And still we await the Genesis SUV/CUV line

[Mark_888]

That story has a ring of familiarity to it! As with a lot of ancient tales, if people keep repeating them over and over they think that will somehow make themtrue. And others who don’t know any better will take them as fact.

So you don't think that it is a fact that Genesis executives said they will eventually have a SUV when the Genesis Brand was first announced a couple of years ago?

Do you not believe that it will happen?

 

[Mcc]

So you don't think that it is a fact that Genesis executives said they will eventually have a SUV when the Genesis Brand was first announced a couple of years ago?

Do you not believe that it will happen?

I do believe that they didn’t officially announce it even though some say they had. Whatever executives said has now been repeated and filtered by those repeating it that I can’t really tell what was in fact said.

I guess it will happen but I do know that bemoaning the that it has not happened yet will not make it happen any sooner. But maybe will make some feel better. If it is therapeutic for you then hang in there.

 

[joneillnj]

It wasn't (and still hasn't been) officially "announced." It was told by Hyundai/Genesis executives to members of the automotive press and reported that the Genesis brand would eventually include some SUV's. That seems rather obvious that a brand like Genesis would have at least one SUV (and probably more than one), given that brands like Acura, Lexus, Infiniti, etc, have the majority of sales in the SUV category. Even the new Bentley SUV is their best selling model.

If you were to go back two years on this forum, you could probably find some discussion about two Genesis brand SUV's eventually being part of the product line.

...or take 5 seconds to use Google to get a sense of their plans:

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1104042_genesis-product-roadmap-leaked

 

[Mcc]

...or take 5 seconds to use Google to get a sense of their plans:

https://www.motorauthority.com/news/1104042_genesis-product-roadmap-leaked

So you believe anything that is leaked? Maybe or maybe they changed their mind. But It doesn’t add any validity to the claim that it was announced about two years ago.

 

[Mark_888]

I do believe that they didn’t officially announce it even though some say they had. Whatever executives said has now been repeated and filtered by those repeating it that I can’t really tell what was in fact said.

I guess it will happen but I do know that bemoaning the that it has not happened yet will not make it happen any sooner. But maybe will make some feel better. If it is therapeutic for you then hang in there.

As I said, it is a fact that Genesis executives told the press when the Genesis USA brand was created about two years ago that there would be SUV's in their future lineup. This was reported in the automotive press and repeated on this forum, especially by members such as YEH. It was not originally an official announcement of the availability of a specific vehicle, but an indication of what they said they would doing for future vehicles. Along the way, over the past two years, there have been more details released, but not an official announcement. Those are the facts. Keep in mind that they don't officially "announce" a specific vehicle until it ready for an auto show, and soon thereafter available at dealers. The term "announce" or "announcement" can have different meanings depending on the context.

There are a lot of people who are interested in the future of Genesis Motors, and who think they would have a better chance of surviving as a separate brand, with dedicated dealerships, if they had some SUV's to sell, since those ate the majority of styles being sold today by their competitors such as a Acura, Lexus, and many others. Those are some of the kinds of things that are discussed on forums like this. I don't think there is anything unusual or improper about such discussions.

 

[Mcc]

Great. We agree. There has been no official announcement.

 

[Mark_888]

So you believe anything that is leaked? Maybe or maybe they changed their mind. But It doesn’t add any validity to the claim that it was announced about two years ago.

You are really stuck on the word "announced."

If someone at Genesis Motors said two years ago that they intend to build some SUV's that will be available in 3-4 years, is that an announcement of a vehicle, or is it an announcement of ongoing plans and work to build them?

Over the past two years, the plans have become more clear and defined as to what is coming, but still no official announcement of a vehicle, which is not normally made until it very close to availability.

- - - Updated - - -

Great. We agree. There has been no official announcement.

There have been announcements by Genesis Motors execs that they are working on SUV's, with more an more specifics available over time. But they don't make an official announcements of a specific vehicle (with details of trim levels, general price range, pics (or actual test drives to automotive press) until a few months before it will be available in showrooms.

 

[Mcc]

I was simply pointing out that if someone is going to complain that it was announced more than two years ago you have to take into account how it was announced. Not officially but by leaks or maybe speaking to the press or however it is claimed to be done. They could have officially announced their intent to build an SUV in a certain time frame but they evidently chose not to.

It may be late to the market or it may be exactly where is should be on their roadmap. That is a different discussion. Entertaining none the less.

 

[Mark_888]

I was simply pointing out that if someone is going to complain that it was announced more than two years ago you have to take into account how it was announced. Not officially but by leaks or maybe speaking to the press or however it is claimed to be done. They could have officially announced their intent to build an SUV in a certain time frame but they evidently chose not to.

It may be late to the market or it may be exactly where is should be on their roadmap. That is a different discussion. Entertaining none the less.

If you had followed the discussion the last two years (or even more recently), the delay was not because of lack of commitment or lack of decision on the part of Genesis Motors, but a desire to build the SUV's from the ground up on a RWD platform (even if only offered with AWD), instead of a FWD platform like Santa Fe, Tucson, and all the other SUV's from Hyundai and/or Kia.

Part of the discussion was whether it was wise to delay having even a single SUV, by insisting on a brand new platform, rather than basing it on a Santa Fe (as Lexus and Acura do with their best selling SUV's based on a Highlander or Pilot, etc with FWD).

There was never any debate about whether they would do it, only a debate about how long it would take to build one from scratch, and how that might affect the rollout (or at least the profitability) of dedicated Genesis Motors dealerships in the USA.

 

[joneillnj]

So you believe anything that is leaked? Maybe or maybe they changed their mind. But It doesn’t add any validity to the claim that it was announced about two years ago.

Well, as the leak was an internal roadmap from 2 years ago that included 2 SUV's, I do think it pretty much shows what was planned - why are you hung up on needing a formal announcement when it is pretty obvious they are working on SUV's, but are clearly delayed for some reason?

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[Mcc]

If you had followed the discussion the last two years (or even more recently), the delay was not because of lack of commitment or lack of decision on the part of Genesis Motors, but a desire to build the SUV's from the ground up on a RWD platform (even if only offered with AWD), instead of a FWD platform like Santa Fe, Tucson, and all the other SUV's from Hyundai and/or Kia.

Part of the discussion was whether it was wise to delay having even a single SUV, by insisting on a brand new platform, rather than basing it on a Santa Fe (as Lexus and Acura do with their best selling SUV's based on a Highlander or Pilot, etc with FWD).

There was never any debate about whether they would do it, only a debate about how long it would take to build one from scratch, and how that might affect the rollout (or at least the profitability) of dedicated Genesis Motors dealerships in the USA.

I haveno idea who you are talking to. Since you quoted me let me say that my only point was that the the SUV was not "officially" announced about two years ago and saying it was announced just confuses the issue. Two years from now someone will go back and point out that it was announced not understanding the context which the word was used and take it as fact.

Your rant about the timeless or details of the production must be directed as someone else as if there is anyone anywhere on this forum that has not heard that rant before. However as I said, if it is therapeutic for you to continually rehad the issue, please carry on. Meaningless to me. Not my point.

 

[Mark_888]

Well, as the leak was an internal roadmap from 2 years ago that included 2 SUV's, I do think it pretty much shows what was planned - why are you hung up on needing a formal announcement when it is pretty obvious they are working on SUV's, but are clearly delayed for some reason?

Because he is on a personal vendetta to try and discredit everything I post, by making ridiculous demands of proof. This vendetta goes way back to my comments about his post on the need to have an automatic door closer on a G90 in another thread.

 

[Mcc]

Because he is on a personal vendetta to try and discredit everything I post, by making ridiculous demands of proof. This vendetta goes way back to my comments about his post on the need to have an automatic door closer on a G90 in another thread.

Vendetta is ridiculous. You are not worth that and I have better things to do. As I have said before when I read something presented as a fact that does not make sense, I point it out. That’s all. If folks need to go through all sorts of contortions, name calling and subject changes to try and justify it, I think that usually speaks for itself.

 

[Mark_888]

As I have said before when I read something presented as a fact that does not make sense, I point it out. That’s all.

Why doesn't it make sense to have two SUV's (at least) in the Genesis product lineup?

And what was said about that is a fact, whether it makes sense to you or not.

 

[joneillnj]

Vendetta is ridiculous. You are not worth that and I have better things to do. As I have said before when I read something presented as a fact that does not make sense, I point it out. That’s all. If folks need to go through all sorts of contortions, name calling and subject changes to try and justify it, I think that usually speaks for itself.

OK - I get where you are coming from now and you are correct - that there was no official announcement on launch of specific SUV/CUV models or timings that I've seen - just unofficial info/leaks.

 

[Mark_888]

OK - I get where you are coming from now and you are correct - that there was no official announcement on launch of specific SUV/CUV models or timings that I've seen - just unofficial info/leaks.

There is never any "official announcement" until shortly before the vehicle is ready for sale. That is true for cars, or just about any other product. But executives have been quoted for quite a long time that they are planning on having SUV's in the Genesis lineup, and that was not a leak.

Here is some more "unofficial" but accurate product info: Apple will release a new iPhone, maybe next year, or the year after.

 

[Mcc]

OK - I get where you are coming from now and you are correct - that there was no official announcement on launch of specific SUV/CUV models or timings that I've seen - just unofficial info/leaks.

Yes you got it. I am not an expert on whether or not they should makes an SUV. And if you think they should and should have done so a while ago, that’s up to you. But folks are trying to continually wip people into a frenzy because they have not yet delivered on a product that they never said they would. These references to leaks and unsubstantiated conversations with Genesis executives are lame attempts to justify that Genesis promised something and didn’t deliver. As evidenced by the statement by Genesis that SUV was announced about two years ago. Therefore it’s late. Maybe it is late or maybe not but NOT because Genesis announced it two years ago.

 

[Mark_888]

Yes you got it. I am not an expert on whether or not they should makes an SUV. And if you think they should and should have done so a while ago, that’s up to you. But folks are trying to continually wip people into a frenzy because they have not yet delivered on a product that they never said they would. These references to leaks and unsubstantiated conversations with Genesis executives are lame attempts to justify that Genesis promised something and didn’t deliver. As evidenced by the statement by Genesis that SUV was announced about two years ago. Therefore it’s late. Maybe it is late or maybe not but NOT because Genesis announced it two years ago.

That is completely untrue. No one ever complained that Genesis was going back on its word about whether there would be an SUV. That is not the issue. The issue was whether they should develop them from scratch (which would take longer), or whether they should at least initially base one on the Santa Fe in order to get it to market more quickly. The whole question was about business strategy, not whether they delivered on any promises.

There are arguments on both sides, since the Santa Fe is a FWD/AWD design, and the Genesis SUV's are "apparently" according to YEH based on a RWD design (although probably only available in AWD configuration). If they really thought it was extremely important to have their SUV's based on RWD, and not derivative of any Hyundai models, then the delay is understandable. On the other hand, some thought that the market was so strong now for SUV's that they could have been more flexible in their design to get it to market quicker (at least the first one). The discussion was never about management going back on its word or backtracking on any promises.

Again, you refuse to admit that Genesis made it clear 2 years ago that they would have an SUV. Not all communications have to be by official announcement. Companies usually don't make official announcements about longer term strategies, only about products that are about to come to market.

 

[Mcc]

That is completely untrue. No one ever complained that Genesis was going back on its word about whether there would be an SUV. That is not the issue. The issue was whether they should develop them from scratch (which would take longer), or whether they should at least initially base one on the Santa Fe in order to get it to market more quickly. The whole question was about business strategy, not whether they delivered on any promises.

There are arguments on both sides, since the Santa Fe is a FWD/AWD design, and the Genesis SUV's are "apparently" according to YEH based on a RWD design (although probably only available in AWD configuration). If they really thought it was extremely important to have their SUV's based on RWD, and not derivative of any Hyundai models, then the delay is understandable. On the other hand, some thought that the market was so strong now for SUV's that they could have been more flexible in their design to get it to market quicker (at least the first one). The discussion was never about management going back on its word or backtracking on any promises.

Again, you refuse to admit that Genesis made it clear 2 years ago that they would have an SUV. Not all communications have to be by official announcement. Companies usually don't make official announcements about longer term strategies, only about products that are about to come to market.

I don’t think Genesis made it clear and that is the point I objected to when you said they announced it two years ago. Go back a reread your own post specifically what you said. You are so crazed with their lack of an SUV you are will to say anything to show that they had promised it. Period. No more to be said.

 

[Mark_888]

I don’t think Genesis made it clear and that is the point I objected to when you said they announced it two years ago. Go back a reread your own post specifically what you said. You are so crazed with their lack of an SUV you are will to say anything to show that they had promised it. Period. No more to be said.

I never said they promised anything. When the said they were going to have a couple of SUV's, it was clearly stated they would not be ready until 2019-2020 timeframe.

Further, any criticisms of their SUV strategy revolved around how long it would take to design and build them from scratch, versus create one based on the Santa Fe platform (at lest for the first one). Genesis management made it quite clear early on that were not going to build one based on the Santa Fe, and therefore it would take awhile.

Any discussion of the wisdom of their decision to take a couple years longer and build all their SUV's from scratch (instead of at least one based on a Santa Fe) was based on opinions about their business strategy, and their ability to rollout dedicated Genesis dealerships that are profitable without an SUV on day one. I would bet that a lot of prospective Genesis dealers would agree with me on that one, as have several members of this forum.

There was never any suggestion that Genesis went back on any promises. Such suggestions are absurd, and an excuse for inflammatory posts on this forum.