expectations for the new generation 2014 rspec / predictions ?

[deepcolor]

I would expect something more in line w/ a real sports car, like a sports mode tranny, more HP (at least 500) and torque, better brakes and steering. adjustable suspension would also be nice. this would help it justify the r badge i think. my prediction is that they're not going to change much w/ respect to the performance, just the body. i hope i'm wrong.

 

[Mark63021]

My guess for 2014 sedan in general: Blind spot monitoring, HUD, passenger seat w/lumbar and cooled. Hugely advanced DIS, all illumination from LED, AWD, better mileage, less HP.

 

[kf4zra]

I really like the looks of the predicted images of the new one.
I think they have me convinced to wait for it.
That will give me some more time to save for a bigger down payment.

The things i want to see are the end of the sooty bumpers (dont care about soot when i stomp the pedal), AWD, faster shifting transmission/sport transmission mode, dual AC front seats (dont care about heated rear seats), better NAV or integration with my phone for Google maps, adjustable suspension (possibly air suspension). I would like the ability to go from cushy, driving a sofa feeling, to a little more sporty with a button push. No more flying H from the factory (i know its an easy fix though)

I dont think my ideas are too far from what should actually be coming out.
The question I want to know, is how much more will all this stuff cost? Do you think they will crack the $50k barrier?

 

[brfatal]

Adding air suspension alone will drive it up the MSRP past the $50k mark. Also it will reduce the reliability ratings of the car because of how frequently air suspensions fail.

 

[StangKiller]

All good thoughts above. I think HP is pretty high for output from a 5.0 already at 429. I would love to see them up the torque curve a bit - makes cars more fun to drive IMO...

 

[larry'sown]

I'm still deciding whether to go trough with a 2012/13 Genesis or wait for the new one, but what I'd like to see Hyundai do is really make a push with forced induction across the board. The Germans all get great performance out of their cars with the help of forced induction and I'd like to see Hyundai do the same. Something like:

Base 2.0T-Great the way it is, but maybe bump hp up to around 280. Probably the least likely engine to make it in the Genesis sedan, but every single one of the Genesis'
competitors has a turbo 4cyl for fuel efficiency purposes and Hyundai should offer one too.
3.0T, 350hp(I believe this has been rumored for the Coupe)
3.3T, 400hp
5.0-Carried over, maybe bump hp to 450. Or bore it out to 5.5L and give it 470hp(which I believe was also rumored)
4.6T, 525-550hp for a true R-Spec

 

[Potty_Pants]

Hp doest mean sht until they fix the vsc dsc nannies

Its like watching the top gear episode when they had 600hp cars in rain at the drag strip

Ppp

 

[Aquineas]

All good thoughts above. I think HP is pretty high for output from a 5.0 already at 429. I would love to see them up the torque curve a bit - makes cars more fun to drive IMO...

They're trying to protect that transmission.

 

[Potty_Pants]

They're trying to protect that transmission.

Gotta agree .

I talk with a gear head daily he explains why there is 5 & 6 speed trans on chrysler stuff.

Prob same for caddy ctsv too.

8sp trans cant handle too much torque right now.

 

[larry'sown]

Both the Audi S8 and BMW B7 both dyno at 420+lb/tq at the wheels and both have 8 speeds so I don't know how anyone's come to the conclusion that it can't handle the torque. GM and Chrysler have 5/6 speed transmissions because their powertrains are antiquated.

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[Aquineas]

Both the Audi S8 and BMW B7 both dyno at 420+lb/tq at the wheels and both have 8 speeds so I don't know how anyone's come to the conclusion that it can't handle the torque. GM and Chrysler have 5/6 speed transmissions because their powertrains are antiquated.

So are you're saying that because both the transmissions in the Audi S8, which has an MSRP starting at $110,000, and the BMW B7, which has an MSRP starting at $122,600 (which you could literally buy 3 V8 Genesis's for) can handle the torque, that Hyundai's brand-new-for-2012 transmission, designed and manufactured by Hyundai for cars that cost no more than $60K is capable of doing so as well? Is that your logic?

 

[dareaction]

So are you're saying that because both the transmissions in the Audi S8, which has an MSRP starting at $110,000, and the BMW B7, which has an MSRP starting at $122,600 (which you could literally buy 3 V8 Genesis's for) can handle the torque, that Hyundai's brand-new-for-2012 transmission, designed and manufactured by Hyundai for cars that cost no more than $60K is capable of doing so as well? Is that your logic?

Remember Dodge and Chrysler have 8-speeds newly available for their R/T and and SRT vehicles which have 390 and 470 lb-ft respectively. Those are cheaper than the Genesis.

 

[dareaction]

Gotta agree .

I talk with a gear head daily he explains why there is 5 & 6 speed trans on chrysler stuff.

Prob same for caddy ctsv too.

8sp trans cant handle too much torque right now.

I assume you don't know that the Bentley Mulsanne has 738 lb-ft and uses the same basic ZF 8 speed auto found in just about all foreign luxury cars from the $35k Audi A4 to the $400k RR Phantom. Also I assume you didn't read about Jeep's 2014 Grand Cherokee SRT8 rated at 470 lb-ft with a price of $58k. Until you all know the torque limit of Hyundai's 8-speed there really is no point of guessing. I do know that Hyundai is exploring forced induction for their Tau V8 so you can bet they will have a transmission that can handle whatever their V8s power output will be.

 

[Aquineas]

Remember Dodge and Chrysler have 8-speeds newly available for their R/T and and SRT vehicles which have 390 and 470 lb-ft respectively. Those are cheaper than the Genesis.

I never said it wasn't possible to make a transmission to handle the torque. I said that Hyundai, with a brand new in-house transmission that's been in use for less than 24 months, would be likely to want to protect that transmission.

The ZF transmissions in the Chrysler (as well as the BMW and Porsche) benefit from a lot more wear and reliability data, transmission design experience, and additional cost.

With regards to the R/T and SRT being cheaper than the Genesis, I challenge this assertion. With similar equipment levels, I haven't found that to be true.

The Chrysler 300 are nice cars (based on Mercedes vehicles that 2003/1999), but I'd never in a million years buy one. Well, I should never say never. If you had asked me in 1990 if I'd ever buy a Hyundai I'd have laughed in your face. But so long as Chrysler has these kinds of labor problems (in the plant that builds the 300, no less), and sports nearly 1cm body-panel gaps (around the hood of the 300), they won't get my money.

 

[larry'sown]

So are you're saying that because both the transmissions in the Audi S8, which has an MSRP starting at $110,000, and the BMW B7, which has an MSRP starting at $122,600 (which you could literally buy 3 V8 Genesis's for) can handle the torque, that Hyundai's brand-new-for-2012 transmission, designed and manufactured by Hyundai for cars that cost no more than $60K is capable of doing so as well? Is that your logic?

No, my logic is that coming to the conclusion that any 8 speed transmission can't handle a lot of torque is asinine. I didn't bring up the transmissions of other manufacturers. You really can't debate whether Hyundai's 8 speed can handle the power, but no one really knows how much it can handle.

 

[Aquineas]

No, my logic is that coming to the conclusion that any 8 speed transmission can't handle a lot of torque is asinine. I didn't bring up the transmissions of other manufacturers.

You didn't? Maybe it was little green men then who typed the following:

Both the Audi S8 and BMW B7 both dyno at 420+lb/tq at the wheels and both have 8 speeds so I don't know how anyone's come to the conclusion that it can't handle the torque

You really can't debate whether Hyundai's 8 speed can handle the power, but no one really knows how much it can handle.

First of all, although I am not an engineer who worked on the transmission, that doesn't mean one can't make some educated guesses. Secondly, it's asinine to assume that you are in a position to dictate what I can and can't debate, just to be clear.

One piece of information that contributed to my speculation is the 5.0 Coyote engine from Ford. The Coyote engine from Ford is similar in displacement, though it's "square" vs. the Tau being oversquare. The Tau also has a higher compression ratio (11.5 vs. 11.0), and is also larger (307 vs. 302). With that being said, the torque output of the Coyote is 390 lb-ft vs 376 lb-ft of the Tau. So here we have a larger GDI (vs MPI of the Coyote) engine that has a higher compression ratio, that's making less torque? Hmm, something doesn't add up. That suggests to me that there's a less aggressive tune in the Genesis, and while there are many reasons one might do that, reliability, and in particular transmission reliability, can't be eliminated from the discussion.

 

[Philth]

Let me just state that the number of gears don't necessarily correlate to the amount of torque a transmission can hold. Clutches (or clutch packs) within it largely dictate that.

 

[BrazGenesis]

Looking from the economic side of the equation: with the warranty the cars have it would be suicidal to offer a torque that would destroy transmissions.

 

[larry'sown]

You didn't? Maybe it was little green men then who typed the following:




First of all, although I am not an engineer who worked on the transmission, that doesn't mean one can't make some educated guesses. Secondly, it's asinine to assume that you are in a position to dictate what I can and can't debate, just to be clear.

One piece of information that contributed to my speculation is the 5.0 Coyote engine from Ford. The Coyote engine from Ford is similar in displacement, though it's "square" vs. the Tau being oversquare. The Tau also has a higher compression ratio (11.5 vs. 11.0), and is also larger (307 vs. 302). With that being said, the torque output of the Coyote is 390 lb-ft vs 376 lb-ft of the Tau. So here we have a larger GDI (vs MPI of the Coyote) engine that has a higher compression ratio, that's making less torque? Hmm, something doesn't add up. That suggests to me that there's a less aggressive tune in the Genesis, and while there are many reasons one might do that, reliability, and in particular transmission reliability, can't be eliminated from the discussion.

So I guess you missed this quote then:

Gotta agree .

I talk with a gear head daily he explains why there is 5 & 6 speed trans on chrysler stuff.

Prob same for caddy ctsv too.

8sp trans cant handle too much torque right now.

I'm not sure how you missed a post that was right above mine, but you replied to a post that wasn't directed to you at all.

And are you really up in arms over 14lb/ft of torque? That's a difference so negligible that it can be attributed to tuning for slightly more hp, which the R-Spec has. The compression ratio is irrelevant as most GDI engines have higher compression than MPI engines.

 

[danni3]

Lurking around and eager to buy the next generation sedan so I figure I would make my first post

Let me just state that the number of gears don't necessarily correlate to the amount of torque a transmission can hold. Clutches (or clutch packs) within it largely dictate that.

Correct and more :O a lot of calculations go into the design life of a transmission (i.e. the shaft that holds each gear, bearings, housings, mounts, material choice etc.)

Looking from the economic side of the equation: with the warranty the cars have it would be suicidal to offer a torque that would destroy transmissions.

Cars are generally built with a safety factor of 1.5 if I recall correctly which means that certain parts can handle 1.5 the force they're rated at before they fail. It's not a question of will it fail, but rather when, in order to keep their warranty so high they have a conservative tune to prolong the life of the transmission. (look at stress vs cycle to failure plots)

hi, I'm a mechanical engineer