Facelift G90 (2020 model year) guess

MyCorvette

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Thread starter #1
There are plenty of spy shots of the mid-cycle update G90 so we have clues about its exterior. Talking about the mechanical aspect:

1. Will the 5.0 V8 be discontinued for US market, or replaced by a higher output version of the 3.3T V6?

I get this feeling because of 2 signs: (a) the upcoming full size GT coupe model, will not come with the V8 option; (b). the upcoming US market 2019 K900 will be 3.3T V6 only, and K900 can be thought as the "mirror" of the G90 (and historically, Equus).

2. Will the current 8AT be replaced with the rumored 10AT?

I know Hyundai has started the 10AT project long time ago, is this project still alive within Hyundai corporate? Auto makers usually will file US patent application for new transmission product, and Hyundai did the same thing for its 8AT. However I cannot find any 10AT patent from Hyundai at this moment.
 

MyCorvette

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I met a Hyundai senior executive in the LA auto show last year, he mentioned Hyundai's future path is on turbocharging and electrification. I asked him whether the naturally aspirated tau V8 will be replaced by a turbo V6, his said this is likely to happen, but he cannot tell me when.

But anyway, price discrepancy between the V6 and V8 trim is too small in the US market, this is not good - those 2 trims are virtually competing with each other now.



I'm inclined to believe that they'll keep the 5.0 around even if the US spec K900 won't offer it; as for the Essentia GT, it's supposed to be a BEV, so no ICE at all.

But yeah, it's about time for the 10 spd AT to make it to production.
 

Goaterguy

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It's rumored that Lexus is working on a twin turbo V8 to compete with the Germans, I don't think Genesis will stay behind. I would expect a 4.4L TT V8 soon (3.3L with two extra cylinders).
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MyCorvette

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The 3.3T is using a 60-degree cylinder bank angle, but a V8 needs 90-degree, so Hyundai cannot reuse the 3.3T design. Need to go from the very beginning, design from scratch.

Without significantly modifying the front engine bay structure (to maintain same/better crash test ratings, proper ventilation for turbo heat etc), adding turbo to the current 5.0L V8 will have packaging issues for the G90. The current 5.0 V8 does not have integrated exhaust manifold, so the turbochargers need to stick out further; also the same for the piping.

It's rumored that Lexus is working on a twin turbo V8 to compete with the Germans, I don't think Genesis will stay behind. I would expect a 4.4L TT V8 soon (3.3L with two extra cylinders).
 
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ShawShank

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#9
I am a proud owner of G90 BUT.... am I the only one whos nervous about the new facelift and tail lamps? I will still love the car regardless but I just don't want them the fail. This next move for them I feel is going to be pivotal. Thoughts?
 

MyCorvette

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Rumors in Korea are that Hyundai already worked on a 5.0 V8 with dual turbo's . Turbos mounted in rear
By the way for V8, turbo should mount in the V-valley (for reverse flow design); or on left-right side of each cylinder bank. The basic principle is to let the length between the exhaust valves and inlet of the turbocharger as short as possible. So I will challenge the validity of the rumor if it says turbos are placed in the back.
 

YEH

Registered Member
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#12
Rumors in Korea are that Hyundai already worked on a 5.0 V8 with dual turbo's . Turbos mounted in rear
Back when the Tau V8 block was still relatively new, there were reports of Hyundai testing a prototype of a super-charged Tau, but the word was that they moved on to turbo-charging.

Going the turbo-charging route, wonder if Hyundai wouldn't go back down to the 4.6L (the Tau can also be stroked up to 5.5L); but maybe not as some H/K models have been having their 3.3L V6 replaced by the 3.5L.
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MyCorvette

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Back when the Tau V8 block was still relatively new, there were reports of Hyundai testing a prototype of a super-charged Tau, but the word was that they moved on to turbo-charging.

Going the turbo-charging route, wonder if Hyundai wouldn't go back down to the 4.6L (the Tau can also be stroked up to 5.5L); but maybe not as some H/K models have been having their 3.3L V6 replaced by the 3.5L.
What can be 100% confirmed is that, around 2008, Hyundai was going to (or already started) develop a magnesium alloy V8 block - because they filed a US patent for it. However I am not sure whether this can be for turbocharging purpose, since magnesium is not strong enough to withstand high charging pressures.

Also, the current tau V8 block is open-deck design, which is unsuitable for turbocharging (for example, BMW N63, MB M176/177/178 all are closed-deck). This means if they want to develop a turbo V8, they need a completely new design. I am not sure whether Hyundai has the capacity to execute so many projects at this moment.
 

Goaterguy

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#14
The 3.3T is using a 60-degree cylinder bank angle, but a V8 needs 90-degree, so Hyundai cannot reuse the 3.3T design. Need to go from the very beginning, design from scratch.

Without significantly modifying the front engine bay structure (to maintain same/better crash test ratings, proper ventilation for turbo heat etc), adding turbo to the current 5.0L V8 will have packaging issues for the G90. The current 5.0 V8 does not have integrated exhaust manifold, so the turbochargers need to stick out further; also the same for the piping.
Good point.
 

Gene2

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#15
Hyundai experimented with a 4.6 liter V8 with a super charger in 2009
https://jalopnik.com/5152215/hyundai-shows-off-460-hp-prototype-supercharged-tau-v8
Then in 2014 they worked with Toca in Chicago to make the 600HP
5.0 turbo and showed it in the Hyundai section of the Los Vegas auto show
Hyundai Genesis gets a 600 hp makeover
and
Hyundai Genesis gets a twin-turbo V8 for SEMA
They only made one to show at a sema show, But did experiment with it
Think maybe it was to expensive to produce at that time and no real market for it
 
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Genesis Motors

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2G Genesis Sedan (2015-2016)
#16
I'm confident that while the Germans are still using V8s for their top models, Genesis Motors will do the same - at least offering the V8 as an option. If they manage to get electrification going sooner than later, however, my opinion on this would change...
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MyCorvette

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For Hyundai, SEMA projects are not "internal" formal project, which is fully sponsored by the corporation and production-bound. Every tuners (OEM and aftermarket) can submit their own proposal/product to Hyundai. If Hyundai thought your project is interesting then you get a display opportunity in the show.

If Hyundai wants to do a production V8T, I think they will go from another approach, use a small displacement V8.



Hyundai experimented with a 4.6 liter V8 with a super charger in 2009
https://jalopnik.com/5152215/hyundai-shows-off-460-hp-prototype-supercharged-tau-v8
Then in 2014 they worked with Toca in Chicago to make the 600HP
5.0 turbo and showed it in the Hyundai section of the Los Vegas auto show
Hyundai Genesis gets a 600 hp makeover
and
Hyundai Genesis gets a twin-turbo V8 for SEMA
They only made one to show at a sema show, But did experiment with it
Think maybe it was to expensive to produce at that time and no real market for it
 

YEH

Registered Member
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#19
What can be 100% confirmed is that, around 2008, Hyundai was going to (or already started) develop a magnesium alloy V8 block - because they filed a US patent for it. However I am not sure whether this can be for turbocharging purpose, since magnesium is not strong enough to withstand high charging pressures.
Another thing that can be confirmed is the supercharged Tau 4.6 prototype.





Had forgotten that Hyundai had shown it at the Chicago Auto Show back in 2009.


Also, the current tau V8 block is open-deck design, which is unsuitable for turbocharging (for example, BMW N63, MB M176/177/178 all are closed-deck). This means if they want to develop a turbo V8, they need a completely new design. I am not sure whether Hyundai has the capacity to execute so many projects at this moment.
There are run-arounds, but yeah, probably not conducive on a cost and manufacturing basis, which is why I have long thought that Hyundai would work on a new smaller displacement (4.0L-4.2L) bi-turbo V8.

Likely wouldn't hear about it for a few years (as you have stated, Hyundai and Genesis have a lot on their table right now), but it's an engine they need.

But Hyundai is going thru the process of updating its engine families - starting w/ the Theta III 4 cylinder (of which the turbo 2.5L is slated as the base engine for the next gen G80).

For its 6 cylinder engine lineup, think Hyundai should switch to an inline design (less expensive to develop and manufacture on scale).

The problem w/ that would be H/K's FWD models which need a 6 cyl.

At this juncture, pretty much just the Grandeur, Cadenza and the upcoming large midsize CUVs, the Palisade and the Telluride; the CUVs look to have room up front for a straight-6 and if the Grandeur and Cadenza don't, that can be addressed for the next gen model (esp. w/ the rumor of the addition of AWD).

The Sorento is currently available w/ the Lambda V6, but likely will be phased out in favor of the new turbo 2.5L Theta III.
 

Rawhide

Registered Member
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6
New Hampshire
Genesis Model Type
1G Genesis Sedan (2009-2014)
#20
For the exterior, I would like to see new rims, modified tail lights (too boring right now) and a classier grill/front end. For the interior, they need to put the cd player put back into the center dash (instead of the glove box) along with removing that weird dead spot to the right of the center screen. Maybe they should look at the latest RR Phantom dash for inspiration. Last but not least, offer a larger V8 (5.7 or larger). It does not have to be a hot running turbo. Too much heat. And never, ever offer a 4 cylinder engine.
 
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