A Big Hole in the "Bumper to Bumper" Warranty

[JimInNashville]

Had a 2010 Genesis Sedan, moved to Canada and got a 2015 HTRAC 3.8.

I drove down to Palm Desert from Vancouver, Canada. Had a massive electronic failure. Ten different warning messages, speedometer dead, tach dead, power steering stiff, backup camera nonfunctional. Dealer started troubleshooting on Thursday September 22. Tore the car apart, put it back together and now it is September 29, and there is absolutely no change in the status of the car.

Stranded, and running out of medications, and 1200 miles from home, I called Hyundai's "Customer Relations Help Line". I asked how long I would have to wait before they confessed they could not fix the car and "took ownership of my problem." The reply is that there is no known limit. I suggested that simple logic and corporate decency would suggest otherwise, but the "customer relations" person (Vanna) stonewalled. Asked for a supervisor, and she refused, saying that SHE would review my case with a supervisor and I may be contacted within 48 hours!!

It turns out my 5 year bumper to bumper warranty has a hole in it big enough to drive a Mack Truck through. I am paying $1000 for a rental vehicle to drive back to Vancouver and complete my vacation road trip.

 

[Huddleston]

I'm sorry to hear this. Sounds like Hyundai really needs to step up on this one.

 

[PMCErnie]

Good luck. Keep in mind that the 5/60,000 warranty is not a bumper-to-bumper warranty, but rather a "new vehicle limited warranty." You are also likely entitled to 3 nights in a hotel and meals reimbursement.

 

[JimInNashville]

Good luck. Keep in mind that the 5/60,000 warranty is not a bumper-to-bumper warranty, but rather a "new vehicle limited warranty." You are also likely entitled to 3 nights in a hotel and meals reimbursement.

Ernie, all warranties are limited. The point is, when the warranty specifies that Hyundai will take responsiblity for repairing a defect, there should be an implied "reasonable" time limit. If there is no time limit, then the warranty is worthless, as nobody can wait many weeks to have a disabled vehicle repaired.

Several days have gone by since my post, and my 2015 Hyundai Genesis 3.8 HTRAC remains in the Hyundai of La Quinta shop in Palm Desert. I have been without my vehicle for 12 days, at considerable cost to me.

 

[PMCErnie]

Which car maker provides the warranty that you seek?

 

[JimInNashville]

As should be obvious to you by now (because it is the whole point of the discussion), one only knows what the "warranty" is when one has a difficult problem. I had a discussion with a Ford owner today who, in similar circumstances, was given a new car (with an upgraded engine!) by Ford.
So, I would say that (based on my experiences so far), Ford provides the warranty that I seek.

Ernie, what would *you* consider a reasonable limit on the waiting time for repair of a brand new Genesis that has self-destructed? 14 days? a month? a year?

Oh, and I forgot to mention. The trunk lid also doesn't work, and the promised "48 hour response" from Vanna's supervisor in Hyundai customer relations never occurred.

 

[PMCErnie]

I don't worry too much about it since my auto insurance provides for extended car rental in such situations. Guessing yours does not.

 

[brfatal]

I understand you're stressed because you're far from home, but the 6 days you're complaining about is nothing. Not even remotely close to an extended period of time. Cars can spend months in shops for repairs (in worst case scenarios). You are being incredibly unreasonable on the time involved.

Again, I understand the concern about the expense, but keep in mind it's only because of your circumstances of traveling far from home.

 

[JimInNashville]

I understand you're stressed because you're far from home, but the 6 days you're complaining about is nothing. Not even remotely close to an extended period of time. Cars can spend months in shops for repairs (in worst case scenarios). You are being incredibly unreasonable on the time involved.

Again, I understand the concern about the expense, but keep in mind it's only because of your circumstances of traveling far from home.

Let me get this straight --- you are suggesting that when a new vehicle has a massive failure without being in a crash or flood, the purchaser should, if it is a Hyundai, consider several months in the shop "reasonable"?

 

[JimInNashville]

I don't worry too much about it since my auto insurance provides for extended car rental in such situations. Guessing yours does not.

I didn't ask you about your insurance. I asked what length of time you would consider reasonable.

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[PMCErnie]

What's the latest update?

 

[blkgenRspec]

Jim im sorry to hear about whats going on. First of all I do side with you, the fact you had to come out of pocket for a rent a car is redic. Your car malfunctioned under warranty, this happened to me a few time. The dealer has always provided a loaner at no cost to me. I would be pissed at the ordeal to say the least. Yes your out of town which make things worst, but the is basically a brand new car that we are talking about. Limited information from your dealer. Honestly I would go to your local dealer ask for the service manager. Keep record of your talks with everyone involved along with how long your vehicle has been in the shop. Ask for the vice presidents information if needed. If they don't supply it to you, its available on the bbb website. My sister had a Toyota matrix she bought, that would break down. literally shut down on the highway. It was at the dealer atleast once a week for about 2 months. Finally I took my sister back to the dealership, demanded to speak with the dealership owner, all he was able to do was keep trying to find the problem and give out loaners. After 3 weeks in the shop we contacted a lawyer and wrote a letter to the vice president of Toyota America, along with an email. We received a phone called within a week. My sister got a full refund on all the money she spent on ownership for almost a full year(including her down payment). Its not easy but you need to stay firm and on their ass about it..

 

[JimInNashville]

What's the latest update?

23 days and counting. No fix. Hyundai has deflected all my requests for a loaner vehicle. The new "hypothesis" is that replacing the entire dash cluster will fix the problem. That part has to be specially ordered from Korea, and the ETA of the part is 1 week, with another several days to effect a repair. I have told them that I doubt this will work, because there are symptoms that are apparently unrelated to the dash cluster (such as the trunk lid will not operate).

Yesterday I asked "Customer Relations" from Hyundai Canada "what amount of time would be considered reasonable to repair a vehicle disabled by a manufacturer defect, and not a collision?" I have asked this question several times, and Hyundai refuses to answer. The Customer Relations people assure me that they have forwarded my requests for a loaner vehicle to higher-ups, but I have received no response. Moreover, Hyundai has failed to assure me that they will ship my car back to me (from 1200 miles away) if/when they repair it.

Canada does not have well-defined lemon laws. There is an arbitration procedure at which one can file for a "buy-back."

I will continue to seek help. If your Hyundai is disabled by a massive electronic failure, (a) Hyundai may not be able to fix it, even within a month, and (b) you will receive no personal assistance from Hyundai.

I have lots of resources, financial and personal. I paid cash for my car. But imagine for a moment that I had scrimped and saved and actually *needed* my vehicle for daily work. Hyundai's approach to "warranty protection" would place me in a position of suffering significant personal damages.

The situation is outrageous -- there is no other word for it.

 

[JimInNashville]

Jim im sorry to hear about whats going on. First of all I do side with you, the fact you had to come out of pocket for a rent a car is redic. Your car malfunctioned under warranty, this happened to me a few time. The dealer has always provided a loaner at no cost to me. I would be pissed at the ordeal to say the least. Yes your out of town which make things worst, but the is basically a brand new car that we are talking about. Limited information from your dealer. Honestly I would go to your local dealer ask for the service manager. Keep record of your talks with everyone involved along with how long your vehicle has been in the shop. Ask for the vice presidents information if needed. If they don't supply it to you, its available on the bbb website. My sister had a Toyota matrix she bought, that would break down. literally shut down on the highway. It was at the dealer atleast once a week for about 2 months. Finally I took my sister back to the dealership, demanded to speak with the dealership owner, all he was able to do was keep trying to find the problem and give out loaners. After 3 weeks in the shop we contacted a lawyer and wrote a letter to the vice president of Toyota America, along with an email. We received a phone called within a week. My sister got a full refund on all the money she spent on ownership for almost a full year(including her down payment). Its not easy but you need to stay firm and on their ass about it..

Thanks for your advice and help. Very much appreciated. 23 days and counting, no resolution, and no help (see nearby post for details).

 

[brfatal]

Let me get this straight --- you are suggesting that when a new vehicle has a massive failure without being in a crash or flood, the purchaser should, if it is a Hyundai, consider several months in the shop "reasonable"?

Several months, no. My reservation was that your original complaint was that a couple of days in the shop was unreasonable, and it's absolutely not.

 

[JimInNashville]

31 days and counting. Hyundai has offered me no alternative transportation. If this were the U.S., I might be able to demand a new car via the Lemon Laws, but Canada has no such consumer protections.

 

[JimInNashville]

44 days and counting....Hyundai's latest "fix" failed to work, and they are now preparing to ship the car back to Canada and resume "fixing" it. It will be out of commission for more than 50 days before they resume "repairs."

Is this not ridiculous?

 

[Focusin]

44 days and counting....Hyundai's latest "fix" failed to work, and they are now preparing to ship the car back to Canada and resume "fixing" it. It will be out of commission for more than 50 days before they resume "repairs."

Is this not ridiculous?

Unfortunately, buying a car these days is somewhat of a lottery. A certain number of vehicles are going to suffer these massive kinds of failures given the complexity of the electronics. This is to be expected, you simply hope you're not the one it happens to.

What's not to be expected is the slow response from the manufacturer. If you stand behind your product, then be prepared to act when unique situations like this arise. Common sense and decency would suggest that if an individual is stranded 1200 miles from home, in a new vehicle they purchased from you, a certain priority should be place on the file. The offer of a loaner vehicle would be a start.

Hyundai is attempting to break into the luxury car market, this is not the way to do it. And this is not the only instance I've read of Hyundai Corp being difficult to deal with.

Every successful politician knows the time to shine is when a crisis arises. Public Relations 101. Turn a negative into a positive.

 

[JimInNashville]

48 days and counting. Hyundai is now abandoning repair efforts at the present U.S. dealership and towing it to another location.

Thanks for your comments -- I absolutely agree. It is now clear to me that Hyundai has some systematic problems that run through the entire organization. The most obvious ones are:

(1) A "monolevel" approach to customer service relations, that isolates all problems at a single level. Clearly, a situation like mine should merit qualitatively different treatment from a 3 day delay caused by a mistaken parts order. But Hyundai Canada has never, not once, reached out to me to express sympathy. Hyundai isolates your complaint to a single "Customer Relations" person. You cannot protest, and you have no recourse. This person has your file, and that is that. For 35 days, I requested a loaner vehicle and was told that they "were considering it." Finally, the local dealer GM furnished me with a nice loaner (not a Genesis). So I was without a vehicle for 5 weeks, and Hyundai did not care.

(2) Poor levels of "distributed expertise" throughout the organization. I have been to several Hyundai dealers who have proven utterly incompetent even at the most basic repairs. These include (a) inflating 4 new tires tires to 42, 39, 35, 32 pounds, (b) leaving the engine cover unattached (hanging loose inside the engine compartment) at the end of an oil change (this was done twice), (c) installing a cowl incorretly, so that it was hanging loose above the windshield (thus allowing rain to run directly into the engine compartment). If you buy a Hyundai, be prepared for this kind of thing.

(3) Failure to place representatives in a position to answer technical questions about the vehicle. Many of us remember just how incredibly difficult it was to find out which of two figures for the amount of oil in the crankcase was actually the correct one for the 2009-2010 Genesis. Hyundai had (at least) two numbers floating around in its documentation.

(4) Failure to answer emails or return calls as promised. Numerous times (and I have phone recordings to prove it) Hyundai has failed even the most basic laws of courtesy. They do not answer emails, and do not follow through on promises to return calls.

Hyundai makes excellent vehicles for the price. I have been a Hyundai fan, and have supported them in numerous public forums. But their outrageous treatment of me has me rethinking my position.

Unfortunately, buying a car these days is somewhat of a lottery. A certain number of vehicles are going to suffer these massive kinds of failures given the complexity of the electronics. This is to be expected, you simply hope you're not the one it happens to.

What's not to be expected is the slow response from the manufacturer. If you stand behind your product, then be prepared to act when unique situations like this arise. Common sense and decency would suggest that if an individual is stranded 1200 miles from home, in a new vehicle they purchased from you, a certain priority should be place on the file. The offer of a loaner vehicle would be a start.

Hyundai is attempting to break into the luxury car market, this is not the way to do it. And this is not the only instance I've read of Hyundai Corp being difficult to deal with.

Every successful politician knows the time to shine is when a crisis arises. Public Relations 101. Turn a negative into a positive.

 

[dbx]

I pay close attention to posts/threads like this that, have articulate complaints, by obviously, intelligent people who have met with such frustration. I hope that your situation is worked out fairly, but I already know what bad taste will remain with you, even if the situation is somehow righted.

I love my car (2013 GC), but am cost conscious enough at age 57, that I will not await a failure like this to happen. Secondly, even though I coddle this turbo engine (starting/warm-up, etc..), I know that it hasn't a chance in hell of lasting as long as my daily driver (2000 Honda Accord LX), which has been FLAWLESS.

Bottom line: I will enjoy the fun of a great little car for another few months or so, and then.....I will buy the car I was probably destined to drive; a new Honda. The funny part? The actual track time (0-60 & 1/4 mile) are pretty damned negligible, lol. At least, at my age. I'm all about quality, not flash. And yes, this 2013 GC is a great driving car. Great! I'm just not going to succumb to such as the OP here, and I vote with my wallet.