Michelin Energy Saver A/S road noise

[Vince2]

There was an old auto/tire shop that used to do this in my town. I had the tires of a Ford/Mazda mini truck "trued" (although I don't think they called it that). They would raise each corner of the vehicle and spin the tire with the "trueing" machine and the machine would take away rubber until the tire was perfectly round. My truck drove like a dream afterwards! Now days I think tires are considered "perfect" when new and this type of service is disappearing.

 

[Gunkk]

Tire noise is literally a matter of how the "rubber hits the road." Specifically, when air is smoothly pushed aside by the tire it's quiet, and when captured and compressed before escaping it's loud. Scalloped tires are like clapping cupped hands, where new/trued/shaved tires would be like clapping your hands with your fingers spread wide... big difference in the sound made.

 

[DRS]

^ +1

 

[PMCErnie]

I did something yesterday that I thought I'd never do; I had my Michelin Energy A/S tires trued. I've got just over 36000 miles on these tires and all four had developed uneven treadwear along the outside tread. For the last 10000 miles they have roared on any and all types of road surfaces. I've been rotating them every 5000 miles and have had one four-wheel alignment. My tread still had over 50% left and I went to the tire shop for a routine Hunter balance. They suggested trueing all four tires to smooth out the uneven scalloped tread. The tech had to do some talking to convince me and since they have a stellar reputation, I gave in and now I'm glad I did. I don't remember these tires being this quiet even when they were new plus they're silky smooth. I'll admit it was a little unsettling watching the rubber being shaved off but for under a $100 I'm thinking it was money well spent. I'm not advocating anyone else do this, but just sharing my experience.

Honestly, 36,000 miles ain't too shabby for original tires. That outside edge wear is also pretty normal and hard to prevent. I don't see how shaving could repair that. Glad yours are quieter now, but shaving them might have also cost you some wet weather safety. Good luck, in any case.

 

[Retry]

i've never heard of such a thing. assume this is a spin-move (like a lathe) type of thing? how much do you estimate they took off?

mr. doesn't get out much

I'd guess they shaved off about 1/64th across the tread and about 1/32nd where the outside tread was dished out. The excessive wear on the outside tread is still evident but now it's smooth instead of scalloped. I'll have to say its made a believer out of me. They were so noisy I was embarrassed for anyone to ride with me, but not anymore. Also, they did not true them on the vehicle, but mounted them to a contraption much like a balancer. It worked very much like a lathe.

EDIT: I just went out and stuck my tires with a tread gauge and I still have 6/32 across the tread and 5/32 at the extreme outside tread. My mileage is 36,102 miles.

 

[veed]

thx for the explanation - and the motivation to do a little googling.

 

[mikec]

Ideally when this is done not much real life is removed from the tire tread. Think about it this way: if the tread shows scallops or other uneven wear (e.g. feathering) then part of the tread is more worn than other parts. A good "truing" job will remove the high spots down to the lowest low spot only, just barely skimming that low spot. Assuming all of the tread contacted the road prior to the truing, those low spots would eventually have been the first to reach the wear limit depth/indicators anyway. After the truing - assuming the shop didn't go too far - the tire should go just as many miles before reaching the wear limit. The "loss in tread life" came from whatever caused the tire to wear in a funky manner in the first place... the truing correction just makes it so that the whole tread will now reach the wear limit at the same time assuming the original cause of funky wear (suspension/alignment issues) was repaired.

True tire scalloping is typically caused by a suspension that bounces up/down too much, causing uneven contact with the pavement. Worn shocks, sloppy bushings, etc. typically. This is a high frequency hopping too; it'll make the steering wheel vibrate. And out-of-round tire will make the steering wheel vibrate at a lower frequency. Often the tire bounce will be pretty small at most speeds but will be really bad near a particular speed - i.e. when the wheel+tire+springs+bushings+damper system hits its resonant frequency. Plus or minus 5ish MPH from that speed is bad; at other speeds it's often not a big deal.

To check for tire feathering: run your hand along the tread as if the tire were a pet's fur coat; if it feels reasonably smooth in one direction and snags your hand in the other direction, that's feathering. From the side of the tire feathering looks like shallow saw blade teeth. Feathering is typically caused by toe in/toe-out issues. Tire toe angle is the direction the tire is aimed relative to straight ahead; or equivalently the distance from the two front tires is smaller at the front of the tires compared to the back distance. A rear wheel drive car will typically have the front tires "toed in" (front of tires aimed inwards a touch relative to straight ahead) since rolling drag will tend to pull them backwards and outwards as you increase speed... the factory specific suspension toe setting is slightly toe-in so that the wheels should end up pretty much perfectly straight ahead at normal highway speeds. Soft or worn bushings again screw up the toe angle; allowing more change in toe with vehicle speed. Straight line steering stability is a strong function of toe angle; a vehicle with toe-in will have more straight-line stability compared to toe out which can be unstable actually. That's the one advantage of FWD: with the engine power going through the front wheels dragging the rest of the car the natural tendency with increasing speed is more and more toe-in. Most FWD cars actually have a little toe-out when parked just to make sure the toe-in doesn't get excessive at highway speeds.

mike c.

 

[Retry]

Nice write-up Mike. All good information.

 

[ronb]

I bought a 2010 in 2012 with the OEM Dunlap tires. Very noisy so took car back and had 2012 Michelin put on. They ended up being the Energy saver. Same road noise. I gave up. They are wearing well but on some roads you can't even hear the other passengers. Other roads, not as loud. I have 18" on the 4.6L car. It is my opinion that the noise is transmitted by the wheels and bearings used. I can put any tire on my 1991 toyota cressida and have no noise. I think special tires for road noise abatement should not be required. It is a design flaw. Otherwise, nice car for the price.

 

[iSOBigD]

I bought a 2010 in 2012 with the OEM Dunlap tires. Very noisy so took car back and had 2012 Michelin put on. They ended up being the Energy saver. Same road noise. I gave up. They are wearing well but on some roads you can't even hear the other passengers. Other roads, not as loud. I have 18" on the 4.6L car. It is my opinion that the noise is transmitted by the wheels and bearings used. I can put any tire on my 1991 toyota cressida and have no noise. I think special tires for road noise abatement should not be required. It is a design flaw. Otherwise, nice car for the price.

It's the tires mainly. I bought my 2012 and it came with those garbage energy savers and not only were they loud, they had bad grip and would squeal when the car was turning even at low speeds. I thought it made no sense after hearing everyone say how quiet this car was, yet it was louder than my Maxima.

I then put my 1 year old Achilles ATR Sport tires on and it got super quiet...and there's more quiet tires out there. On good roads I hear nothing, and on regular roads I mostly hear that ambient hum and wind every now and then.

I now have studded winter tires (Hakka 8) and from inside the car they're probably as loud as I remember the energy savers being. Those were the worst tires I've ever had in terms of grip and noise, I would recommend getting rid of them. It's also hilarious that Tirerack recommends them as the quietest tires. Keep in mind they could be testing really fat, really narrow ones and you may be using low profiles so that makes a huge difference in terms of soaking up small road imperfections.

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[aliveoutofhabit]

The Energy Saver A/S was OEM on my '12 5.0 NON-R-Spec in a 235/50R18.

They were unbelievably loud.

I switched them out quickly for a set of 19s with 245/45R19 BF Goodrich Comp 2 A/S tires. These tires are slightly quieter but handle MUCH better. Given that they're lower profile and ultra-high performance tires, I'm super satisfied.

 

[ronb]

I had the dealer change the 2010 Dunlap tires because of the drone noise when I bought certified used 2010 4.6. in 2012. They said the 2012 Michelin's would be quiet. Not so, but they sure last long. This is a problem with Genesis. I can put any tire on my toyota and it is silent. I will be changing tires when mine wear, to a more quiet tire. the drone is awful. BTW my rims are now peeling. The silver coating comes off, the rims are black underneath. Looks bad. Poor quality.

 

[shagnat]

I had the dealer change the 2010 Dunlap tires because of the drone noise when I bought certified used 2010 4.6. in 2012. They said the 2012 Michelin's would be quiet. Not so, but they sure last long. This is a problem with Genesis. I can put any tire on my toyota and it is silent. I will be changing tires when mine wear, to a more quiet tire. the drone is awful. BTW my rims are now peeling. The silver coating comes off, the rims are black underneath. Looks bad. Poor quality.

My clear coat is also coming off.... kinda' sad and don't know what to do about it. Regarding tire noise, I bought a pair of Dunlop Signature HP to replace the Pirelli P Zero Nero..... horrible tire BTW... and so far so good.... don't have many miles on them yet, but, can definitely tell a difference in ride quality and much less noise than the Pirrelli's, Wheel coating is sucking... and I take very good care of my car.

 

[ronb]

I have a Genesis 2010 3.8 sedan and have the same problem. Ruined one set of tires, had Michelin mxm4 pilots put on and drone noise (speed dependent) continued on front left. Wheel bearings replaced but noise continues. Tires balanced and suspension alignment also made no difference. Dealer appears stumped, hopefully will call Hyundai.

It is all the wheels, only sounds like left front because that is where you are sitting. As I understand it, it is tire dependent. Posts here have recommendations for quiet tires. The mxm4 is not one of them. I have the same problem, will be getting different tires when my mxm4 wear out. This is common with the Hyundai/Kia line of cars. Especially the higher end cars. Must be the wheel material transmitting noise from the tires. My other cars do not have that problem, I can put any tire on those with no noise effect.

 

[scpo]

the Mich's on my 13 3.6 run great and are quiet. I'm thankful.

 

[ronb]

Stroker, welcome to the club. My 2010 had new Dunlaps when I bought as used in 2012. Had the drone noise. Dealer said the 2012 cars Michelin tires would be quieter so they put those on. Not so, same drone. I would scroll down in this thread and you will find recommendations. When my tires wear out I will be using one of the ones people have been recommending. BTW, the Michelins wear very well.