Potential new V8 engine confirmed by Hyundai

Backslack

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This may tie into the rumors of the new G90 retaining a V8, though Genesis itself has not confirmed its existence yet as an "applicable model."

Han Young-hee: There was a talk about building another high-performance engine based on the technology and confidence built up by creating a high-performance World Rally Car engines. In that way, the company completed the advanced development of the eight-cylinder engine, which is as powerful as a supercar. The engine is equipped with the crankshaft and valve seat technology used in the WRC Rally car engine. Internally, however, it has already confirmed that it can make a world-class eight-cylinder engine, but it is putting the application on hold for a while because the development of applicable models has not yet been carried out.

One might wonder why the company uses a lot of time, money, and human resource to develop high-performance multi-cylinder engines in advance, even though there are no models that can be applied immediately. The reason is simple. This is because the timing is late if the engine is developed after the new car project begins. So we made a high-performance engine preemptively with various possibilities in mind.
 
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YEH

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Not worth the investment (won't see the ROI).

Just make some upgrades to the current Tau 5.0 for those buyers who insist on a V8.

Don't need a boosted V8 to take on the Germans as an electric G90 will have better performance.
 

Backslack

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According to the article, they've already developed the new V8. All they're looking now is a model to put it into.

The 5.0 Tau is woefully outdated and dates back to an old Mitsubishi engine. It's not very powerful and the fuel economy is pathetic. It would fail every modern emissions test. I assume the new V8 will probably be a 4.0 liter twin turbo unit like what we see from the Europeans.
 

EdP

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Not worth the investment (won't see the ROI).

Just make some upgrades to the current Tau 5.0 for those buyers who insist on a V8.

Don't need a boosted V8 to take on the Germans as an electric G90 will have better performance.
EPA mileage requirements is a major factor
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YEH

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^ Shouldn't be an issue with the take rate for the V8; plus Genesis will have EV versions of its lineup, in addition to dedicated BEVS, to meet the fleet requirements.

Not saying they won't go ahead, but it's a poor investment.

Cadillac has nowhere to put their Blackwing and it appears that the Lexus FI V8 is on hold, as there really aren't many good options in which to put that motor.
 

Mcc

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The 5.0 Tau is woefully outdated and dates back to an old Mitsubishi engine. It's not very powerful and the fuel economy is pathetic. It would fail every modern emissions test.
I’m not sure I’m understanding. You are saying the 5.0 is outdated. Isn’t the 5.0 Tau in the G90 now? How could it fail every modern emissions test?
 

Backslack

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I’m not sure I’m understanding. You are saying the 5.0 is outdated. Isn’t the 5.0 Tau in the G90 now? How could it fail every modern emissions test?
The G90 5.0 produces 306 g/km in CO2 emissions. By comparison, a more powerful BMW 750i with a twin turbo V8 produces 270 g/km in emissions. The G90 5.0 would "fail" in that it would be taxed at such a ridiculous rate in places like Europe that it would make the car exorbitantly expensive, especially as they tighten emissions standards.

 
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Mcc

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So it doesn’t actually fail any US test. Also I haven’t noticed fuel economy anything close to pathetic and it has plenty of power. Do you have a V8 and are seeing these issues?
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Backslack

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The U.S. didn't even establish greenhouse gas emission standards until 2010. It's still in the middle of implementing the tests in phases.


Even then, the policy hasn't been set in stone. I'm going to avoid the politics, but in the next decade, emissions standards will likely be much more stringent than they currently are.


The Tau V8 dates back to years before these standards were even established.

What is certain is that the Tau V8 will be phased out because of these new standards and the existing ones around the world in places like Europe and China. What Hyundai is probably thinking about right now is whether they ought to even use the new V8, more efficient as it may be, in light of the ever-tightening regulations.
 

carguy75

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According to the article, they've already developed the new V8. All they're looking now is a model to put it into.

The 5.0 Tau is woefully outdated and dates back to an old Mitsubishi engine. It's not very powerful and the fuel economy is pathetic. It would fail every modern emissions test. I assume the new V8 will probably be a 4.0 liter twin turbo unit like what we see from the Europeans.
What? 420Hp from a 5.0 V8 is not powerful? 21 mpg from a 400hp+ engine is pathetic. WOW. It fails every emission test? Harsh considering that it passing my state emission test every year.

I get that the engine is outdated and could use a few tweaks like combination Port/Direct injection like what Toyota uses in their 5.0 V8, but it is not that bad.:)
 
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Backslack

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The Tau V8 was great when it was in the Genesis R-Spec... 8 years ago. Where it produced ten more horsepower than it currently does, with the same fuel economy. But by modern standards, it's either matched or exceeded by the vast majority of modern turbo V6's in performance and fuel economy, including Hyundai's own 3.3TT.

Compare the Tau V8 to something like the BMW 4-liter TT V8 in the 750, which has only 25 more horses than the 5.0 Tau on paper, yet hits 0-60 a full second faster, with marginally better fuel economy, and lower emissions. And this was in 2017, the same year the G90 came out. Now as of 2020, that same engine in the BMW makes over 520 HP, and the fuel economy is improved even further. It's not remotely in the same league.

Genesis isn't Lexus, they're not going to use the same engine for almost 20 years with minimal changes just because some Americans don't care at all for global emission standards. I understand that the smoothness of a naturally aspirated V8 can't be replaced with turbos, but emissions care little for that.
 
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SuperKing

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My issue with a V6 is that it doesn't sound right and not as smooth as an 8. You can solve the smoothness issue by using an I6 instead of a V but it still doesn't sound right for the car. Hyundai/Genesis should be using an I6 anyways if they're not going to offer an 8/10/12 cylinder motor. It'll save a lot of engineering costs. The Germans are going back to I6 motors, even the next Mazda 6 is supposed to be an I6 RWD.
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carguy75

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The Tau V8 was great when it was in the Genesis R-Spec... 8 years ago. Where it produced ten more horsepower than it currently does, with the same fuel economy. But by modern standards, it's either matched or exceeded by the vast majority of modern turbo V6's in performance and fuel economy, including Hyundai's own 3.3TT.

Compare the Tau V8 to something like the BMW 4-liter TT V8 in the 750, which has only 25 more horses than the 5.0 Tau on paper, yet hits 0-60 a full second faster, with marginally better fuel economy, and lower emissions. And this was in 2017, the same year the G90 came out. Now as of 2020, that same engine in the BMW makes over 520 HP, and the fuel economy is improved even further. It's not remotely in the same league.

Genesis isn't Lexus, they're not going to use the same engine for almost 20 years with minimal changes just because some Americans don't care at all for global emission standards. I understand that the smoothness of a naturally aspirated V8 can't be replaced with turbos, but emissions care little for that.
I agree that turbo charged engines are better overall in terms of low end torque, hp, and fuel economy from a smaller displacement engine. My point is that the 5.0 is not under powered nor has pathetic fuel economy. 420hp is not weak. 20mpg from a Naturally Aspirated V8 engine with over 400hp is not pathetic gas mileage.

However, I agree that turbo-charged engines are making larger displacement N/A V8 engines obsolete by providing the same or even better performance from small displacement engines while leaving a smaller carbon foot print.

I just do not agree with your statement about 420hp being weak and that 20 mpg from a V8 engine is pathetic.



What model Genesis do you drive?
 
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carguy75

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The G90 5.0 produces 306 g/km in CO2 emissions. By comparison, a more powerful BMW 750i with a twin turbo V8 produces 270 g/km in emissions. The G90 5.0 would "fail" in that it would be taxed at such a ridiculous rate in places like Europe that it would make the car exorbitantly expensive, especially as they tighten emissions standards.

If the G90 pass emission standards in America; then it does not fail every emission test. The European market will just get the 3.5T model and other less stringent countries will get the V8 as an option.

Do you live in Europe?
 
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Aquineas

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The Tau V8 was great when it was in the Genesis R-Spec... 8 years ago. Where it produced ten more horsepower than it currently does, with the same fuel economy. But by modern standards, it's either matched or exceeded by the vast majority of modern turbo V6's in performance and fuel economy, including Hyundai's own 3.3TT.

Compare the Tau V8 to something like the BMW 4-liter TT V8 in the 750, which has only 25 more horses than the 5.0 Tau on paper, yet hits 0-60 a full second faster, with marginally better fuel economy, and lower emissions. And this was in 2017, the same year the G90 came out. Now as of 2020, that same engine in the BMW makes over 520 HP, and the fuel economy is improved even further. It's not remotely in the same league.

Genesis isn't Lexus, they're not going to use the same engine for almost 20 years with minimal changes just because some Americans don't care at all for global emission standards. I understand that the smoothness of a naturally aspirated V8 can't be replaced with turbos, but emissions care little for that.

Some observations: Please note I've actually owned the Tau 4.6, 5.0 in R-Spec form, as well as in 2015 form. So 3 Hyundai V8s, with more than 200K miles on them total.
  • While the current Tau has less HP than the one from 2012, it actually has more torque. It wasn't de-tuned. It was re-tuned to better align with American driving tendencies, in addition to some internal changes to make it even smoother.
  • The Turbo V6, including the 3.3TT, is not even in the same stadium of the Tau in terms of NVH and refinement (I currently own a G70 3.3).
  • Not only does BMW significantly underrate their engines, they also tune them to survive the two year lease. Hyundai leaves a lot of meat on the bone with their tunes in the interest of reliability of not just the engine but also the transmission, which is one reason why the Stinger and G70s respond so well to JB4 and other aftermarket tunes (for example in stock tune, the 3.3 in the Genesis is right around 10:1 AF ratio, far below the ideal 14.7:1. In fact one of the things the JB4 does is raise that ratio to between 11-12 to 1).
  • BMW V8s have an atrocious reliability record. The Genesis brand cannot survive that kind of reliability.
 
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MyCorvette

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I would not put too much hope on this. Historically speaking within Hyundai/Genesis/Kia, for models that are sharing the same platform/architecture, if it can fit a V8, typically all of those models will offer the V8 option.

The next generation G80/GV80/G90 will be sharing the same architecture (especially most stuff in front of the firewall), so if the next G90 is designed to fit a V8, then there should be a V8 model for the new G80. Obviously this does not happen, so let's wait until next year when more info for the next-gen G90 surfaces.
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YEH

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Would cost Hyundai a little more to brace the engine compartment to support the Tau V8, but that's a lot cheaper than spending the $$ to develop a new smaller displacement V8.

Which would basically just be for NA market (and maybe the Middle East), with buyers being split between the V8, 3.5TT and the (presumably) BEV.
 

Bourbonncigars

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Speaking as objectively as possible (I have a Tau V8), I'd take a larger NA engine over a smaller turbo. One less link in the chain to have a fault. Though that wouldn't sway me from purchasing a turbo V6 in the future if the rest of the car was enough to make me want it. Genesis's turbo V6 has only been out since 2017 (right?). IMO that's hasn't been long enough to determine long term reliability.
 

MyCorvette

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Would cost Hyundai a little more to brace the engine compartment to support the Tau V8, but that's a lot cheaper than spending the $$ to develop a new smaller displacement V8.

Which would basically just be for NA market (and maybe the Middle East), with buyers being split between the V8, 3.5TT and the (presumably) BEV.

There is still a sizable market in US for a V8 G80. For the new G80 architecture, if it could (with some reasonable modifications), I am curious why Genesis did not offer it.
 

EdP

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There is still a sizable market in US for a V8 G80. For the new G80 architecture, if it could (with some reasonable modifications), I am curious why Genesis did not offer it.
Unfortunately, market size and desirability are not factors in EPA regulations.
 
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