July 15, 2008

[Sal Collaziano]

Interesting video--I had not seen that one. I thought the man had very little specific or concrete to say though. He did not like the exterior of the car and he didn't like the interior because it was not groundbreaking in any way. Perhaps the Genesis will be disappointing to those looking for the spectacular, but it seems to promise alot to those looking for value.

I don't know the last time Cadillac had a "ground breaking" interior. Why does an interior need to be such a thing to be relevant? It doesn't. It's silly. It's as stupid as people feeling a car is worthless unless it has a suspension as taught as a BMW - OR - as dumb as people feeling cars for "old people" are no longer needed. Like people aren't getting old anymore. Ridiculous.

Even the new Cadillac CTS interior isn't "ground breaking" - and look how much it's selling.

 

[gipp]

I agree that the marketing of the Genesis so far has left much to be desired and that my level of interest is not as high as it had been. The supposed $80M budget better kick in soon. My main complaints and worries at this point of time.
1) Web site still does not even have color combos or standard packages, options etc. People need to dream. Apparently Hyundai does not want us dreaming about this car.

2) No real life test drives by any respected international press. This is a real worry for me. Controlled tests on Hyundai test tracks just do not cut it. What is the big secret? If you really have a breakthrough world class car the "free" marketing by the automative press would take care of the marketing for you. Is anyone else worried that they have not let real automotive folks drive the US spec car in the USA?

3) Little to no dealer education seems to have taken place to date. The New Jersey dealers as of last week are saying they think they will get cars in October. When you point out the dates posted on the Hyundai site for the "By Invitation Only" events they say that "well, I guess we were not invited". This points to a systematic internal business communication issue in which Hyundai policy has not been deployed across the dealer network. How am I suppoded to think that a mechanic can fix the car if they still don't even know when they might get one or what colors it will be?

4) What happened to the special section of dealerships dedicated to the Genesis? Has anyone seen any construction going on in any dealership in the USA to date?

5) The lack of communication from Hyundai to those who signed up on thier web site is almost inexcusable at this point of time. Basic marketing 101 teaches that "teaser" ads or emails should start 2 months prior to new product introduction. Has anyone in the Hyundai marketing department ever been to business school?

6) All of this lends itself to a lack of confidence in the Hyundai corporation. This brings us back to the issue of paying over $40,000 for a car. If they can not keep schedules, conduct basic policy deployment and/or educate thier dealer network with consistent messaging why should we think they can build a technologically advanced car without these same issues showing up down the road.

7) I do give Hyundai top marks for frustrating the initial hard core fans that they had built up with the initial marketing dollars. They have given them lots of time to think about whether they should indeed consider Hyundai capable of building a world class car. So far the press and the real car fan have nothing but a few empty promises.

 

[gopack504]

I agree that the marketing of the Genesis so far has left much to be desired and that my level of interest is not as high as it had been. The supposed $80M budget better kick in soon. My main complaints and worries at this point of time.
1) Web site still does not even have color combos or standard packages, options etc. People need to dream. Apparently Hyundai does not want us dreaming about this car.

2) No real life test drives by any respected international press. This is a real worry for me. Controlled tests on Hyundai test tracks just do not cut it. What is the big secret? If you really have a breakthrough world class car the "free" marketing by the automative press would take care of the marketing for you. Is anyone else worried that they have not let real automotive folks drive the US spec car in the USA?

3) Little to no dealer education seems to have taken place to date. The New Jersey dealers as of last week are saying they think they will get cars in October. When you point out the dates posted on the Hyundai site for the "By Invitation Only" events they say that "well, I guess we were not invited". This points to a systematic internal business communication issue in which Hyundai policy has not been deployed across the dealer network. How am I suppoded to think that a mechanic can fix the car if they still don't even know when they might get one or what colors it will be?

4) What happened to the special section of dealerships dedicated to the Genesis? Has anyone seen any construction going on in any dealership in the USA to date?

5) The lack of communication from Hyundai to those who signed up on thier web site is almost inexcusable at this point of time. Basic marketing 101 teaches that "teaser" ads or emails should start 2 months prior to new product introduction. Has anyone in the Hyundai marketing department ever been to business school?

6) All of this lends itself to a lack of confidence in the Hyundai corporation. This brings us back to the issue of paying over $40,000 for a car. If they can not keep schedules, conduct basic policy deployment and/or educate thier dealer network with consistent messaging why should we think they can build a technologically advanced car without these same issues showing up down the road.

7) I do give Hyundai top marks for frustrating the initial hard core fans that they had built up with the initial marketing dollars. They have given them lots of time to think about whether they should indeed consider Hyundai capable of building a world class car. So far the press and the real car fan have nothing but a few empty promises.

Some excellent points. Especially number 2. I have been checking out the new 09 Maxima, which comes out this week and that car has tons off press on it. The premium version of the 09 Maxima has been compared to the Lexus ES, which is pretty lofty. At least Nissan is getting the word out on the car. My interest has kind of switched to the Maxima from the Genesis, mainly because the 2010 Maxima will offer a diesel.

I also agree with point number 3 as well. A month ago I stopped at a Hyundai dealership and the salesman knew next to nothing on the Genesis. The Genesis is suppose to be the car to give Hyundai a new image, and if that was the case you'd think they would be educating their dealers.

 

[Goldenbrown9638]

Gopack504 I couldn't agree with you more. I called my local Hyundai dealer and I knew more than the sales rep I spoke to. I too signed up for the Hyundai updates that they had on their web site and only received one email to-date. I am truly disappointed with Hyundai's lack of communication with potential buyers. I don't know about all of you, but I won't buy a vehicle from anyone that has poor communication skills with their customers. The communication and service must be as good, or better, than the vehicle being sold. I'm already exploring other vehicle options because I'm tired of waiting for Hyundai to provide ANY information to us.

 

[EdVoylesHyundai]

Please, God, let somebody at HMA read this thread.

Hello? Hyundai? You awake?

I share your frustration, guys. To their credit, Hyundai has held tech training classes already and there are more scheduled. They started salesperson training in May, but my class (and our sales training class) isn't until mid-July. I would like to see an excited dealer network and thousands of excited salespeople spreading the word right now. It's just not happening. There are a few enthusiasts out there like us that are digging for info every day, but that's not going to cut it.

 

[BigElm]

^ Obviously you may have information you can't share but I agree that HMA has missed the mark. They enticed the public with their Super Bowl ads and added some Flash to their Genesis website as of recent. To not have reviewers get their hand on the US spec Genesis and rely on a Korean spec car, "The US version will have better handling, response, blah, blah, blah" - as quoted by our HMA executive - is NOT going to cut it. People don't mind teasers, as frustrating as it is, but when you have miscommunication within the corporation; that only raises red flags. That's not a chance people are going to take, especially with their new flagship vehicle.

If I don't get a test drive and my Genesis by mid August, I'm going elsewhere. I don't care if the Genesis gets it's LATE rave reviews. Enough is enough already!!!

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Frank, man.. I feel the same way.. I felt really bad after reading the latest posts in this thread - and hoped that Hyundai was reading it too. I have very high hopes for Hyundai and their Genesis - but they're not doing a very good job keeping potential customers happy.

They really need to be here.. Is there ANY way that you could talk to somebody about this? They NEED to be HERE. These are their future high-end customers. They need to speak with us...

Please, God, let somebody at HMA read this thread.

Hello? Hyundai? You awake?

I share your frustration, guys. To their credit, Hyundai has held tech training classes already and there are more scheduled. They started salesperson training in May, but my class (and our sales training class) isn't until mid-July. I would like to see an excited dealer network and thousands of excited salespeople spreading the word right now. It's just not happening. There are a few enthusiasts out there like us that are digging for info every day, but that's not going to cut it.

 

[gipp]

I also have been looking at the Maxima and can't wait to see it in person. From the pictures it has great lines. Historically, in New Jersey you can get a fully loaded Maxima for about $28,000. As stated in an earlier post I need a car by September and right now the Maxima seems to have moved into a logical front position. I bet we even see the new curvacious VW Passat in NJ before the Genesis. I even bet we see both these cars before Hyundai updates thier web site.

 

[BigElm]

Nvrmd....

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Nvrmd....

Who else wants to know what BigElm was going to say?

Inquiring minds want to know!

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[BigElm]

Who else wants to know what BigElm was going to say?

Inquiring minds want to know!

LOL!!! I was commenting about how I don't like the Maxima and talk about the G8, blah, blah, blah but didn't want to go OT

HMA is been pretty quiet, but everything I read says the V6 will be here in July. I did find this tidbit though:

http://publications.mediapost.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=Articles.showArticleHomePage&art_aid=85333

 

[mkaresh]

I don't know the last time Cadillac had a "ground breaking" interior. Why does an interior need to be such a thing to be relevant? It doesn't. It's silly. It's as stupid as people feeling a car is worthless unless it has a suspension as taught as a BMW - OR - as dumb as people feeling cars for "old people" are no longer needed. Like people aren't getting old anymore. Ridiculous.

Even the new Cadillac CTS interior isn't "ground breaking" - and look how much it's selling.

I would argue that the CTS' interior, if not quite "groundbreaking," comes much closer than most these days. It's certainly distinctive--which other interior is like it? I don't think they could have gone any further stylistically without it costing them sales. (The 2003 interior was more radical, but in a way that turned people off.)

The interior was the #1 reason my father bought the car, even ahead of the exterior. The Genesis interior is not as stylish.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I would argue that the CTS' interior, if not quite "groundbreaking," comes much closer than most these days. It's certainly distinctive--which other interior is like it? I don't think they could have gone any further stylistically without it costing them sales. (The 2003 interior was more radical, but in a way that turned people off.)

The interior was the #1 reason my father bought the car, even ahead of the exterior. The Genesis interior is not as stylish.

I hear ya. But technically, it isn't "ground breaking". I love the interior of the Lexus LS460. It's quite amazing, actually. But people say that IT'S not ground breaking either. So, I don't think it's very important for an interior to be ground breaking. Look at your father - he bought the CTS because he liked the looks and functionality of a non-ground breaking interior. I'm just looking to show that it's not important for a vehicle or it's interior to be ground breaking in order to sell..

 

[mkaresh]

The Lexus LS had a "groundbreaking" interior, but not in the current car. The original car's interior set new standards with its electroluminescent instruments and excellent ergonomics. The two-tone color scheme was also widely copied.

The 2001 LS interior was notable for one thing: it might have been the first to place the nav screen high on top of the center stack. BMW followed with a similarly high screen in the 2002 7, but the execution wasn't nearly as attractive.

I think your earlier post was spot on, though. Hyundai knows that this car will sell by offering most of what the others do, for a lower price. In such a situation, it's best to resemble the others, to make the comparison as clear as possible, rather than to do your own thing.

Look what happened to Infiniti with the original Q. They tried to creately a uniquely Japanese luxury sedan, and it flopped.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

...I should have said "Lexus LS460". To me, it's the nicest interior I've ever seen - yet it's not "ground breaking". Sorry, I could have saved you a lot of time had I just been more clear..

 

[mkaresh]

I think you did say LS 460. Just thought I'd use that opening to point out in which ways the original LS had a groundbreaking interior, since Hyundai is clearly using Lexus' 1989 playbook with the Genesis.

I think the reviewer's point was that nothing in the Genesis' interior will "shock and awe" like the instruments did in the original LS. And I think that the interior in the new CTS does excite many people who visit a Cadillac dealer to check out the car.

I don't think the Genesis interior has the same potential, though the leather trim on the uplevel IP has a shot. But I also agree with you that this isn't necessary for the car's success.

Save time on a forum? The best way to save time on a forum is to not visit...

A quick bit OT: if you like the LS 460 interior, check out the all-leather version in the LS 600h. The extra bucks don't all go into the powertrain.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I've been in the LS600h but I can't seem to remember a difference other than the headliner.. I guess everything is covered in either leather or suede? Funny how I don't remember and I'm such a fan of the LS.. To me, the LS is the most comfortable car - period.

 

[mkaresh]

As you remember, the headliner is faux suede. This is also part of the Luxury Package in the 460.

In the 600h, the instrument panel, center console, and doors are entirely covered in finely stitched leather.

I chilled in the back seat of one for ten minutes or so at the Detroit show. (Press days, so I wasn't holding up the line.) As you say, very comfortable.

The tough thing with seats is they are the absolute hardest thing to evaluate in a test drive. And what works for one person won't always work for another.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Are you sure the suede isn't real? I know suede and it smelled pretty real to me.. I'd be very surprised if it was fake..

 

[mkaresh]

It's Alcantara. Says so on the Lexus site. I'm not aware of any manufacturers that use real suede. I think there are durability issues.