Turbo Lag.....zzzzzzzzzz

[PFWiz]

Well we now have 600 miles on our 2020 G80 Sport and today for the first time I decided to punch it from a standing start. To say that the results were a bit underwhelming would be huge understatement. It was several seconds (possibly as many as 4 or 5) before the car deciding to move with any authority. For a second or two I was wondering if something was wrong, but I guess that is all the 3.3 can deliver in a 4600 lb car until the turbos spool up.

As a comparison my last 2 cars were both Chevrolet SSs with GM's 6.2 liter LS3 and transmission lifted right out of the 2013 Corvette. Out of the box they could break 13 seconds in the quarter and were limited to 160. The 2016 (I just got rid of) had a ROTO FAB cold air intake with a full custom dyno 93 octane ECU tune including a HARD transmission tune. While I never tracked her others with the same rig were closing in on mid 12s. If I turned off most of the nannies by putting her in track mode and punched it the results were somewhat different than what the G80 did. The rear tires would light up (this is not how one got low etas) and the car would drift a little sideways. Just as the tires started to hook up the car would BANG into second and light the tires up all over again. This time the tires would hook up fairly quickly and car would leap forward and then BANG in to third. Most days the rears would give nice little chirp when this happened. After that it was all over, third gear was money in an SS.

I am not saying I hate the G80. It is hugely more luxurious and the electronics are at least a full generation ahead of those in the SS. The G80 is a handsome car and our friends who have ridden in the back seat say they like the G80's ride much better. The G80 stereo blows the SS stereo out of the water. But all this still leaves me with one question. How do I raise the G80 straight line performance the maximum amount for a reasonable amount of money while still saving any possibility of maintaining the warranty/ I knew all tricks for my SS, but I need some schooling in Genesis performance.

One more note - The transmission behavior when in Sport mode is retarded. Put the G80 in sport mode, stomp on the gas from a standing start up to 50 and then coast back down. The trans will sit at 5000 rpm for a ridiculously long amount of time. Personally I thought it was embarrassing. I was blipping the throttle and trying to figure out how to get it go up a gear or 2.

 

[Acpantera]

For best launch, turn off the traction and stab control, just like your SS hold the traction button till both shut off as noted on dash, brake torque rpms just over 2500, side step brake, push go pedal steady to the floor. My G80 is awd, so it never breaks loose, it just scoots.
For added pep, I installed a RaceChip tuner and upgraded the spark plugs, this wakes up the 3.3 quite a bit, nearly 60 hp and 110 torques. I have measured many 4.5 seconds 0-60 times.
As for the tranny, sport mode is meant for spirited driving, not just snappy shifts, I like sport mode when filtering through traffic, engine breaking is your friend and dipping back into the throttle is instant(no lag) and the shift paddles over ride auto. The 8spd tranny is far better than the 6spd hydramatic in the SS, took me awhile to get used to it, but i can hustle the big sedan to do what ever is needed. I have run a few LS3's and have done well, surprising a few SS's, GTO's, G8's and C6 vette's.
Practice your spirited driving, it will reward you.

 

[Ernie3647]

If the delay is as long as you say consider there could be something off as on this engine max torque is achieved at very low RPM. Though my car might be lighter then a G80 response is certainly not a problem in any mode with everything on.

 

[RCH04]

If the lag is 4-5 seconds. You should take the car in and get it checked. Granted the G80 is a bit porky but it makes its peak torque at 1,300 rpm and it should spool up faster than that.

 

[PFWiz]

Ok I admit I may have exaggerated a bit. But 1 or 2 seconds would be close to the truth.....

 

[carljr101]

Ok I admit I may have exaggerated a bit. But 1 or 2 seconds would be close to the truth.....

Yeah that’s a huge exaggeration, but I completely get what you were trying to say. The G80 Sport is still a lovely car and a good purchase.

 

[PMCErnie]

Yes, much too huge an exaggeration!

NEVER floor the pedal. Increase pedal pressure gradually.

 

[PFWiz]

Yes, much too huge an exaggeration!

NEVER floor the pedal. Increase pedal pressure gradually.

Compared to the instantaneous response when stomping on the gas pedal of my SS it actually does not seem like all that much exaggeration.
Why should I increase pedal pressure gradually? The idea is to accelerate as fast as possible....

 

[Ernie3647]

Compared to the instantaneous response when stomping on the gas pedal of my SS it actually does not seem like all that much exaggeration.
Why should I increase pedal pressure gradually? The idea is to accelerate as fast as possible....

Yeh I know takes me back to that old saying...there's no substitute for cubes

 

[PMCErnie]

PFWIZ, your G80 is not a Holden, or a Corvette. Did you test drive one before you bought it?

______________________________

Help support this site so it can continue supporting you!

 

[PFWiz]

PFWIZ, your G80 is not a Holden, or a Corvette. Did you test drive one before you bought it?

Of course we drove it. What a silly question. Maybe you but $60,000 cars without a test drive, but I would never consider doing that.. What I did not do was come to a full stop on one of the very busy streets near the dealer and then floor it from a full stop. For some reason many dealers frown on it when do something like that to the new, not broken in car... Go figure..... Hopefully no one did that to our car before we got it.

Next question, why are you such a fan boy that no one can complain about an obvious short coming in the car. Yeah I understand that most turbo cars suffer from turbo lag, but after 20 years without a turbo, I must say it shocked me. Lets face the truth, unless you stand on the brakes and spool up the turbos first, the car is a pig for the first couple of seconds. That doesn't mean I don't like our G80. I am not saying that out G80 isn't almost exactly what my wife wanted (it does not have a Cadillac emblem ). It is luxurious, reasonably fast (once the turbos are spooled up), handles reasonably well, has a good stereo, the voice actuation works great, it large enough for 4 adults, also it is quite handsome and I haven't even mentioned the AWD (not a bad thing in your wife's daily driver when you live just outside Cleveland).

My point is that just because overall I like the car does not mean I can't bitch about some aspects.

 

[Kraig Wilkinson]

Of course we drove it. What a silly question. Maybe you but $60,000 cars without a test drive, but I would never consider doing that.. What I did not do was come to a full stop on one of the very busy streets near the dealer and then floor it from a full stop. For some reason many dealers frown on it when do something like that to the new, not broken in car... Go figure..... Hopefully no one did that to our car before we got it.

Next question, why are you such a fan boy that no one can complain about an obvious short coming in the car. Yeah I understand that most turbo cars suffer from turbo lag, but after 20 years without a turbo, I must say it shocked me. Lets face the truth, unless you stand on the brakes and spool up the turbos first, the car is a pig for the first couple of seconds. That doesn't mean I don't like our G80. I am not saying that out G80 isn't almost exactly what my wife wanted (it does not have a Cadillac emblem ). It is luxurious, reasonably fast (once the turbos are spooled up), handles reasonably well, has a good stereo, the voice actuation works great, it large enough for 4 adults, also it is quite handsome and I haven't even mentioned the AWD (not a bad thing in your wife's daily driver when you live just outside Cleveland).

My point is that just because overall I like the car does not mean I can't bitch about some aspects.

It might get better after break in , as you had mentioned. I was going to do The 3.3TT , but decided on a 5.0. I am happy I did . Push the pedal and go. Good luck with your new ride..

 

[PMCErnie]

Of course we drove it. What a silly question. Maybe you but $60,000 cars without a test drive, but I would never consider doing that.. What I did not do was come to a full stop on one of the very busy streets near the dealer and then floor it from a full stop. For some reason many dealers frown on it when do something like that to the new, not broken in car... Go figure..... Hopefully no one did that to our car before we got it.

Next question, why are you such a fan boy that no one can complain about an obvious short coming in the car. Yeah I understand that most turbo cars suffer from turbo lag, but after 20 years without a turbo, I must say it shocked me. Lets face the truth, unless you stand on the brakes and spool up the turbos first, the car is a pig for the first couple of seconds. That doesn't mean I don't like our G80. I am not saying that out G80 isn't almost exactly what my wife wanted (it does not have a Cadillac emblem ). It is luxurious, reasonably fast (once the turbos are spooled up), handles reasonably well, has a good stereo, the voice actuation works great, it large enough for 4 adults, also it is quite handsome and I haven't even mentioned the AWD (not a bad thing in your wife's daily driver when you live just outside Cleveland).

My point is that just because overall I like the car does not mean I can't bitch about some aspects.

I’m not a fan boy, as you say, just a realist. You began this thread with a clear exaggeration in terms of the your “lag time” experience. When I told you the best way to prevent lag you scoffed. Recommend you drop by your dealer and confirm that your performance is either fixable, or normal. Then you can get on with life.

 

[RCH04]

Some manfacturers do better than others when it comes to mitigating turbo lag. As more and more vehicles offer turbos things should get a bit better but there will always some type of lag to get used to. I've read about electric turbos that spool up instantly but don't know much about them or if they are being used in anything.

 

[Ernie3647]

Of course we drove it. What a silly question. Maybe you but $60,000 cars without a test drive, but I would never consider doing that.. What I did not do was come to a full stop on one of the very busy streets near the dealer and then floor it from a full stop. For some reason many dealers frown on it when do something like that to the new, not broken in car... Go figure..... Hopefully no one did that to our car before we got it.

Next question, why are you such a fan boy that no one can complain about an obvious short coming in the car. Yeah I understand that most turbo cars suffer from turbo lag, but after 20 years without a turbo, I must say it shocked me. Lets face the truth, unless you stand on the brakes and spool up the turbos first, the car is a pig for the first couple of seconds. That doesn't mean I don't like our G80. I am not saying that out G80 isn't almost exactly what my wife wanted (it does not have a Cadillac emblem ). It is luxurious, reasonably fast (once the turbos are spooled up), handles reasonably well, has a good stereo, the voice actuation works great, it large enough for 4 adults, also it is quite handsome and I haven't even mentioned the AWD (not a bad thing in your wife's daily driver when you live just outside Cleveland).

My point is that just because overall I like the car does not mean I can't bitch about some aspects.

I quite understand your view. I’ve had a couple of high grunt V8s in my time so I understand the razor like response you speak of. While my G70 I’m sure would ultimately give those cars a good run and maybe best one or both it is for all intents and purposes a sign of the new norm and they are getting better especially with the new generation of electric turbos on the way. You might consider starting a new thread on “Things I don’t like about the G80” as much as I don’t like the thread of the same nature on the G70 I do respect their opinions and I find it informative. Don’t let criticisms diminish your opinion of what is a really nice car. Drive it and enjoy it.

 

[PFWiz]

I’m not a fan boy, as you say, just a realist. You began this thread with a clear exaggeration in terms of the your “lag time” experience. When I told you the best way to prevent lag you scoffed. Recommend you drop by your dealer and confirm that your performance is either fixable, or normal. Then you can get on with life.

Compared to the SS I actually exaggerated only a little... But since you have never exaggerated anything in your entire life (see what I did there?) you would not understand that the amount of exaggeration for a given statement depends on the angle you are viewing the subject from....

 

[Acpantera]

Some manfacturers do better than others when it comes to mitigating turbo lag. As more and more vehicles offer turbos things should get a bit better but there will always some type of lag to get used to. I've read about electric turbos that spool up instantly but don't know much about them or if they are being used in anything.

F1 cars have electric assist turbos to eliminate lag, probably in the near future for production engines.

 

[PMCErnie]

Compared to the SS I actually exaggerated only a little... But since you have never exaggerated anything in your entire life (see what I did there?) you would not understand that the amount of exaggeration for a given statement depends on the angle you are viewing the subject from....

The Holden SS was offered here by Chevy for only 4 years (‘14-‘18). It didn’t sell. That’s no exaggeration.

Gradual gas pedal pressure (not stomping) is your cure, if you are willing to learn. Otherwise you will be in agony each day as you pine for your (olden) Holden.

 

[PFWiz]

The Holden SS was offered here by Chevy for only 4 years (‘14-‘18). It didn’t sell. That’s no exaggeration.

Gradual gas pedal pressure (not stomping) is your cure, if you are willing to learn. Otherwise you will be in agony each day as you pine for your (olden) Holden.

Every single SS that was built was sold the year it was built. There were no left overs. In 2014 most dealer's got an allotment of 1 SS. I bought the first SS sold in Ohio. It still had the plastic wrap on it because it had been delivered the evening before. While I was doing the paperwork 2 other people came in the dealership to try to buy the car. If you are going to make a statement try checking your facts first.

First the SS were made for 4 years as you said, but that would be 14,15,16 and 17. There were no 18s. I had both a 14 and and a 16. You are correct that relatively few of them were made (approx 12600) over those 4 years, but that was because GM did not want to sell them. How many SS commercials did you ever see? The answer would most likely be none. There was actually 1 SS commercial made that was shown twice during the first Nascar race in which the SS raced. There were no others. Every time Chevy had an advertisement that showed every Chevy car and truck in the background, there was no SS. Chevy only sold the SS because because they were forced to due to a deal signed by Bob Lutz. Once Lutz was gone GM started trying to kill off Holden and Chevy honored the absolute minimum amount of the bargain they could get away with. They never even tried to sell the Ute.
Now that they are no longer produced a low mileage, manual SS goes for 90% of its original selling price because folks are desperate to get them.

Next this absolute stupidity about gradual gas pedal pressure yielding lower ETAs rather than stomping on the gas pedal is just silly. You may not feel the turbo lag as much if you do it, but the car most certainly won't accelerate faster. Or are you trying say that gentle pedal pressure is the unknown secret of drag strips? Maybe gentle pressure is the reason performance companies sell pedal tuners? You stomp and the gas and they gradually give the car gas so it will accelerate faster? The only thing that yields a lower ETA than stomping on the gas pedal by itself is to power brake the car up to about 1500 - 2500 (depending on the car / engine) and then release the brake and stomp on the gas pedal. Either way you are still stomping on the gas.

 

[PMCErnie]

Every single SS that was built was sold the year it was built. There were no left overs. In 2014 most dealer's got an allotment of 1 SS. I bought the first SS sold in Ohio. It still had the plastic wrap on it because it had been delivered the evening before. While I was doing the paperwork 2 other people came in the dealership to try to buy the car. If you are going to make a statement try checking your facts first.

First the SS were made for 4 years as you said, but that would be 14,15,16 and 17. There were no 18s. I had both a 14 and and a 16. You are correct that relatively few of them were made (approx 12600) over those 4 years, but that was because GM did not want to sell them. How many SS commercials did you ever see? The answer would most likely be none. There was actually 1 SS commercial made that was shown twice during the first Nascar race in which the SS raced. There were no others. Every time Chevy had an advertisement that showed every Chevy car and truck in the background, there was no SS. Chevy only sold the SS because because they were forced to due to a deal signed by Bob Lutz. Once Lutz was gone GM started trying to kill off Holden and Chevy honored the absolute minimum amount of the bargain they could get away with. They never even tried to sell the Ute.
Now that they are no longer produced a low mileage, manual SS goes for 90% of its original selling price because folks are desperate to get them.

Next this absolute stupidity about gradual gas pedal pressure yielding lower ETAs rather than stomping on the gas pedal is just silly. You may not feel the turbo lag as much if you do it, but the car most certainly won't accelerate faster. Or are you trying say that gentle pedal pressure is the unknown secret of drag strips? Maybe gentle pressure is the reason performance companies sell pedal tuners? You stomp and the gas and they gradually give the car gas so it will accelerate faster? The only thing that yields a lower ETA than stomping on the gas pedal by itself is to power brake the car up to about 1500 - 2500 (depending on the car / engine) and then release the brake and stomp on the gas pedal. Either way you are still stomping on the gas.

Oh, I get it. GM didn’t want to sell a vehicle.

You seem to be fixated on high speed. I’m fixated on smooth operation, plus less bitching about what might have been.

As I’ve said, apply gradual pressure to da pedal.