Brake Failure 2010 Genny

[ComputerBudda]

Yesterday when I started to get off the freeway, my brake pedal almost went to the floor. It was fine the first to stops I made but pucker time for sure. If I pump it it built up a little and didn't get any worse overnight so I think it's probably a master cylinder. Dropped it off at Hyundai just now. Turns out there is a second recall for ABS module that was issued December 20. My service for recall for brake fluid and master cylinder inspection was December 3rd. The writer ordered the ABS module already so maybe he knows something. I'll report back in a day or two.

 

[Mark_888]

Yesterday when I started to get off the freeway, my brake pedal almost went to the floor. It was fine the first to stops I made but pucker time for sure. If I pump it it built up a little and didn't get any worse overnight so I think it's probably a master cylinder. Dropped it off at Hyundai just now. Turns out there is a second recall for ABS module that was issued December 20. My service for recall for brake fluid and master cylinder inspection was December 3rd. The writer ordered the ABS module already so maybe he knows something. I'll report back in a day or two.

Please note your experience via a complaint with the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA). Hyundai is not proactively replacing the HECU brake units, but waiting until they fail. Filling a complaint may save someone's life:
https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

For more information on this subject, here is thread you can read:
http://www.genesisowners.com/hyundai-genesis-forum/showthread.php?t=12395

 

[ComputerBudda]

Got back from the dealer. HECU module and the fluid were replace and it brakes good as new....or at least when I bought it. If you haven't been to the dealer since the 12/20/12 recall of the ABS system, you might want to check to see if you car is covered.

Since the recall is already out for that, do I still need to report to the feds?

 

[katman0]

Got back from the dealer. HECU module and the fluid were replace and it brakes good as new....or at least when I bought it. If you haven't been to the dealer since the 12/20/12 recall of the ABS system, you might want to check to see if you car is covered.

Since the recall is already out for that, do I still need to report to the feds?

I would. I think they need to know about every case. They may force Hyundai into doing every car involved instead of putting the onus on the owner proving there is a problem.

 

[Mark_888]

Got back from the dealer. HECU module and the fluid were replace and it brakes good as new....or at least when I bought it. If you haven't been to the dealer since the 12/20/12 recall of the ABS system, you might want to check to see if you car is covered.

Since the recall is already out for that, do I still need to report to the feds?

Unfortunately, the inspection is not really effective since they can't see inside to know whether the HECU has started to corrode and will eventually fail, and it looks like the vast majority of units (built before June 1, 2010) will fail at some point. Therefore, other people are likely to encounter the problem while driving, and an accident could happen. The only way out of this is to force Hyundai to replace all the defective units made before June 1, 2010. The NHTSA is investigating that issue now and letting the NHTSA know how often the HECU failure happens will help them make the proper decision.

So even though yours is now fixed, taking 5 minutes to fill out the NHTSA complaint detailing your experience may save someone's life.

 

[ComputerBudda]

Done

 

[Mark_888]

Done

Thank you.

 

[GJEMD]

Got back from the dealer. HECU module and the fluid were replace and it brakes good as new....or at least when I bought it. If you haven't been to the dealer since the 12/20/12 recall of the ABS system, you might want to check to see if you car is covered.

Since the recall is already out for that, do I still need to report to the feds?

So, I had my 2nd brake recall campaign to "inspect the HECU" 1/6/14.
Brake fluid changed 9/2013. I took my 2010 4.6 in today for the tilt steering module replacement. I showed the service rep this thread and ask exactly what this inspection entailed. I ask since corrosion is at issue why aren't they replacing the HECU module. He then said an amazing thing. "even if the pedal goes to the floor the car should still stop." I ask to to speak to the tech. He said the only inspection is computer generated. If no codes are thrown then HECU is not corroded. No visual inspection . I have 55,000 miles showing and am probably done with the dealer for all practical purposes, but it seems this HECU should be replaced after proper brake fluid .

 

[Mark_888]

So, I had my 2nd brake recall campaign to "inspect the HECU" 1/6/14.
Brake fluid changed 9/2013. I took my 2010 4.6 in today for the tilt steering module replacement. I showed the service rep this thread and ask exactly what this inspection entailed. I ask since corrosion is at issue why aren't they replacing the HECU module. He then said an amazing thing. "even if the pedal goes to the floor the car should still stop." I ask to to speak to the tech. He said the only inspection is computer generated. If no codes are thrown then HECU is not corroded. No visual inspection . I have 55,000 miles showing and am probably done with the dealer for all practical purposes, but it seems this HECU should be replaced after proper brake fluid .

I agree with you that the HECU's should be replaced, but it is not the dealer that decides that. Hyundai Motor America (a fully owned subsidiary of Hyundai Motor Company in Korea) makes those decisions. If the dealer replaced it against HMA instructions (only replace when brake failure has occurred) the dealer would not get reimbursed for the repair.

 

[TimeOut]

I'm scheduled for the HECU inspection tomorrow. My 2010 4.6 is a bit over 4 years old but, it only has 22,500 miles. The brake fluid was replaced back in March 2013 during the voluntary TSB campaign.

Is the corrosion issue more likely to happen to cars with higher mileage or it is related to how long the original brake fluid was in the system?

______________________________

Help support this site so it can continue supporting you!

 

[Mark_888]

I'm scheduled for the HECU inspection tomorrow. My 2010 4.6 is a bit over 4 years old but, it only has 22,500 miles. The brake fluid was replaced back in March 2013 during the voluntary TSB campaign.

Is the corrosion issue more likely to happen to cars with higher mileage or it is related to how long the original brake fluid was in the system?

The critical Genesis build date is June 1. 2010, which when Hyundai switched to a newer version of the HECU from their vendor which did not include zinc platted valves, which are more subject to the corrosion problem.

As to whether the brakes are more likely to fail based on age or miles, I don't think anyone knows for certain.

 

[TimeOut]

HECU was inspected and passed.

 

[Philth]

Exactly how did they inspect the HECU?

 

[Mark_888]

Exactly how did they inspect the HECU?

I can tell you that they don't take it apart to see if any corrosion has started to occur, so the "inspection" is almost worthless.

 

[Philth]

That's pretty much my initial thoughts, but I didn't want to make assumptions.

 

[Mark_888]

That's pretty much my initial thoughts, but I didn't want to make assumptions.

The HECU is made by Continental Automotive, so I wouldn't want Hyundai opening the unit anyway, they should just replace them with newer designs that don't have zinc plated valves that will corrode.

 

[Fang]

I'm sure the HECU will eventually fail. My father's 2009 Genesis Sedan's HECU just failed. I'm trying to figure out how we can get it repaired for free because the problem is obviously related to the corrosive brake fluid. We're still in limbo with the dealership as they are working with whatever powers are in charge of authorizing replacement...it's not looking good though. My father did bring his car in for the brake fluid replacement in late 2013 for the recall, but the problem is obviously much deeper.

Pretty ridiculous if they don't replace considering the brake fluid has basically been corroding the HECU since the car was manufactured. The inspection process for the HECU seems fishy. Also, anytime something is corrosive it will obviously reduce the lifetime of the affected parts.

Just also wanted to add my two cents. This issue seriously bugs me because brake problems are really serious for driver safety and I don't feel like Hyundai is taking the necessary steps to fix this serious safety issue. What if the brakes failed during a emergency situation? I'm probably not going to recommend a Hyundai from this point forward depending on how this issue is resolved.

Posted this in another related thread.

 

[Mark_888]

Posted this in another related thread.

Read my response in the other thread.

 

[Billfz1]

The critical Genesis build date is June 1. 2010, which when Hyundai switched to a newer version of the HECU from their vendor which did not include zinc platted valves, which are more subject to the corrosion problem.

As to whether the brakes are more likely to fail based on age or miles, I don't think anyone knows for certain.

Mark,
This problem is one where cars that see fewer miles for the same age are MORE LIKELY to see problems than ones that get driven every day. Corrosion is most often caused by water absorbed by the brake fluid. Cars that see only occasional use are not brought to full temperature very often and can see more condensation. The same thing is true of detergent oils. They are both designed to keep water in suspension until it can be driven off by a full heat cycle. Even only driving short trips to the store or work that don't let the engine see better than 195°F can be a problem. This is well known by the manufacturers, but the first fluid recall was probably brought on by someone trying to save a few dollars when buying lots of brake fluid. This is also a reason that if you have old containers, (1 year or more), of brake fluid it is wise to take them to the recycler rather than use it to top off you car. Get some fresh fluid.

Bill

 

[Mark_888]

Mark,
This problem is one where cars that see fewer miles for the same age are MORE LIKELY to see problems than ones that get driven every day. Corrosion is most often caused by water absorbed by the brake fluid. Cars that see only occasional use are not brought to full temperature very often and can see more condensation. The same thing is true of detergent oils. They are both designed to keep water in suspension until it can be driven off by a full heat cycle. Even only driving short trips to the store or work that don't let the engine see better than 195°F can be a problem. This is well known by the manufacturers, but the first fluid recall was probably brought on by someone trying to save a few dollars when buying lots of brake fluid. This is also a reason that if you have old containers, (1 year or more), of brake fluid it is wise to take them to the recycler rather than use it to top off you car. Get some fresh fluid.

Bill

This is a complex issue, but I have the following comments:

1. Brake Fluid is not anything like motor oil. It does not reach high temps that cause burning off of moisture unless the brakes were overheated.
2. Driving a lot of miles and getting the engine to full temp does not impact the brake fluid. For example, if you were driving Hi-way miles with little traffic, you wouldn't using your brakes much. In fact, brakes can get as much, or more use in city driving during short trips than on the highway.
3. The fluid recall was to switch from DOT-3 to DOT-4, which also had some anti-corrosive additives included in it. But the basic problem was a design defect (corrected by Continental Automotive in 2010) in using zinc platted values in critical parts that were prone to corrosion, according to the lead investigator on this recall for the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration (NHTSA) .