Lexus Ls 400~460 owners

[Jon@VB]

When I first drove my friend's Lexus 400, I was stunned.

It was powerful and yet so quiet and so smooth...

I started the car but the engine was so darn quiet, I thought the engine was still off.

So I turned the key again and came "squeeeek" - Oh how I felt so bad ...


Almost 20 years later, I got same excitement from Genesis.

Lexus 400 was about $40K 20 years ago. But amazingly, Genesis is still the same price. (today's $40K would be worth about $25K back then)


My wife drives ES 350. I must say Genesis is much better than 350 and compares more to LS 400s

If you had LS 400, 430, 460 or driven one of them extensively, could you compare them with Genesis?

TIA

Salute to Hyundai - from Pony (Excel) to Genesis !

 

[Jon@VB]

I know it's not fair to compare LS 460 to Genesis. (Yea, yea, You can buy 2 Genesis for the price of one LS 460.)

Yes, LS 460 has better detials and probably higher qualties overall, but does it worth to pay $40K more?


Having said that, here is my take on Genesis and LS 400s :

I don't care much about interior details or trims.

But here are two things that bothers me the most -

1. Genesis transmission is too rough (jerkey) as a luxury sedan.

2. I can feel pretty good vibration of engine from the steering wheel.
(I feel more vibration from Genesis than original Lexus 400, which was 20 years ago technogy )


I really want to see Hyundai to improve these two things in future models.


As I mentioned before, I'm in love with Genesis; absolutely the best value in luxury line - that's why I'm giivng my 2 cents here...
To see it gets better next year and the year after...

 

[Sonata2009]

How long have you had your Genesis? Usually, any shift roughness will go away as the transmission "learns" your driving habits. This may take a month or more, depending how much, and how you drive.

 

[Jon@VB]

About 1000 miles on it now.

Yea, I heard that, too.... that it goes away after a month or so.

But why can't Hyundai make it right from the beginning?

Not sure if the low speed jerking is anything to do with "learning" dirvier's habit.

I will be pretty mad if it doesn't go away after a month of driving...

 

[DanTheMan]

About 1000 miles on it now.

Yea, I heard that, too.... that it goes away after a month or so.

But why can't Hyundai make it right from the beginning?

Not sure if the low speed jerking is anything to do with "learning" dirvier's habit.

I will be pretty mad if it doesn't go away after a month of driving...

Yeah, I agree w/Sonata's comments above...I've had mine for several months now and I can't hardly tell if it ever actually shifts gears! I have to work at it to get the sensation of shifting. As for making it right from the beginning....since so many possible drivers (and related 'styles' of driving) are at issue, how could they? I'm assuming you mean "making it right" as to mean "make it like I (each of us) wants it." Doesn't sound very feasible.

 

[Samifumi]

My family purchased an LS400 back in 1989. At the time, it was a great value with great features compared to its competition of Audi, BMW, and Mercedes (Infiniti was also trying to break through at the same time). Relative to that car, which we considered a GREAT value, the Genesis is an INCREDIBLE value. But it comes at a cost: the dealership experience at the Hyundai dealership is NOTHING compared to the Lexus dealership experience. Our dealership experience with the Hyundai has been abysmal, and now we know where Hyundai cut the corners. But to be honest, the Lexus dealership experience hasnt been so great the last few times we visited a Lexus dealer. I don't mind cutting the corners on that part of the purchase since I spend so little time at the dealership.

With regards to the drive experience, the difference between the LS and the Genesis is the Lexus will have a softer ride than the Genesis. Hyundai seemed to try to bridge the gap between the dead ride of the Lexus and the sportier drive of a BMW.

 

[Jon@VB]

<I can't hardly tell if it ever actually shifts gears!>

Dan, do you have V6? I think V6 has different transmission.
I notice more with V8 than V6.

Was it smooth from the beginning?

---

Sam, thanks for your input. I guess we both share the same feel about value of Genesis.

My dealership experience wasn't that bad... I was out the door with my car in less than an hour.
After all I am marrying to Genesis not the dealership. (Dealership is like in laws, less you have to visit, better it is...)

I suggested few recommendations to the dealership though:

1. At least set up a small room for Genesis customers equiped with Genesis streo system. (It would be a great selling point too)

2. Provide Starbucks coffee or soda

3. Provide expensive feel key chain (they gave the key to me on cheap steel ring)


I sure hope Genesis will be next Lexus and beat them in 5 years. Go Hyundai !

 

[ConceptVBS]

About 1000 miles on it now.

Yea, I heard that, too.... that it goes away after a month or so.

But why can't Hyundai make it right from the beginning?

Not sure if the low speed jerking is anything to do with "learning" dirvier's habit.

I will be pretty mad if it doesn't go away after a month of driving...

Because every driver is different. It's called "fuzzy logic" transmission. It adapts to the drivers input over a set period of time. A computer needs a set pattern to adapt and to verify the new settings is right for you. This doesnt just apply to Hyundai, it applies to ALL "Fuzzy logic" transmissions on the market today.

 

[Jon@VB]

Is that right?

Wow, Never thought a transmission can learn and adopt from my driving behavior.

Guess I'm way behind today's technology.

Thanks for that "fuzzy" info.


(I drove like crazy few times... hmmm how will my transmission react to this. Would it traumatize or hurt her feeling?)

 

[ConceptVBS]

(I drove like crazy few times... hmmm how will my transmission react to this. Would it traumatize or hurt her feeling?)

A few times wont make a difference. However, if you do that on a consistent basis, then the transmission settings will change with you. The transmissions on modern cars are all electronically controlled.

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[chuman]

How long have you had your Genesis? Usually, any shift roughness will go away as the transmission "learns" your driving habits. This may take a month or more, depending how much, and how you drive.

I've had mine for 3K miles and the shift roughness is still there. It causes a herky jerky acceleration and it typically doesn't happen on a pure straightaway, more when I'm actually starting a turn. It doesn't bother me now that I know its there, but occasionally it does catch me off guard.
Chuman

 

[jwaters943]

About 1000 miles on it now.

Yea, I heard that, too.... that it goes away after a month or so.

But why can't Hyundai make it right from the beginning?

Not sure if the low speed jerking is anything to do with "learning" dirvier's habit.

I will be pretty mad if it doesn't go away after a month of driving...

1) No car is perfect, even Lexus
2) The V6 model utilizes an Aisin-built transmission found on several Lexus models. The V8 gets an equally-good ZF-built unit that is found on several Audi/BMW vehicles.
3) Maybe there is something wrong with you car

...back to #1, may I present the following:
http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=375728&highlight=transmission

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=336500&highlight=transmission+shift

http://www.clublexus.com/forums/showthread.php?t=318128&highlight=transmission+shift

 

[loch rob]

I've had mine for 3K miles and the shift roughness is still there. It causes a herky jerky acceleration and it typically doesn't happen on a pure straightaway, more when I'm actually starting a turn. It doesn't bother me now that I know its there, but occasionally it does catch me off guard.
Chuman

There should be a way at the dealer to reset the computer that is analyzing your driving habits for transmission shifting. It might help to go through the "learning" period again.

Cheers.

 

[vishnus11]

Surprising to read some of the comments on here - some folks really need to open their eyes. Some thoughts:

A. Driven the LS460L very extensively (owned by good friend). Have put about 3000 miles on Genesis so far. Both cars drive extremely similarly, and in some areas the interior of the Genesis is more "rich" than that in the Lexus. Swathes of leather on the dash instead of boring (albeit soft touch) plastics for example, give the Genesis a surprising edge.

From a driving perspective, both cars seem to drive equally to, but the Genesis feels like the more athletic of the pair. Ride wise, its hard to find any discernable differences - both are supremely smooth, and unruffled by bumps and pockmarked pavement.

In short, both the LS460 and Genesis are EXTREMELY comparable (price aside). When you factor in price....well....the only reasons I can see someone choosing an LS460L apart from subjective styling reasons are (see B and C)

B. Starbucks is fantastic, as are panera, plasma tvs, and what not other fancy goodness my local Lexus and other luxo car dealers sport. But when I take my Bimmer in for service, I don't bother hanging around to watch TV and drink starbucks - I usually drop the damn thing off and head to work either in a loaner or via courtesy ride. In short, whilst some of these "perks" look good on paper, in real life many folks could care less.

C. Service and Reliability: this is one area where the Genesis is an unproven quantity against the brilliant service record of the LS series, but Hyundai's giving their product a brilliant warranty so I have no reason to doubt them.

CONCLUSION: I and many others, whilst appreciating starbucks, fancy keyrings, and salespeople who brownose like no tomorrow, ultimately care about the end result - the vehicle. In this sense, the Genesis is comparable and in my honest opinion superior in certain ways to the LS460.

The 40k I save will buy me plenty of mochas, frappachinos, and key rings.

 

[DanTheMan]

<I can't hardly tell if it ever actually shifts gears!>

Dan, do you have V6? I think V6 has different transmission.
I notice more with V8 than V6.

Was it smooth from the beginning?

Yes, I have a V6. It is the Aisin tranny. It was smooth from the beginning--keep in mind that's a 'relative' impression. It was smooth to my likings. It did change a bit as time went on (have 5K miles on it). Those changes made it smoother--if possible.

Dan

 

[Jon@VB]

V11, are you in car sales?

If not, you should get into it.
You would be a great salesman !

 

[Jon@VB]

thank jw943 for Lexus info.

i guess you are right, no car is perfect.
hmm good to know even the mighty LS460 has glitches on down shift...

On yesterday's drive i didn't notice any big jerky feel from the transmission. Maybe her period is over? ^^

 

[Jon@VB]

Dan, that's what I thought.

when i test drove v6, i didn't notice that jerking feel that much. (only slightly)

Let's wait and see, how it unfolds...

so far these are the ones i think Genesis could improve or modify in the future. (for my taste anyway)

1. steering wheel - at parking, should be easy to handle and turn. (getting used to it now though)

2. transmission - smoother transition from first to second to third.

3. paint - some of the black color Genesis has noticeable "orange peel" paintings.

4. iphone not being able to connect to the speaker (support only ipod - iphone is getting more popular...)

5. minor changes... how about coin tray instead of ash tray?

 

[Jon@VB]

chuman,

good to hear someone else is having the same problem. (not that i am happy to see this problem...)

at least i know few others are going through similar situation.

(perhaps the smart transmission is "training" me to get use to the feel ? gg )

 

[darammer]

I have not driven the LS460 but my step mom owns one... and I let my dad drive my 3.8 the other day for a while... he said that there really is no difference between the way the two drive... at least not $40K worth.

Personally, my dealership experience has been fantastic and I dont need starbucks to entice me to choose a car. I usually dont stay at the dealership anyways... I will either go to work via a courtesy shuttle, or utilize the loaner car.