The G80 is the "last man standing"...

[YEH]

Acura to drop RLX sedan in North America after 2020 model year

Changing consumer tastes are prompting American Honda to drop the aging and low-selling Acura RLX flagship sedan in North America after the 2020 model year as the luxury brand regroups around sports sedans and crossovers.

www.autonews.com

The RLX follows the GS and Q70 out the door, leaving the G80 as the only remaining Asian sedan at this price-point.

The demise of the other 3 may bump up sales of the G80 a bit.

 

[Trixie86]

http://[URL]https://www.autonews.co...rlx-sedan-north-america-after-2020-model-year

[/URL]

The RLX follows the GS and Q70 out the door, leaving the G80 as the only remaining Asian sedan at this price-point.

The demise of the other 3 may bump up sales of the G80 a bit.

I'd love to read, but no subscription.

 

[Backslack]

That's what the Japanese brands get for leaving their cars to rot for almost a decade without any significant tech/powertrain updates while the Germans and Koreans churn out new product after product. At least Lexus made the memorable GS-F, which will be missed (though I am a bit biased as a GS owner).

The new TLX better be good to make up for this.

 

[MrMegadeth]

I'd say the Mazda6 competes pretty well.

 

[MyCorvette]

I previously owned 3 Lexus GS (from 2nd generation up to the latest one). Compared to its European rivals of the same era, the 2nd gen is the best.

Although the 3rd gen has lots of innovation (the 2GR-FSE V6,1UR-FSE V8, Active Power Stabilizer Suspension, Aisin 8AT etc.), one major drawback is its body-in-white has very weak torsional rigidity (~16k Nm/deg), which severely offset its advanced suspension setup. Handling is a mess, and not to mention lots of body flex can be noticed when driven on uneven road surfaces.

The 4th gen somewhat mitigated this shortcomings, by increasing the rigidity to be 14% higher, but that is still far from comparable to its competitors. This difference can be felt immediately when one drives the GS side-by-side with the latest 5 series, E class etc.

The current IS has a more rigid platform but unfortunately the GS is not using it. Even the latest Toyota TNGA platform (Camry, Avalon, RAV4 etc.) is much more rigid than the GS, this put the GS at a very awkward position. No wonder why Toyota decides to discontinue it.

Generally speaking mid-size luxury sedan is a hard sell given the current economy. Even for G80, it shares the same platform and powertrain with the GV80. So if the G80 is priced close to the GV80, I cannot think of any reason why I am not buying the GV80 but instead choosing the G80.

 

[PFWiz]

This is why I am buying a G80. Other than Caddy and the Germans (OK, and Kia) who else makes a large

 

[mikemu30]

This is why I am buying a G80. Other than Caddy and the Germans (OK, and Kia) who else makes a large

Lexus still produces the ES.

 

[joegr]

Lexus still produces the ES.

But it's not RWD.

 

[Backslack]

The Lexus ES is literally a gussied up Avalon. Not remotely in the same league as the G80 or any other RWD premium sedan.

 

[mikemu30]

The Lexus ES is literally a gussied up Avalon. Not remotely in the same league as the G80 or any other RWD premium sedan.

Yes because it is NOT a RWD sedan.

______________________________

Help support this site so it can continue supporting you!

 

[OpIv37]

That's what the Japanese brands get for leaving their cars to rot for almost a decade without any significant tech/powertrain updates while the Germans and Koreans churn out new product after product. At least Lexus made the memorable GS-F, which will be missed (though I am a bit biased as a GS owner).

The new TLX better be good to make up for this.

I love Acura. I had a TL that got totaled. The TLX was brand new and too expensive for me, and they weren’t selling the TL’s CPO because of the Takata air bag recall. I ended up with a 2014 Infiniti Q50, which was a great car. Before I traded it in for the G80, I test drove the first generation TLX and I was disappointed. The SH-AWD was great but the car was uncomfortable and the options I wanted would have cost a lot more than the G80.

I went into the search fully expecting the G80 to be a distant second to the TLX and found the opposite to be true.

I really hope the 2nd generation TLX is better. I will definitely look at it when it’s time to trade in my current car.

 

[OBO]

The Lexus ES is literally a gussied up Avalon. Not remotely in the same league as the G80 or any other RWD premium sedan.

Unpopular opinion but the avalon especially xse version is better than the ES. But correct the Lexus ES is not on the same league with the g80 at all. Idc how much of a lexus fanboy argue , no ES of any year has been better than any g80 or even the Hyundai genesis.

 

[Backslack]

Unpopular opinion but the avalon especially xse version is better than the ES. But correct the Lexus ES is not on the same league with the g80 at all. Idc how much of a lexus fanboy argue , no ES of any year has been better than any g80 or even the Hyundai genesis.

Lexus is brilliant at scamming their customers. For an ES, you can pay up to $55K for a naturally aspirated 4-cylinder that barely makes over 200 HP if you want AWD. $55K for a car with the same engine in a base Camry. A couple years ago, $55K was mid-trim Lexus GS territory.

One of the funniest comments I ever saw was on a Lexus subreddit where some bright gentleman (or dumb teenager lol) claimed that pairing AWD with a V6 would be "too unreliable, so Lexus was smart and didn't do it."

 

[OpIv37]

Lexus is brilliant at scamming their customers. For an ES, you can pay up to $55K for a naturally aspirated 4-cylinder that barely makes over 200 HP if you want AWD. $55K for a car with the same engine in a base Camry. A couple years ago, $55K was mid-trim Lexus GS territory.

One of the funniest comments I ever saw was on a Lexus subreddit where some bright gentleman (or dumb teenager lol) claimed that pairing AWD with a V6 would be "too unreliable, so Lexus was smart and didn't do it."

To me, Lexus is a “look at me“ brand for people who don’t really care about the performance or features, and just want to show off that they can afford a luxury brand. The RX330 crossover is like the official car of soccer moms who want to prove they can afford more than a domestic minivan.

About 10 years ago, we visited my sister in law in Texas. I had a 2008 Accord coupe with a 4 cyl 190 hp engine. She let us borrow her IS250, which was a V6 but only 205hp IIRC. it was RWD so it handled well but the gas mileage was terrible and it was barely faster than my Accord.

The ISF looks interesting but generally I’m just not a fan of the brand. Genesis may not have the same prestige for people who don’t know cars, but I really don’t care. It’s a better vehicle.

 

[Backslack]

To me, Lexus is a “look at me“ brand for people who don’t really care about the performance or features, and just want to show off that they can afford a luxury brand. The RX330 crossover is like the official car of soccer moms who want to prove they can afford more than a domestic minivan.

About 10 years ago, we visited my sister in law in Texas. I had a 2008 Accord coupe with a 4 cyl 190 hp engine. She let us borrow her IS250, which was a V6 but only 205hp IIRC. it was RWD so it handled well but the gas mileage was terrible and it was barely faster than my Accord.

The ISF looks interesting but generally I’m just not a fan of the brand. Genesis may not have the same prestige for people who don’t know cars, but I really don’t care. It’s a better vehicle.

They've become the brand of those who want to upgrade from their Camry and Highlander yet still remain in a "safe" territory. I doubt many Lexus buyers have ever even set foot in a non-Toyota or Lexus dealership.

Their attempts to compete with the German brands in the form of the IS, GS, LS, and LC are flops. It's because almost nobody who buys a Lexus would ever consider such cars when they're dead set on their Camry ES.

Years ago, an ES and RX somewhat made sense because you were getting a pretty decent value so long as you didn't care about driving dynamics. Like a modern Lincoln Town Car. But that's no longer the case when there's a $55K NA 4-cylinder ES being sold.

 

[OBO]

Lexus is brilliant at scamming their customers. For an ES, you can pay up to $55K for a naturally aspirated 4-cylinder that barely makes over 200 HP if you want AWD. $55K for a car with the same engine in a base Camry. A couple years ago, $55K was mid-trim Lexus GS territory.

One of the funniest comments I ever saw was on a Lexus subreddit where some bright gentleman (or dumb teenager lol) claimed that pairing AWD with a V6 would be "too unreliable, so Lexus was smart and didn't do it."

they do have an ES 350 F sport that has the natural aspirated v6 that produces 302 hp / 267 lb ft of torque and is FWD still inferior to the glorious G80 at 311 hp / 293 lb ft of torque RWD. Dont get me wrong its a nice car but there are better proformance N/A vehicles for less. The Lexus GS350 was a solid car still can’t justify why is pricey for no reason. Theres a reason why the IS version is highest sold sedan for their platform, nobody was really buying the GS reason why its discontinued. In terms of the IS350 vs the G70 , G70 wins hands down.

 

[OBO]

To me, Lexus is a “look at me“ brand for people who don’t really care about the performance or features, and just want to show off that they can afford a luxury brand. The RX330 crossover is like the official car of soccer moms who want to prove they can afford more than a domestic minivan.

About 10 years ago, we visited my sister in law in Texas. I had a 2008 Accord coupe with a 4 cyl 190 hp engine. She let us borrow her IS250, which was a V6 but only 205hp IIRC. it was RWD so it handled well but the gas mileage was terrible and it was barely faster than my Accord.

The ISF looks interesting but generally I’m just not a fan of the brand. Genesis may not have the same prestige for people who don’t know cars, but I really don’t care. It’s a better vehicle.

Prestige is really hurting genesis alot. Between lexus and genesis , if more people were open minded, they will see that genesis is the better car. Especially when it comes to the ES / IS vs the G80 & G70. If we had to ranked , A tier - mercedes, bmw, audi. B tier - Genesis , infiniti, lexus. C tier- acura and others, people would put genesis at C tier, but i would disagree.

 

[Rock6]

I normally don't write or join forums but thought I'd jump in on this one. First, I believe one point of note that most persons either forgot or don't know is Genesis is basically a European designed and engineered car built in Korea. Yes Genesis pulled a coupe and hired a bunch of engineers and designers from Europe (Audi, BMW, Bentley, Aston Martin, etc) and said build us a car. By the way use our most excellent world engine, give it the fit and finish Europeans cars are noted for and the reliability Asian cars are famous - by the way can you make them real safe too?

End product is Genesis. Doesn't exceed the class in any single thing but is good at everything. One of the quietest, most comfortable in class no matter which one you choose, luxury with hints of sportiness (Don't let the car mag fan boys trick you into thinking all luxury cars must be Le Mans sports/racing cars in suits, just need the ability to avoid/get out of accident when required), ultra safe (Just ask Tiger) and plush enough to make passengers forget they're even in a car (Had 3 friends of mine, 1 drives a BMW 7 series, 1 drives a BMW 5 series, the last a Mercedes E-class, all fully loaded - each said they should've bought the Genesis after riding in my G80 ultimate).


This IS a tier A car - just ask the European guys that engineered and designed it, doesn't have the pedigree yet but if you look at unbiased review boards that actually do their homework you'll see Genesis equal to or exceeding its European rivals. Definitely beats all other Asian models.

In my driveway I have a G80 Ultimate and an Audi A6 Prestige. Used to have a BMW 5 series, replaced that with the G80. We Mercedes E-class had a while back, just sold it. Both great cars but consider the mission mid-sized BMW's and Mercedes missions are pretty close. When we want to zip around and feel sporty with some luxury pretentions we take the A6, when we want to feel stately and luxurious with some sporty pretentions we take the G80.

It's funny because that is how our friends and family see it too when driving with us. One other note is I am 6'2", 275 (Yes I go to the gym 4 days a week - friends say I look like retired LB), my wife is 4'10" (I've learned a gentleman never discusses a ladies weight - the hard way). Although both the G80 and the A6 are considered in the same class, my wife finds the G80 a bit too large for her to feel comfortable driving all the time while it feels like the right size for me, whereas the A6 feels like the right size to her, for me the A6 is edging on the smaller side, especially the seats. I am definitely more comfortable in the G80. We both agree the G80 is much more spacious on the inside, fit and finish is equivalent and we've had no issue with the reliability of either (reliability should be a luxury measurand).

So it gets down to what you're looking for in a luxury brand, a persons ego, and what you believe the value of money or image is worth. Be very careful though, prices on Genesis are creeping up and deservedly so. The brand/ego gap is closing much more quickly than many anticipated as is the image gap. If you want to look like and be the smartest person in the room Genesis does that for you plus leaving you with enough left over cash to take you and a few friends to a Michelin star restaurant and a fancy off Broadway (on Broadway if you live in New York) show in your new Genesis and invest the rest in your retirement account or kids college savings account - now that IS luxury.

 

[waveman]

I normally don't write or join forums but thought I'd jump in on this one. First, I believe one point of note that most persons either forgot or don't know is Genesis is basically a European designed and engineered car built in Korea. Yes Genesis pulled a coupe and hired a bunch of engineers and designers from Europe (Audi, BMW, Bentley, Aston Martin, etc) and said build us a car. By the way use our most excellent world engine, give it the fit and finish Europeans cars are noted for and the reliability Asian cars are famous - by the way can you make them real safe too?

End product is Genesis. Doesn't exceed the class in any single thing but is good at everything. One of the quietest, most comfortable in class no matter which one you choose, luxury with hints of sportiness (Don't let the car mag fan boys trick you into thinking all luxury cars must be Le Mans sports/racing cars in suits, just need the ability to avoid/get out of accident when required), ultra safe (Just ask Tiger) and plush enough to make passengers forget they're even in a car (Had 3 friends of mine, 1 drives a BMW 7 series, 1 drives a BMW 5 series, the last a Mercedes E-class, all fully loaded - each said they should've bought the Genesis after riding in my G80 ultimate).


This IS a tier A car - just ask the European guys that engineered and designed it, doesn't have the pedigree yet but if you look at unbiased review boards that actually do their homework you'll see Genesis equal to or exceeding its European rivals. Definitely beats all other Asian models.

In my driveway I have a G80 Ultimate and an Audi A6 Prestige. Used to have a BMW 5 series, replaced that with the G80. We Mercedes E-class had a while back, just sold it. Both great cars but consider the mission mid-sized BMW's and Mercedes missions are pretty close. When we want to zip around and feel sporty with some luxury pretentions we take the A6, when we want to feel stately and luxurious with some sporty pretentions we take the G80.

It's funny because that is how our friends and family see it too when driving with us. One other note is I am 6'2", 275 (Yes I go to the gym 4 days a week - friends say I look like retired LB), my wife is 4'10" (I've learned a gentleman never discusses a ladies weight - the hard way). Although both the G80 and the A6 are considered in the same class, my wife finds the G80 a bit too large for her to feel comfortable driving all the time while it feels like the right size for me, whereas the A6 feels like the right size to her, for me the A6 is edging on the smaller side, especially the seats. I am definitely more comfortable in the G80. We both agree the G80 is much more spacious on the inside, fit and finish is equivalent and we've had no issue with the reliability of either (reliability should be a luxury measurand).

So it gets down to what you're looking for in a luxury brand, a persons ego, and what you believe the value of money or image is worth. Be very careful though, prices on Genesis are creeping up and deservedly so. The brand/ego gap is closing much more quickly than many anticipated as is the image gap. If you want to look like and be the smartest person in the room Genesis does that for you plus leaving you with enough left over cash to take you and a few friends to a Michelin star restaurant and a fancy off Broadway (on Broadway if you live in New York) show in your new Genesis and invest the rest in your retirement account or kids college savings account - now that IS luxury.

I agree with pretty much everything you said. But I'll also add that Genesis' dealers are hurting the brand. I've had my 2017 G90, which I leased from an out-of-state dealer, serviced at a local Hyundai shop for three years. While a separate, better-appointed facility would have been welcome, they've been competent and communicative. Other people here haven't been so fortunate, however.

But I can't say the same for my experience trying to buy or lease a G80 over the past few weeks. I contacted one dealer using their web chat twice and they haven't even bothered to get back to me. Maybe they think web inquiries are less serious, but they're becoming the norm. Are they selling so many cars that they can afford not to follow up every lead? The other dealer has been better, though I clearly know much more about Genesis than the Hyundai salesman I've been working with. (Both advertise themselves as Genesis dealers but don't have separate showrooms.)

As you say, prices are rising. At some point, perhaps soon, the cost savings won't be enough to compensate for poor dealers and after-sale support.

 

[OBO]

I normally don't write or join forums but thought I'd jump in on this one. First, I believe one point of note that most persons either forgot or don't know is Genesis is basically a European designed and engineered car built in Korea. Yes Genesis pulled a coupe and hired a bunch of engineers and designers from Europe (Audi, BMW, Bentley, Aston Martin, etc) and said build us a car. By the way use our most excellent world engine, give it the fit and finish Europeans cars are noted for and the reliability Asian cars are famous - by the way can you make them real safe too?

End product is Genesis. Doesn't exceed the class in any single thing but is good at everything. One of the quietest, most comfortable in class no matter which one you choose, luxury with hints of sportiness (Don't let the car mag fan boys trick you into thinking all luxury cars must be Le Mans sports/racing cars in suits, just need the ability to avoid/get out of accident when required), ultra safe (Just ask Tiger) and plush enough to make passengers forget they're even in a car (Had 3 friends of mine, 1 drives a BMW 7 series, 1 drives a BMW 5 series, the last a Mercedes E-class, all fully loaded - each said they should've bought the Genesis after riding in my G80 ultimate).


This IS a tier A car - just ask the European guys that engineered and designed it, doesn't have the pedigree yet but if you look at unbiased review boards that actually do their homework you'll see Genesis equal to or exceeding its European rivals. Definitely beats all other Asian models.

In my driveway I have a G80 Ultimate and an Audi A6 Prestige. Used to have a BMW 5 series, replaced that with the G80. We Mercedes E-class had a while back, just sold it. Both great cars but consider the mission mid-sized BMW's and Mercedes missions are pretty close. When we want to zip around and feel sporty with some luxury pretentions we take the A6, when we want to feel stately and luxurious with some sporty pretentions we take the G80.

It's funny because that is how our friends and family see it too when driving with us. One other note is I am 6'2", 275 (Yes I go to the gym 4 days a week - friends say I look like retired LB), my wife is 4'10" (I've learned a gentleman never discusses a ladies weight - the hard way). Although both the G80 and the A6 are considered in the same class, my wife finds the G80 a bit too large for her to feel comfortable driving all the time while it feels like the right size for me, whereas the A6 feels like the right size to her, for me the A6 is edging on the smaller side, especially the seats. I am definitely more comfortable in the G80. We both agree the G80 is much more spacious on the inside, fit and finish is equivalent and we've had no issue with the reliability of either (reliability should be a luxury measurand).

So it gets down to what you're looking for in a luxury brand, a persons ego, and what you believe the value of money or image is worth. Be very careful though, prices on Genesis are creeping up and deservedly so. The brand/ego gap is closing much more quickly than many anticipated as is the image gap. If you want to look like and be the smartest person in the room Genesis does that for you plus leaving you with enough left over cash to take you and a few friends to a Michelin star restaurant and a fancy off Broadway (on Broadway if you live in New York) show in your new Genesis and invest the rest in your retirement account or kids college savings account - now that IS luxury.

You raised solid points. The G80 is very unique, beautiful , great value and dependable. Quite surprising your friend thats an owner of a ‘Fully Loaded’ E class depending on which year he has, favors the G80 ultimate you have. Thats a wonderful thing to hear. A fully loaded E class tops an 530i and A6, in my opinion. Seems like they all have an open mind when comes to different vehicles. I driven a BMW 530i (2019-2020) is not smooth or powerful (performance) in comparison to the 3.8 L g80. Handling is better on the 5 series and i do like color ambient trim around the car however its still inferior to the g80 if you truly dissect both cars. Im not sure if the 540i , M550i are different breeds but im sure the g80 sport 3.3 T & the new g80 3.5 T can compete just fine.

What Year is your G80 Ultimate? Is it also the 3.8 L or the 5.0 ?

i truly believe Genesis is an A tier vehicle, you can put in the same class with the Europeans. Most people wouldn’t definitely not agree though. Thats when the open minded comes into play. As you said doesnt lead in class, but is good at everything. I still cant believe my Co-worker said , acura is better than Genesis, i was in disbelief. Acura has never been better than genesis. As I said prestige is really hurting genesis to the point where they are disrespecting the brand and no nothing about, havent even driven one to make a logical judgment.

im curious are you referring to the years of 2015-2021 Genesis line based on your whole point or from 2017 to Current Now ? What model years are you referring to specifically?

i agree Value Value Value.

i still wonder why any of the genesis g80 from 2015- Current doesnt appeal to the younger Men and Women. 20s , 30s whatever you consider on the younger side. I see a grip of them getting the kia stingers, the g70, the Q50s , Bmw 3 series mainly over the Genesis g80. Most particularly the “Kia Stinger” over the g80. Same 3.3 T engine you will find the g80 sport yet they favors the kia looks. So idk ..