Battery replacement

[Suburbazine]

Duracell (East Penn) and Rocket (Global Power, insert Indian name here) are the only two exact-match batteries I know of. Duracell being the US battery and Rocket-something being Indian.

 

[Coffeeboss]

What nonsense. Where do people come up with that? That'd be like saying you need a doctor to wipe your butt.

If you can unbolt and lift out the battery, you can unhook and reattach the vent tube. There's a stub that's on the top edge of the battery that you pull the vent hose off and just stick it back on the new one.

I'm not seeing any kind of ventilation tube from my battery? where can I find one and does it have to be from the dealer? Its just a tube right?

 

[skipgen]

Duracell (East Penn) and Rocket (Global Power, insert Indian name here) are the only two exact-match batteries I know of. Duracell being the US battery and Rocket-something being Indian.

I had a Rocket... not exactly "Unlimited Power", I'm afraid. But it did make it for about 5 1/2 years.

 

[carguy75]

Yep, for Genesis the important numbers are 105 Amp/Hour and 190RC. They make a particular discharge graph relating to power output over time. The charging system profile expects the battery to meet these two numbers when regulating alternator output during cruise. It will run off battery power to save fuel where possible before topping off the battery again.

If the battery falls short of the specifications, the charging system may set an internal battery health warning and disable efficient cruise.

if the battery exceeds to performance values by too much the charging system will also throw an internal fault because one or more performance metrics have to be lying to it, by fault logic. This also disables efficient cruise and may even set a battery/charge warning message.

On the other hand, CA/CCA is much less important. The car only needs 270A to start, usually less if the fuel rail pressurized immediately. You just get huge CA numbers as a byproduct of a high RC starting battery...also why the battery is huge.

Where did you find this information? Source please.

 

[Coffeeboss]

I'm not seeing this Battery Vent Tube mentioned in my trunk or connected to the battery. Where can you buy one of the factory ones? Thanks

 

[inmanlanier]

I just had to change my battery yesterday in my 2015 5.0, build date 1/15/205. Thanks for all the above, some of which was enlightening. My car came with an H9. I saw some questions/comments that were either not answered or perhaps in error. I'll share my druthers and the data I learned.

The battery vent IS in my car. It's on the side of the battery closest to the rear seat. If you buy an H9, there is likely a plastic plug in both ends of the battery. I removed the plug on the appropriate side where the OEM vent tube then plugged in.

H8 batteries and H9 batteries do NOT have the same specifications. The H9 has slightly better specs. The H8 is also physically smaller than the H9 (hence why it does not perform quite the same).

The mounts in my car are specifically setup to mount an H9. If I were to put in an H8, I'd have to somehow modify the rear clamp (or go without). In addition, the length of the cables is very precise (they now size things to shave every oz. of weight and penny of material cost). the positive side of the battery cannot move due to the brace and cable lengths. The negative size of the battery is where the clamp is; the negative cable does not appear to have much slack to make up for a shorter H8 battery (I did not test an H8 install).

Some people seem to be all caught up with the OEM specs and concerned with small deviation from that. I respect that but my life experience has shown (as stated above) the CCAs are huge in both the H8 and H9 batteries - far more than needed. The difference between 105 and 100 Reserve Capacity simply means that you lose 5 minutes of sit time (100 minutes vs. 100 minutes) with the engine off, and 25 amps being consumed by the car. I don't know about the rest of y'all, but we don't sit in our cars with the engine off for very long periods of time. Since I live in South Florida, I also don't worry about the Cranking Amps number since it's a 32 degree specification (we never have to worry about that!). I've concluded that the H8 specs are well more than adequate for our car and our needs.

My criteria for buying a battery are perhaps different than most - I look for one with a good warranty from a retailer that is all over the place (we travel in our car from Florida to North Carolina). In the day, none of my batteries lasted the warranty period (under-hood temperatures cook batteries). I looked at the purchase as actually a rental cost. I used to buy Sears Die-hards until they were discontinued because they was a Sears in every town and they were great on warranty coverage. After they discontinued, I went with Advanced Auto and always balanced price with warranty (my 'rental' cost per month - usually ended up getting the 4 year warranty). When Advance dropped their warranties to 3 years, I switched to Walmart. Now they are down to 4 years from 5 and don't carry a H9 size. They have the H8.

So, yesterday when my battery died, I did a quick check of available batteries using my criteria. I almost bought the H8 AGM at Walmart, but chose not to since the negative cable length was marginal and I didn't want to take two trips back and forth with these bricks. I paid the premium price for the H9 AGM at Advanced Auto (also considered the Lead Acid at $50 less but needed the car on the road and could not assess if the acid style in the trunk was any kind of risk). Too funny - I'm back to Die-Hards (happy Bruce Willis?!).

If you have different views on why and what matters, I respect that. Please don't go after me and pick me apart, however because my thoughts are different than yours. thanks.

Questions to all (for the next time):
+ Have you tried to mount an H8 in your Genesis sedan that originally came with the H9 size? Was it a significant issue, or did the negative cable reach and you simply slotted your clamp and/or fabricated some other means to secure?
+ Has anyone studied going with lead-acid instead of AGM? At a $50 price difference (same warranty), IMHO it matters. What are the pros/cons and why is it or is it not desired to put a lead acid battery in the trunk?

 

[Chad86tsi]

+ Has anyone studied going with lead-acid instead of AGM? At a $50 price difference (same warranty), IMHO it matters. What are the pros/cons and why is it or is it not desired to put a lead acid battery in the trunk?

gel cells don't off-gas nearly as much, and typically not at all. Lost gas = lost chemistry for the battery reaction.

They also tend to be more durable shock/vibration wise, but that's not a concern in most cars.

 

[joegr]

You say AGM or lead-acid, but AGM is also lead-acid. I think you mean AGM or flooded (normal, old car battery). Anyway, one more point to make is that AGM have a slightly lower charging voltage than lead acid. Since the car came with AGM, it's safe to say that it is optimized for AGM voltages and would probably under charge the flooded battery. I'd stay with AGM for both this reason and the less out gassing. Also, whatever battery you choose must have a compatible vent connection if you value your life, your passengers, and/or your car.

 

[Suburbazine]

Questions to all (for the next time):
+ Have you tried to mount an H8 in your Genesis sedan that originally came with the H9 size? Was it a significant issue, or did the negative cable reach and you simply slotted your clamp and/or fabricated some other means to secure?
+ Has anyone studied going with lead-acid instead of AGM? At a $50 price difference (same warranty), IMHO it matters. What are the pros/cons and why is it or is it not desired to put a lead acid battery in the trunk?

You've got more issues that just negative cable length- the BMS connection (amps/temperature/voltage) also has to reach the negative terminal and I don't recall there being enough slack without cutting the harness apart.

Flooded vs AGM- probably not a good idea to put flooded in the trunk, as they usually don't have the appropriate vent connections to get any outgassing out of the trunk. Not only that, but the charge profile on a flooded starting battery is designed to be cranked once and charged thereafter... not charged, discharged, charged, discharged over and over as the car runs. On cars with flooded batteries, the alternator is sized to carry the entire expected electrical load all the time. On the Genesis, the alternator only runs to recharge the battery and power part of the electronics. The power steering, for instance, is powered from the battery.

So you'll get sulfate buildup in a flooded cell unexpectedly fast, ruining the battery.

 

[Suburbazine]

Where did you find this information? Source please.

I haven't located a free source for the engineering data yet. I was previously able to source it via special request from ALLDATA along with some other specific diagnostic information for Hyundai. That does require a commercial subscription though, I think it was their upper end technician package.

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[socrbob]

Will a trickle charger maintain your settings when you replace the car battery. If so what is best way to connect it, under hood or to cables in trunk?

 

[RedBeardCPA]

@socrbob I'm unqualified to answer your question directly but I do know that other members talked about OBDII power devices that can hold you over in the meantime. If I had to guess at the answer to your question, since I don't see other answers here, I'd say connecting it directly to the leads in the trunk makes more sense but it might all be the same.

Mostly though I wanted to say THANKS to all the contributors in this thread. So, thanks! Since opening my trunk and finding a CMF100L-DIN, I've researched all over the damn place looking for the closest possible replacement. Lots of info to sort through if you haven't been keeping up with battery technology since the old days... So, having info here on the types of AGM batteries, the exact H9 R95 specs (great chart a few pages back) and the brands (Duracell and Rocket) was excellent. They're the only ones I've seen that match the finer points of the specs like the 190min of reserve charge. Might not be a critical detail as others have suggested, but I won't roll the dice on that. Just placed an order with BatteriesPlus.com aka Batteries + Bulbs, a retail chain who appears to be the only source for the Duracell R95 in my area. Thanks for the link to that too.

Take care all. And for reference / searchability, I'm driving a 2013 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec.

 

[2for1]

@socrbob I'm unqualified to answer your question directly but I do know that other members talked about OBDII power devices that can hold you over in the meantime. If I had to guess at the answer to your question, since I don't see other answers here, I'd say connecting it directly to the leads in the trunk makes more sense but it might all be the same.

Mostly though I wanted to say THANKS to all the contributors in this thread. So, thanks! Since opening my trunk and finding a CMF100L-DIN, I've researched all over the damn place looking for the closest possible replacement. Lots of info to sort through if you haven't been keeping up with battery technology since the old days... So, having info here on the types of AGM batteries, the exact H9 R95 specs (great chart a few pages back) and the brands (Duracell and Rocket) was excellent. They're the only ones I've seen that match the finer points of the specs like the 190min of reserve charge. Might not be a critical detail as others have suggested, but I won't roll the dice on that. Just placed an order with BatteriesPlus.com aka Batteries + Bulbs, a retail chain who appears to be the only source for the Duracell R95 in my area. Thanks for the link to that too.

Take care all. And for reference / searchability, I'm driving a 2013 Hyundai Genesis R-Spec.

I had to reverse the vent plug on my Duracell.

 

[carguy75]

Will a trickle charger maintain your settings when you replace the car battery. If so what is best way to connect it, under hood or to cables in trunk?

Yes, use a12volt output adapter for your charger if available or a special setting saver that uses a 9v battery like this.

 

[NC356]

"Cigarette Lighter" outlet in the dash would have have power with ignition off for that type if cig lighter device to work.
Not sure, but I believe mine is not powered with ignition off.

 

[carguy75]

"Cigarette Lighter" outlet in the dash would have have power with ignition off for that type if cig lighter device to work.
Not sure, but I believe mine is not powered with ignition off.

The 9V battery powered setting saver device supplies the power thru the 12v outlet when the car is off or disconnected from the car battery; so that the ECU module still retain the memory settings. 9v is still enough power to keep the memory while the battery is disconnected.

Many battery chargers can use the 12 outlet as a means to charge your battery as well.

 

[millemk]

Saw an earlier question whether an H8 battery would fit (relative to neg cable available slack) but never saw an answer from someone who made that change. I also am at that battery chg point (2017 G80), and have no qualms with H8 specs, so will use H8 if someone can verify that neg term fit...

Better avail of H8 batteries, a given!

Visually, it looks like that neg cable may move sufficiently to remount to absorb that 1 1/4" length difference, but looks are deceiving.

Need a reply from that person who used H8.

 

[glennk]

Haven't used one, but seen them side-by-side. They look very similar, with the H8 unit not being a wide. I think the biggest difference is the CCA, which is lower compared to the H9 battery. Another side note, you need to keep using the venting tube that came with the car. By not using it, can lead to a build-up of volatile gas in the trunk.

 

[Abuschauffeur]

I do not know in your country but in Australia AGM or lead-acid car batteries are almost considered old technology and more and more people looking to buy Lithium ion (LiFePO4) batteries. They are a bit more expensive but are worth the extra penny and have many advantages.

Lithium ion batteries can provide all your power requirements. With their ability to fast recharge with a solar panel, AC or DCDC charger, they can power any electrical device. Lithium ion batteries have a long life and are durable. AGM batteries need special chargers, Lithium ion do not, most good chargers are suitable.

Lithium ion batteries are better than standard AGM or lead-acid batteries. Lithium ion phosphate, also known as LiFePO4 batteries, have been well tested and now recognised as safe and suitable for most outdoor and indoor applications and of course cars. (They power the Boeing 787 Dreamliner) 12V LiFePO4 batteries are damage-resistant, and can be made waterproof, and can offer 12V at a constant discharge rate, so stable that you won’t see a drop in power until the last amp has been delivered. They deliver more power. With Lithium ion batteries you will be safe from fumes, acid spills and they are about 1/3 the weight of lead-acid batteries.

Due to their low resistance, Lithium ion batteries are easily and rapidly rechargeable using AC or DCDC battery chargers, even solar panels. Safe to use even on the hottest summer day, operational temperatures of up to 80C. Lithium ion batteries are maintenance-free, so much better than lead-acid batteries that you may have just now. Just recharge the batteries when they are low. A LiFePO4 lithium battery can power most vehicles if not all. Lithium ion batteries are lightweight at only about 1/3 when compared to AGM or lead-acid batteries. A LifePO4 battery that can discharge about 100Ah will weigh around 11- 13kg, while an AGM or lead-acid will weigh around 28-30kg.

A LiFePO4 battery lasts about 4 times as long than any AGM or lead-acid battery. This is because they can cycle over 2000 times while AGM or lead-acid is good for about 500 cycles (A cycle is the number of times a battery can discharge and then fully charge, 1 cycle). On average most people will see at least seven years of use before seeing a noticeable decrease in power. They are also much more vibration friendly.

A LifePO4 battery recharges faster due to its lower internal resistance and makes it a batter option compared to lead-acids. They stay cool when charging and discharging power and offer a stable and steady power till the last amp is drained. LifePO4 batteries have little to no self-discharge at a rate of ≤2%, the battery can sit for long periods (some 1 or two years or longer) and will not go flat. Battery minders are not needed. They also don't need a vent tube.

Lithium ion batteries for cars my not yet be available in your country but if you can go for it if you can afford it but the extra they cost makes it the the cheapest option.

 

[millemk]

I'm still looking for that response only specific to the fitment of the negative cable onto the A8 battery vrs the A9.

Prev treatise sounds like a lithium battery sales pitch.