K&N air filter

[Nikgen]

I'm not an engineer and so I wouldn't propose anywhere else. I also didn't say it was a bad setup - you're putting words in my mouth. I merely tried to communicate that it was unusual to have a brace running through the air box in a depression as I've never seen that setup before.

Here's an exercise for you -
Name 20 cars that require you to remove a brace to access the engine filter. Then name 20 cars that do not. Which list was easier to come up with? That's the definition of something not of the usual.

Anyways, I've used K&N cones on my past 3 cars. I've never noticed an increase in mpg or power (obviously a filter isn't going to give you 10% or more, which is the "feel" threshold); however, if you're building an aftermarket intake it's one of the most used filters along with the AEM dryflow.



I'd rather use K&N than one of the knock offs. I also clean mine more often than the 50,000 mile recommendation. I've seen a study that shows that K&N's tend to clog up faster than advertised.

I am an engineer and this placement seems to be a compromise given the use of the existing 3.8 engine and the desire to achieve more stiffness through the addition of front crossbars coupled with the geometry/size of the engine bay. While you didn't explicitly say it was a bad set-up, I took it as implied by description of it as being odd and difficult to replace the filter.

Not trying to put words in your mouth an no offense was intended - just trying to show that there appears to be a valid reason that they did it this way in the 2015 - so, as an engineer, it's not odd to me given the design intent/comtext. In the end, we are just coming from different definitions of "odd" and I define it contextually and you do not - no biggie and no intent to be argumentative.

WRT to cars that I'd have to remove a brace to replace the air filter, I can't think of any - but, then again, I can't think of any with cross bracing upfront like this other than the BMW 535 xDrive - and that looks like you'd need some dis-assembly as well:

http://www.canadianautoreview.ca/images/car_photos/2014-BMW-535d-xDrive/normal/bmw-535d-xdrive-engine-bay.JPG

I do have to ask - if you notice no increase in HP or MPG, whats the point? While I might get the aesthetic value on a show car, I don't get spending money on something that doesn't actually really deliver a benefit over stock (that you can afford to change more often, if need be - and not worry about oiling your airflow sensor). Not trying to be judgmental, just trying to understand why folks spend their hard-earned money on this stuff. In any event, K&N is enjoying making money based on the urban legends for sure!

 

[zielritter]

I am an engineer and this placement seems to be a compromise given the use of the existing 3.8 engine and the desire to achieve more stiffness through the addition of front crossbars coupled with the geometry/size of the engine bay. While you didn't explicitly say it was a bad set-up, I took it as implied by description of it as being odd and difficult to replace the filter.

Not trying to put words in your mouth an no offense was intended - just trying to show that there appears to be a valid reason that they did it this way in the 2015 - so, as an engineer, it's not odd to me given the design intent/comtext. In the end, we are just coming from different definitions of "odd" and I define it contextually and you do not - no biggie and no intent to be argumentative.

WRT to cars that I'd have to remove a brace to replace the air filter, I can't think of any - but, then again, I can't think of any with cross bracing upfront like this other than the BMW 535 xDrive - and that looks like you'd need some dis-assembly as well:

http://www.canadianautoreview.ca/images/car_photos/2014-BMW-535d-xDrive/normal/bmw-535d-xdrive-engine-bay.JPG

I do have to ask - if you notice no increase in HP or MPG, whats the point? While I might get the aesthetic value on a show car, I don't get spending money on something that doesn't actually really deliver a benefit over stock (that you can afford to change more often, if need be - and not worry about oiling your airflow sensor). Not trying to be judgmental, just trying to understand why folks spend their hard-earned money on this stuff. In any event, K&N is enjoying making money based on the urban legends for sure!

Because I'm not running just a panel filter. I have a custom aluminum intake, heat shield, lighter than stock wheels, TB bypass, secondary cat-deletes and a CBE exhaust.

All of these minor, and independently inconsequential, modifications together have given me a modicum of additional power that I can measure.

Just because you can't "feel" a power increase doesn't mean there isn't a measurable one. I'm just not in the category of people who throw on a panel filter and say "hey, I can feel that 1.5hp gain when I stomp on the accelerator".

I have, however, been modifying cars long enough to know that a properly designed intake and a low restriction, yet ideal diameter exhaust system does increase power. Shedding weight increases power/weight ratio as well.

To correct you one thing, the V6 GDI (12-14) doesn't have an MAF sensor. There's a small IAT sensor after the filter and that's it. Airflow is measured in the TB by a MAP sensor, similar to a lot of other Hyundai vehicles.

Speaking of urban legend, the MAF sensor getting screwed up by K&N oil is mostly that, ironically. I read anecdotal accounts of people over-oiling filters and maybe having an issue; however, it's mostly a unsubstantiated knee-jerk response some have any time this topic is brought up. It belongs in the category of "I'll lose back pressure and power if I add a high flow <insert exhaust piece>".

 

[Nikgen]

Because I'm not running just a panel filter. I have a custom aluminum intake, heat shield, lighter than stock wheels, TB bypass, secondary cat-deletes and a CBE exhaust.

All of these minor, and independently inconsequential, modifications together have given me a modicum of additional power that I can measure.

Just because you can't "feel" a power increase doesn't mean there isn't a measurable one. I'm just not in the category of people who throw on a panel filter and say "hey, I can feel that 1.5hp gain when I stomp on the accelerator".

I have, however, been modifying cars long enough to know that a properly designed intake and a low restriction, yet ideal diameter exhaust system does increase power. Shedding weight increases power/weight ratio as well.

To correct you one thing, the V6 GDI (12-14) doesn't have an MAF sensor. There's a small IAT sensor after the filter and that's it. Airflow is measured in the TB by a MAP sensor, similar to a lot of other Hyundai vehicles.

Speaking of urban legend, the MAF sensor getting screwed up by K&N oil is mostly that, ironically. I read anecdotal accounts of people over-oiling filters and maybe having an issue; however, it's mostly a unsubstantiated knee-jerk response some have any time this topic is brought up. It belongs in the category of "I'll lose back pressure and power if I add a high flow <insert exhaust piece>".

Fair enough - Thanks for explaining!

 

[italiabrain]

Odd and uncommon are synonyms......

Never have I ever had to do anything but release a couple of clips on one plastic piece that are attached to another plastic piece in order to get to an air filter.

That's all I was trying to say.

I had no intention of correcting you in the first place, but since we're squabbling I said exactly what I meant to say...

Odd and uncommon do not have identical denotations, let alone connotations. If something happens 1 time in 100 with high predictability you don't say it's odd that it happened after 100 iterations.

Odd is closer to unexpected in this usage. Unexpected certainly has a component of frequency of past experience, but that's not its totality.

Although braces covering air filters is uncommon in cars generally, it is certainly not odd considering the design of the rest of the engine compartment of this particular car.

 

[ShadowZ]

certain models, or sister models, of the Chevrolet Trailblazer have a brace that runs across the air filter housing.

 

[zielritter]

Odd and uncommon do not have identical denotations, let alone connotations. If something happens 1 time in 100 with high predictability you don't say it's odd that it happened after 100 iterations.

Wouldn't you also not describe that as uncommon?

Otherwise, I applaud your long winded commentary and analysis of my use of the word "odd". Denote and connote away.

 

[italiabrain]

Wouldn't you also not describe that as uncommon?

Is this a serious question? You're going to call my arbitrary example of 1/100 common just to keep arguing? You do realize I was essentially defending your post and just mentioning as an aside I would've chosen a different word?

They're different words with different meanings. Yes they're similar, but no they're not the same. If you didn't understand my very simple example there's nothing more to say.

Otherwise, I applaud your long winded commentary and analysis of my use of the word "odd". Denote and connote away.

Well if three lines of discussion is all it takes for you to label something as long winded that might carry some explanatory value...

 

[italiabrain]

How about a K&N cold air intake? (Or really any brand) I mentioned it on its own thread, but it would be nice if someone made a CAI or at least an SRI for our cars. I think K&N is one of the more likely companies since they do a good number of "non-tuner" cars and they have a built-in request system.

 

[zielritter]

How about a K&N cold air intake? (Or really any brand) I mentioned it on its own thread, but it would be nice if someone made a CAI or at least an SRI for our cars. I think K&N is one of the more likely companies since they do a good number of "non-tuner" cars and they have a built-in request system.

There are none and most likely there will never be for the sedan. Best bet is to build your own. The major brands cater to the coupe as it is the enthusiast model. I've searched everywhere for an aftermarket solution to no avail.

For the record, I was saying that a 1 in 100 event happening after 100 iterations is neither odd nor uncommon. Your point wasn't clear to me with that sentence.

 

[aweime001]

Anyone figure out if there is a replacement K&N for the stock yet? I have the 5.0 and cannot find a replacement by searching.

Anyone take it out and check sizes at the parts store?

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