to me that the fluid for the Jag ZF transmission cost an arm and a leg, but he did not tell me just how much it costs. Some day, I will stop off at both the BMW dealer and the Jag dealer to see how much the M-1375.4 fluid costs at their dealership.

 

[warp08]

According to my dealer, the ZF-unit is factory sealed, the service technicians are simply not allowed to service it. If the unit develops a malfunction of any kind detectable by diagnostic tools, the supplier will ship a new replacement unit and the dealer will simply swap it out. The malfunctioning unit must be shipped back to the factory for further analysis.

Under normal operating circumstances, the fluid should last the lifetime of the unit. What happens after the warranty period, is another matter. The owner can decide, I suppose, what level of risk to take by substituting alternate fluids, if servicing is required.

 

[Mark_888]

According to my dealer, the ZF-unit is factory sealed, the service technicians are simply not allowed to service it. If the unit develops a malfunction of any kind detectable by diagnostic tools, the supplier will ship a new replacement unit and the dealer will simply swap it out. The malfunctioning unit must be shipped back to the factory for further analysis.

Under normal operating circumstances, the fluid should last the lifetime of the unit. What happens after the warranty period, is another matter. The owner can decide, I suppose, what level of risk to take by substituting alternate fluids, if servicing is required.

I agree that the fluid should not need to be changed under normal circumstances during the life of the unit, but the dealer techs can service it and replace the fluid. Crupp (see posts above) had his fluid changed by a dealer after his car was flooded.

I guess the service representative at the dealer who told you that was trying to emphasize that the fluid does not need to ever be changed, but he stretched the facts a bit to make his point.

 

[ctrcbob]

According to my dealer, the ZF-unit is factory sealed, the service technicians are simply not allowed to service it. If the unit develops a malfunction of any kind detectable by diagnostic tools, the supplier will ship a new replacement unit and the dealer will simply swap it out. The malfunctioning unit must be shipped back to the factory for further analysis.

Under normal operating circumstances, the fluid should last the lifetime of the unit. What happens after the warranty period, is another matter. The owner can decide, I suppose, what level of risk to take by substituting alternate fluids, if servicing is required.

Confirmed this with my closest dealer. $76.xx per quart. Hyundai does not repair transmissions (at least while under warranty) but replaces them. The problem transmission is then sent back to Hyundai (for inspection or fixed?). This is for all Hyundai transmissions, not just the ZF.

I'm not going to worry about it until I get to the 100,000 mile mark

 

[scottdk]

I agree that the fluid should not need to be changed under normal circumstances during the life of the unit, but the dealer techs can service it and replace the fluid. Crupp (see posts above) had his fluid changed by a dealer after his car was flooded.

I guess the service representative at the dealer who told you that was trying to emphasize that the fluid does not need to ever be changed, but he stretched the facts a bit to make his point.

I had some maintanience done on my other car (not the Genesis) at a local shop a few weeks back and I actually talked to all of the techs and the shop owner about tranny fluid. I mentioned that I owned a car that according to the auto maker, the tranny fluid does not need to be changed..ever.

They stated that the information about the fluid maybe true according to Hyundai, but that there is Ions and magnatism and all this other tech Jargon and Science lingo they started talking about.

The result of what they were saying is that transmission fluid breaks down over time due to the type of metals used in an engine, and also radiators, basically breaking down the transmission fluid.

According to them, the tranny fluid on any, and every car will eventually need to be flushed.

Any thoughts Mark?

 

[Mark_888]

I had some maintanience done on my other car (not the Genesis) at a local shop a few weeks back and I actually talked to all of the techs and the shop owner about tranny fluid. I mentioned that I owned a car that according to the auto maker, the tranny fluid does not need to be changed..ever.

They stated that the information about the fluid maybe true according to Hyundai, but that there is Ions and magnatism and all this other tech Jargon and Science lingo they started talking about.

The result of what they were saying is that transmission fluid breaks down over time due to the type of metals used in an engine, and also radiators, basically breaking down the transmission fluid.

According to them, the tranny fluid on any, and every car will eventually need to be flushed.

Any thoughts Mark?

I am not an expert on the subject, but I wonder if they ever worked on an AT that had synthetic as factory fill? It would not be surprising for a tech not to know much about an AT that doesn't ever need routine maintenance (fluid replace/flush).

I don't think the maintenance intervals are from Hyundai, they are from ZF and Aisin (neither AT on the Genesis has any maintenance interval specified, and apparently no dipstick).

 

[TJPark01]

According to them, the tranny fluid on any, and every car will eventually need to be flushed.
Any thoughts Mark?

They are correct all tranny fluid will eventually, need to be changed. BUT...
By the time the transmission fluid needs to be changed, the transmission will have to be serviced. Don't think of it as an oil change, because it's not that simple. To properly drain all the fluid, in the V6 you will have to drain the tranny oil, then drop the pan, swap in a new filter and O ring, clean off the magnet, add a new pan gasket, seal the thing, pump new fluid into the drian hole using a fluid transfer pump. Oh and you will also have to do this underneath the car while it is running. I don't know about you but I don't like to be underneath the car while it's running. This is why it's an expensive job.
The good news is by the time you have to do this, the 4th generation Genesis will be out, and we'll have colonized the moon.

 

[Poopsicle]

Please be careful with universal fluids. I heard on even the older Hyundai's, people had Auto transmission failures when the refilled with Universal ATF fluid and not Genuine Hyundai ATF

 

[ajls09873]

Price of ZF Transmission Fluid.
It is not Hyundai's own price.
It is a ZF's price.