Radar Detectors

[SoCalGen]

UPDATE:


I just ordered the V1 "Grand Touring Pack" and remote display off the Valentine site. I also ordered a rear view mirror mount off Amazon. All should be arriving in the next week or two. These were my reasons for the choice of the V1 over the Max or other Escort product.

The Escort Live app means nothing to me. Escort refuses to release stats on how many people actually use the app which requires expensive add-ons and a subscription to even use. I'm sure whatever the number is WAZE dwarfs it since it's FREE more people are likely to use it. WAZE has already saved me from one ticket. (a cop using laser under a shady overpass)

In addition to this I want maximum protection NOT in the city of Los Angeles where I'm usually in rush hour traffic going with the flow and not standing out but when I'm out on a run in the desert between LA and Vegas or Palm Springs. Here is where I think the V1 will shine. Also, since I live in California I can turn X Band off which will eliminate a lot of false alarms from the V1 right off the bat. Also, since I bought the touring pack I can "auto mute" alarms, real or false under a certain MPH that I determine. (probably around 30mph)

Also, the V1 is upgradeable. With the Max if technology changes 3 or 5 years from now Escort will tell you to buy a new one. With the V1 I can upgrade the internals for a fee. Plus the V1 is still king of laser sensitivity which although with laser you're kinda hosed with a direct hit any little bit of scatter I might pick up from a car in front of me would be most beneficial.

I'm sure the Max is an amazing detector but it just doesn't seem like the one for me. I've owned Escort products before and know they make great stuff but I really felt the V1 is the right choice for me.

I'm going to mount the remote display down where the ashtray normally goes and leave the little sliding door open at night. I figure in a dark car anything that lights up down there will grab my attention right away. Also in the event of being pulled over I can close the door and quickly release the V1 from the rear view mirror and put it in the center console. That's the plan anyway.

I'm taking a trip to Vegas next month with some friends in a BMW car club (buddy has a newer M3) and I'm sure it's not going to be like the fast and furious but there could be some high speed desert driving at some point.

 

[Aquineas]

Well I picked up an Escort Max2 for my new car, and also upgraded my V1 to the very latest V1 hardware and have now had a few days to compare them, side-by-side, one on either side of my rear-view-mirror. I am running the V1 in Advanced Logic mode and the Max2 operating in Auto-NoX mode, taking advantage of both detectors ability to weed out false alarms to the best of their respective ability.

Based on what others are claiming, I expected a slam-dunk victory for the Max2, and that's simply not what I'm seeing. I carry a little pad with me in my center console to keep score of which one is alerting me first and on what band. In terms of which one notifies me first on Ka band, the V1 is winning so far, but not as convincingly as it did vs the 9500ix. On approximately 64 percent of the valid Ka alerts that I've encountered, the V1 has alerted me first. I want to stress that the V1 does not win 100 percent of the time. The Max2 has alerted me first 36 percent of the time, including one troubling instance when it was a direct instant-on hit that the Max2 told me about a full half-second before the V1 (my fault for lingering in the passing lane. No ticket or pullover, but the police officer could have if he/she wanted to).

Consistent with some others are saying (and very different than my initial comparison a couple of years ago), the latest V1 definitely gives me more false alarms on K-band than the Max2.

I also tried Waze in conjunction with the V1, and if the V1 was integrated directly with Waze, it would be far superior combo than the Max2 and Escort Live due to more information that is provided. You don't just get information on cops, you get information on accidents, construction, etc. The big drawback obviously is that the Waze is not actually integrated with the V1.

One other thing that I mentioned before is the mount on the Max2, while being completely different than the one that was on my 9500ix, still makes a crapload of racket in the car. Aside from the cost of Escort Live and the lack of directional arrows, that's my only real complaint about the Max2. When I'm driving with a quiet car, the only thing making a racket in the car is the Max2 bracket. I have not yet figured out a way to use spongies on the Max2 mount to prevent this, hopefully I will.

Please note that I'm not claiming to have special insider information; I don't have an agenda or a preference for one or the other, and I'm not on a first name basis with Mike Valentine. I'm just a guy that bought them both and is giving first-hand observations about them.

It's a very tough call to choose between the two. The Max is lacking the directional arrows, and despite how much they've been downplayed by others here, the arrows are a really big deal. I can't stress enough how valuable the arrows are when it comes to telling you not just where that LEO is, but what they're doing. For example, if you pass a LEO who's stationary or going the other direction, the arrows in conjunction with signal strength reveal whether that LEO is now on the move and is now heading in the same direction that you are.

On the other hand, real-world intelligence from other drivers has the potential to be be just as valuable (please note that this is heavily dependent on participation). No detector is going to protect you against laser, but if someone got a positive laser alert 10 minutes ago, the Max can let you know and give you ample opportunity to adjust your speed before getting nailed. The participation on Escort Live has definitely gotten better in the Houston Metropolitan area, but now that I've had a chance to see Waze, it seems like Waze has higher participation.

Honestly I wouldn't want to do without either one of these valuable pieces of information (the arrows or the intelligence from other drivers). You really can't go wrong with either of these.

What I intend to do is take a look at the V1 API and see how hard it is to integrate with (and it doesn't look that difficult). The challenge seems to come from the Waze API; at first glance, it's not immediately obvious how to report an incident via the Waze API.

 

[SoCalGen]

I also tried Waze in conjunction with the V1, and if the V1 was integrated directly with Waze, it would be far superior combo than the Max2 and Escort Live due to more information that is provided. You don't just get information on cops, you get information on accidents, construction, etc. The big drawback obviously is that the Waze is not actually integrated with the V1.

It is somewhat of a drawback but not a huge one. I have my iPhone 6+ running waze with a dashboard mount to the right of the steering wheel. It's a great location to keep my eyes on the road without being distracted by the app while still getting information from the app. Bluetooth audio running through the genesis is also nice. For crowd sourcing information I don't think Escort can hold a candle to Waze.

Of course you could always run BOTH but this would require a device running Waze then an Escort with Escort Live running on another device which just seems too complicated as you'd have to hotspot one phone to the other and I don't want the cabin of my car looking like the cab of a semi truck with equipment mounted everywhere.

 

[CtK]

Keep us updated on your V1. I have my V1 suction cupid to the center bottom of windshield. I did not get many false positives. My unit is 4 yrs old and has not been updated yet. Nor can I use my android phone to monitor arrows. I want to hardwire it with remote monitor so it is dark no lights.

Just got my V1 back from Valentine, no more false alarm from my car. Will test it more tomorrow on my way to work.

 

[JBoogie]

What about Stalker radar? Has anyone tested to see which one can detect Stalker better?

 

[DRS]

In Indiana, K band has come back for use by the cops big time. Brand new tech... And they get sneaky in running by K band door openers and such. The Max tells them apart from the K band doors. If one insists on bypassing the GPS and auto DSP filtering on the Max, the frequency counter for each transmitter confirms what is cop verses false. V1, upgraded, is still a mess in K hand door openers and such. Plus with the GPS built in on the Max, it tracks the exact frequency and location for the false transmitters. Yet it shows the real K band coppers.

I find the integration of the detector with the Live app as a distinct advantage over WAZE. Shows on the phone display the automatic report, band, frequency, RANGE of alert radius, and age of the alert. Being automatic reporting by the device itself, defeats the ability of coppers doing "noise insertion". Meaning they use WAZE app, and place tons of false alarms, just to the fun of making WAZE useless in areas. The Escort auto reporting also makes it easy for drivers. No touching the phone.

I find massive subscription users all in the Midwest on rural, and interstate. Plus local. No shortage of detectors reporting live radar or laser. Traveled on business put west in the Dakotas, and other very open interstates, finding other users of Live having their detector and them checking in with sittings and alerts.

Michael Valentine has gone from radical transformative leader in his ecosystem, to being like any large conglomerate, slow for the ship to turn, disruptive ideas and products are a thing of the past. Too bad. They gave Escort a wide open door for years to pass them. Had he been 30 years younger with the mindset he and Jim Jaeger had back then, he would have wiped the Escort out before they came out with their slow march of progress (GPS, best practice range, app, feature) that ran way past the V1.

Imagine a V1 with a app that used the 360 degree capability. To determine if the cop was moving, stationary, or what direction... Taking in all the raw detector data 360 degrees, then network/integrate that data with multiple V1 reporting, would be information on where they coppers were, going, and what mood of extortion methods they were using with their radar units.

But no... Too easy to get into his Porsche every evening and dive home. Michael defends what used to be... Instead of driving the whole market, and creating disrupting innovation that made him famous.

 

[SoCalGen]

I find the integration of the detector with the Live app as a distinct advantage over WAZE. Shows on the phone display the automatic report, band, frequency, RANGE of alert radius, and age of the alert. Being automatic reporting by the device itself, defeats the ability of coppers doing "noise insertion". Meaning they use WAZE app, and place tons of false alarms, just to the fun of making WAZE useless in areas. The Escort auto reporting also makes it easy for drivers. No touching the phone.

I find massive subscription users all in the Midwest on rural, and interstate. Plus local. No shortage of detectors reporting live radar or laser. Traveled on business put west in the Dakotas, and other very open interstates, finding other users of Live having their detector and them checking in with sittings and alerts.

How "massive" is "massive" in your book? Does Escort show the number of nearby users?

Sitting here at my office in the San Fernando Valley of Los Angeles I have 41,046 WAZE users reported nearby. To be fair I don't know the radius of what they consider "nearby". But I doubt 41,046 people in the whole of Los Angeles county even own Escort detectors with the Live subscription. Now if the user of WAZE is passive then they might as well not count if they're not contributing. This is where I can see a nod given to Escort Live if the reporting is autonomous. I really like the no touching the phone thing Escort did but I really don't think it would take MUCH for the V1 to do the same. The brains as I understand it for escort live are not in the unit itself but in the $99 smart cord you have to buy and the subscription service. I'm sure V1 could come out with something similar if they wanted to and maybe they will. Woulda coulda shoulda I know, but it is a possibility.

Also, WAZE is smart. If a cop with a smartphone wants to be a jerk and post a "police reported ahead" alert in an area where there isn't a cop all it takes is a few WAZE drivers going by and clicking "not there" on the screen as they pass and the alert goes away. I think most cops have better things to do with their time. I don't know for SURE but I would imagine if a WAZE user habitually reports things that other WAZE users are saying "not there" then I would assume after awhile WAZE would consider that user discredited and not post their alerts. Don't forget Google bought WAZE awhile back and they have the brains to keep improving this app.

A disadvantage for WAZE AND Escort Live is that it relies on the cell phones data connection. When I get way out in the desert on road trips cell phone data is spotty at best. Out there it's just you and your detector and my understanding is the V1 is still the king of the open road.

So again, for me who rarely even has the opportunity to speed in Los Angeles traffic it's almost silly to even buy a detector. I've lived here going on 5 years and only once have I had a cop come up behind me and run my plates. Another time I got a finger wag from a motorcycle cop who saw me get out of the carpool lane quickly (when I saw him first) while I was riding solo. He put his lights on pulled up next to my drivers door, looked at me. I waved and he gave me a disapproving look with a smile and took off. I think he was impressed I spotted him first, or maybe he just wanted to get a closer look at the Genesis One of my strangest encounters with a LEO.

I'm a gadget guy and love having protection when needed. I don't regret the V1. I will post again after I've used it a month or two and if I get any hits on it while on my desert road trip.

I'm also considering getting a CB which although antiquated, truckers still communicate where the bears are on a regular basis which is probably better than WAZE OR Escort Live. Now.... how do I get a discrete but high range CB antenna on the genesis? lol

 

[amartz]

in the San Fernando Valley of Los Angeles I have 41,046 WAZE users reported nearby. To be fair I don't know the radius of what they consider "nearby".

I'm a Waze beta tester, and I asked that question also. The answer I got was it's the "metropolitan area", so the radius varies depending on the size of the metropolitan area.

Also, WAZE is smart. If a cop with a smartphone wants to be a jerk and post a "police reported ahead" alert in an area where there isn't a cop all it takes is a few WAZE drivers going by and clicking "not there" on the screen as they pass and the alert goes away.

+1

 

[Aquineas]

<snip>I really like the no touching the phone thing Escort did but I really don't think it would take MUCH for the V1 to do the same. The brains as I understand it for escort live are not in the unit itself but in the $99 smart cord you have to buy and the subscription service. I'm sure V1 could come out with something similar if they wanted to and maybe they will. Woulda coulda shoulda I know, but it is a possibility.

In my initial examination, it would seem the limitation is with the Waze's REST-based API. As far as I can tell, Waze doesn't publish the REST calls to add events. Maybe it's undocumented and still possible, but I'm sure any updates would require a user token and token management (auth/auth) and is also something that is currently not published. That being said, I bet it's all available and the REST api is how their client application communicates back with the home servers, so there may be a way to reverse engineer things.

With regards to your CB, I can promise you you'll be one of the first, if not the first, Genesis owner with a CB. Breaker-breaker 19!

 

[SoCalGen]

In my initial examination, it would seem the limitation is with the Waze's REST-based API. As far as I can tell, Waze doesn't publish the REST calls to add events. Maybe it's undocumented and still possible, but I'm sure any updates would require a user token and token management (auth/auth) and is also something that is currently not published. That being said, I bet it's all available and the REST api is how their client application communicates back with the home servers, so there may be a way to reverse engineer things.

With regards to your CB, I can promise you you'll be one of the first, if not the first, Genesis owner with a CB. Breaker-breaker 19!

LOL I probably wont do the CB thing. I WOULD if I could maybe mount it in the center console and have a really good hidden antenna. But I don't want some huge whip antenna on my trunk lol

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[GEN760]

Forgot to say, I also just mounted mine to the rear view mirror, using the blend mount, and the mirror tap leads. Use the micro size leads, 8" long wire, works perfect. Took ten minutes after researching here and learning that pink is hot, black is ground.

Dave99GT - Could you provide some additional detail as to how you accessed the power source at the rear view mirror? I have the blend mount but I'm not sure of the best route to take as far as hard wiring my detector (V-1). Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide.

 

[DRS]

How "massive" is "massive" in your book? Does Escort show the number of nearby users?



Sitting here at my office in the San Fernando Valley of Los Angeles I have 41,046 WAZE users reported nearby. To be fair I don't know the radius of what they consider "nearby". But I doubt 41,046 people in the whole of Los Angeles county even own Escort detectors with the Live subscription. Now if the user of WAZE is passive then they might as well not count if they're not contributing. This is where I can see a nod given to Escort Live if the reporting is autonomous. I really like the no touching the phone thing Escort did but I really don't think it would take MUCH for the V1 to do the same. The brains as I understand it for escort live are not in the unit itself but in the $99 smart cord you have to buy and the subscription service. I'm sure V1 could come out with something similar if they wanted to and maybe they will. Woulda coulda shoulda I know, but it is a possibility.



Also, WAZE is smart. If a cop with a smartphone wants to be a jerk and post a "police reported ahead" alert in an area where there isn't a cop all it takes is a few WAZE drivers going by and clicking "not there" on the screen as they pass and the alert goes away. I think most cops have better things to do with their time. I don't know for SURE but I would imagine if a WAZE user habitually reports things that other WAZE users are saying "not there" then I would assume after awhile WAZE would consider that user discredited and not post their alerts. Don't forget Google bought WAZE awhile back and they have the brains to keep improving this app.



A disadvantage for WAZE AND Escort Live is that it relies on the cell phones data connection. When I get way out in the desert on road trips cell phone data is spotty at best. Out there it's just you and your detector and my understanding is the V1 is still the king of the open road.



So again, for me who rarely even has the opportunity to speed in Los Angeles traffic it's almost silly to even buy a detector. I've lived here going on 5 years and only once have I had a cop come up behind me and run my plates. Another time I got a finger wag from a motorcycle cop who saw me get out of the carpool lane quickly (when I saw him first) while I was riding solo. He put his lights on pulled up next to my drivers door, looked at me. I waved and he gave me a disapproving look with a smile and took off. I think he was impressed I spotted him first, or maybe he just wanted to get a closer look at the Genesis One of my strangest encounters with a LEO.



I'm a gadget guy and love having protection when needed. I don't regret the V1. I will post again after I've used it a month or two and if I get any hits on it while on my desert road trip.



I'm also considering getting a CB which although antiquated, truckers still communicate where the bears are on a regular basis which is probably better than WAZE OR Escort Live. Now.... how do I get a discrete but high range CB antenna on the genesis? lol

Escort say they track with each radar detecter reported spots. As a example, beside a fake report from a cop, in motion cops reported manually, can be figured out quicker so the alert either is ended on display or turn yellow. So, as others go by that spot, the person who reported the sighting is validated or not. any patterns of abuse, they may take action on that subscriber. Like cutting them off.

Also, over time, radar detecter automated reports and manual reports at a same location will eventually flag that location as a system wide speed trap. They measure the RF frequency, and other various factors reported by the units.

The Max 2 does not require the smart cord with the Bluetooth. The live interconnection from the smart app, via Bluetooth are connected internally directly to the radar detector.

I have been a V1 user, serial number 2312, since the early 90s. And know it back and forward. Literally thousands of hours logged. It is a good device, and used to be the best for decades. For now, the more, but not perfect, comprehensive system is the Max.

Is is a massive user base. As I said prior, on trips into the far reaches (even the Dakotas), radar units and their owners are both reporting findings where I experience nothing missed, 24/7.

Michael Valentine and his crew (especially if he is able to get back some of his geniuses back that have long since left) are perfectly capable of splattering Escort, or anyone else with an new revolutionary product. Well, not sure he has the energy, or humbleness to repeat history. I hope he does get some energy and humbleness, and designs another revolution. Or hand the torch to someone internally who will.

One other thing... The Escort ZR3 laser jammer, according to my buddies, works amazing. And integrates into the Max. What reminded me of this was a amazing warning last night I got on laser. Such a long distance, I thought is was a false. Bur it was not. Almost a mile away (flat), on busy interstate, a in the dark copper was zapping many cars. The scatter alerted my Max better than I have seen with the V1. But, the V1 is very good on laser. Point is, saved my bacon on laser. Now, may need to get the shifter installed for extra protection.

 

[DRS]

Ok.... I will post a pic of the 2012 Genny (not the 2015) with a Wilson 1000 on the trunk, wiring run run through the pass through in the arm rest. Connected to a SSB RCI 100W 10-11M radio. Yes, 11M (Children's Band, CB) works... No place to put the radio. Serious, from what I experience in past couple years CB is gone way down hill. Just about worthless for cop reporting.

 

[powerslide]

Dave99GT - Could you provide some additional detail as to how you accessed the power source at the rear view mirror? I have the blend mount but I'm not sure of the best route to take as far as hard wiring my detector (V-1). Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide.

I wanted to keep things simple so I ordered a invisicord (invisicord.com). Be sure to get the "micro" version found under Nissan/Infiniti. Worth every penny.
The black plastic housing behind the rear view mirror pops off. The wiring harness can be disconnected and tapped into. The hot wire goes in with the gray wire as it is switched with the ignition. The ground is the black wire in the middle. The red wire on the opposite side of the gray wire is also 12V, but it is constantly on, causing you to manually turn your detector on and off so use the gray one. I'm very happy with the install. Looks very clean.

 

[GEN760]

Thanks for the feedback

 

[GEN760]

I wanted to keep things simple so I ordered a invisicord (invisicord.com). Be sure to get the "micro" version found under Nissan/Infiniti. Worth every penny.
The black plastic housing behind the rear view mirror pops off. The wiring harness can be disconnected and tapped into. View attachment 5378 The hot wire goes in with the gray wire as it is switched with the ignition. The ground is the black wire in the middle. The red wire on the opposite side of the gray wire is also 12V, but it is constantly on, causing you to manually turn your detector on and off so use the gray one. I'm very happy with the install. Looks very clean. View attachment 5379

Thanks for the feedback

 

[Aquineas]

Just an update that I thought would be noteworthy. I'm not sure if it's the fact that I'm running my V1 in Advanced Logic Mode or not, but it has not been unheard of for the Max2 to detect Pop Ka band radar that the V1 doesn't register.

 

[DRS]

^^^ kewl. Did not know that. Unless you are being funny and taking a swipe (deserved) at Escort Corp for their magical "feature" to turn off pop to make their older 8500 series quicker to respond in certain bands. And that it caused more false alarms. They "assured" me that does not app,y today. Seems to be true. Pop is turned on my Multiple Max. I ran for years in full logic mode and seemed like never had a problem with POP on V1.

 

[Aquineas]

Nope, no swipes; just honest observation. It happened again today; Max2 detects Pop and the V1 is quiet. Now I haven't been able to confirm whether it's legit or not; usually I'm not able to find the LEO in question. But it's Ka so that increases the legitimacy.

 

[DRS]

Very cool. Hope it is not a false alarm. I suggest maybe catching the exact frequency on smart meter and call Escort. The 8500s were notorious for falling on pop. I had one with pop turned on. V1 silent, false from 8500.. Back in those days, pop was used a bunch. And pop false alarms came from other cheap ass radar detectors. Cobras and others. I got rid of the 8500 quick. I liked its "custom" blue LED special edition. Fell for that. In the meantime, V1 came out with updates to make KA, super wideband and pop top of the heap, again.

Telling you all this in case your Max2 is showing falses.. I have my multiple Max units with pop turned on recently and noticed more alerts that are likely false.