Resolution to flutter at 25-30 mph

[phdegraff]

I have the "vibration problem" (that's what we're talking about, right? See previous posts) with my 2016 Genesis (with all options and just 27,000 miles). I believe some 2015 owners have posted the same problem. I do not know about newer models.
Congrats on having a new one! If you have the problem we'd want to know about it.

 

[glennk]

Where are y'all feeling/hearing this thump? Are you driving RWD or AWD? I'm assuming you have: had the tires rotated and balanced, alignment, checked the CV boots, checked the engine mounts, checked the tie rods and ball joints, checked the suspension, etc...

 

[okcguy]

Where are y'all feeling/hearing this thump? Are you driving RWD or AWD? I'm assuming you have: had the tires rotated and balanced, alignment, checked the CV boots, checked the engine mounts, checked the tie rods and ball joints, checked the suspension, etc...

This is just beneath the center console. It's almost like a playing card barely sticking in a bicycle spoke as it's turning.

What baffles me is the very unique criteria for the temporary noise (I don't have the vibration... Yet). It's more of an annoyance and mind-boggle than anything for me.

 

[Markymark]

This is just beneath the center console. It's almost like a playing card barely sticking in a bicycle spoke as it's turning.

What baffles me is the very unique criteria for the temporary noise (I don't have the vibration... Yet). It's more of an annoyance and mind-boggle than anything for me.

That’s a perfect description of the sound.

 

[TinsleyC]

What I hear is - correct me if I'm wrong:

- Flutter sounds like card on bike wheel
- Sometimes there's a vibration
- RWD only cars (?)
- Only when speed is 25-32 mph
- Only when car is cold
- Goes away when car warms
- 3.8 engine (?)

 

[okcguy]

What I hear is - correct me if I'm wrong:

- Flutter sounds like card on bike wheel
- Sometimes there's a vibration
- RWD only cars (?)
- Only when speed is 25-32 mph
- Only when car is cold
- Goes away when car warms
- 3.8 engine (?)

Exactly.

 

[glennk]

Thank you all for your responses.

 

[genawd16]

I am having similar problem on my 2016 HTRAC Genesis. 39k miles. Purchased as CPO. (100k drivetrain warranty intact + CPO Wrap)

1. Started with the fluttering noise below center console. More noticeable when cold.
2. Dealer replaced the driveshaft. Immediately after the replacement, they replaced it again saying the first one had a defect.
3. Noise went away and it drove smoothly for literally a few days.
4. The noise did not returned but had been replaced by a "shuddering" vibration right between 28-30mph. It also seems to vibrate right around 15mph but is less noticeable.
5. Replaced tires (Conti DWS 06). Alignment done. Did not help with vibration.
6. New issue appeared where transmission did not want to downshift at low speeds.
7. Dealer replaced the transmission. (Engine has to be taken out on HTRAC to replace transmission).
8. Shifting issue seemed to be resolved where it would downshift more readily at low speed/part throttle.
9. Vibration between 28-30mph still present.
10. Dealer called today saying the car needs a new transfer case for the shuddering vibration.

Supposed to be ready this coming Monday and praying that it fixes it, although not that optimistic based on others who've gone through similar fixes.

PSA: I had to go to 3 different dealers to get the problem diagnosed, acknowledged, and fixes attempted.

Dealer 1: Said there was nothing wrong with the car (when it was making the fluttering noise and even showed them a recording with it making it).
Dealer 2: Stated they were aware of the problem of the fluttering noise (had 3 in the shop for the same thing) and replaced the driveshaft. Went back to them for the vibrations and shifting problems, but they said there was nothing wrong.
Dealer 3: Diagnosed the the problem as transmission and replaced that. Went back for the vibration, which they diagnosed as the transfer case, which is being replaced.

If one dealer says can't duplicate/no problem, take it to another dealer..then another if necessary. Ridiculous there is such a variance but keep at it until it gets addressed.

What does the fluttering noise sound like?
Someone uploaded a video:

 

[osnv]

I am having similar problem on my 2016 HTRAC Genesis. 39k miles. Purchased as CPO. (100k drivetrain warranty intact + CPO Wrap)

1. Started with the fluttering noise below center console. More noticeable when cold.
2. Dealer replaced the driveshaft. Immediately after the replacement, they replaced it again saying the first one had a defect.
3. Noise went away and it drove smoothly for literally a few days.
4. The noise did not returned but had been replaced by a "shuddering" vibration right between 28-30mph. It also seems to vibrate right around 15mph but is less noticeable.
5. Replaced tires (Conti DWS 06). Alignment done. Did not help with vibration.
6. New issue appeared where transmission did not want to downshift at low speeds.
7. Dealer replaced the transmission. (Engine has to be taken out on HTRAC to replace transmission).
8. Shifting issue seemed to be resolved where it would downshift more readily at low speed/part throttle.
9. Vibration between 28-30mph still present.
10. Dealer called today saying the car needs a new transfer case for the shuddering vibration.

Supposed to be ready this coming Monday and praying that it fixes it, although not that optimistic based on others who've gone through similar fixes.

PSA: I had to go to 3 different dealers to get the problem diagnosed, acknowledged, and fixes attempted.

Dealer 1: Said there was nothing wrong with the car (when it was making the fluttering noise and even showed them a recording with it making it).
Dealer 2: Stated they were aware of the problem of the fluttering noise (had 3 in the shop for the same thing) and replaced the driveshaft. Went back to them for the vibrations and shifting problems, but they said there was nothing wrong.
Dealer 3: Diagnosed the the problem as transmission and replaced that. Went back for the vibration, which they diagnosed as the transfer case, which is being replaced.

If one dealer says can't duplicate/no problem, take it to another dealer..then another if necessary. Ridiculous there is such a variance but keep at it until it gets addressed.

What does the fluttering noise sound like?
Someone uploaded a video:

I hate to break the news, but most likely, the transfer case replacement will not fix the problem. Been there, done that... I have been battling this vibration for 11 months now, had front AND rear driveshafts replaced along with the u-joints and a transfer case. I had wheels and tires swapped with a different car by the dealer and the final word from the Hyundai field rep delivered by the dealership was "nothing we can do about it". With that being said, both the field rep and two dealerships stated that tires may be a contributing factor. As much as I hate to buy into this theory it looks more and more likely. I worked with the owner of the best tire shop in my state (have been their customer for over 20 years), and we shaved the tires twice already to make them perfectly round. The result is very interesting - vibration disappeared completely when the tires are warm, and it came back again, although much less noticeable after shaving the tires, when they are cold. It looks like the car is way too smooth and sensitive, so any abnormality or flat-spotting causes the vibration sensation. Extremely frustrating and appears to be non-fixable. I have to ether live with it or look for another vehicle (most likely the latter). Just a shame for a 53K car...

 

[Markymark]

I am having similar problem on my 2016 HTRAC Genesis. 39k miles. Purchased as CPO. (100k drivetrain warranty intact + CPO Wrap)

1. Started with the fluttering noise below center console. More noticeable when cold.
2. Dealer replaced the driveshaft. Immediately after the replacement, they replaced it again saying the first one had a defect.
3. Noise went away and it drove smoothly for literally a few days.
4. The noise did not returned but had been replaced by a "shuddering" vibration right between 28-30mph. It also seems to vibrate right around 15mph but is less noticeable.
5. Replaced tires (Conti DWS 06). Alignment done. Did not help with vibration.
6. New issue appeared where transmission did not want to downshift at low speeds.
7. Dealer replaced the transmission. (Engine has to be taken out on HTRAC to replace transmission).
8. Shifting issue seemed to be resolved where it would downshift more readily at low speed/part throttle.
9. Vibration between 28-30mph still present.
10. Dealer called today saying the car needs a new transfer case for the shuddering vibration.

Supposed to be ready this coming Monday and praying that it fixes it, although not that optimistic based on others who've gone through similar fixes.

PSA: I had to go to 3 different dealers to get the problem diagnosed, acknowledged, and fixes attempted.

Dealer 1: Said there was nothing wrong with the car (when it was making the fluttering noise and even showed them a recording with it making it).
Dealer 2: Stated they were aware of the problem of the fluttering noise (had 3 in the shop for the same thing) and replaced the driveshaft. Went back to them for the vibrations and shifting problems, but they said there was nothing wrong.
Dealer 3: Diagnosed the the problem as transmission and replaced that. Went back for the vibration, which they diagnosed as the transfer case, which is being replaced.

If one dealer says can't duplicate/no problem, take it to another dealer..then another if necessary. Ridiculous there is such a variance but keep at it until it gets addressed.

What does the fluttering noise sound like?
Someone uploaded a video:

Jesus. That fluttering is insane. It sounds the same as mine except yours is 2 orders of magnitude worse.

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[TinsleyC]

Can't believe the dealership can't find the source of this noise.

Take the console off and use a stethoscope?

Put wireless microphones under the car, a foot apart along the driveshaft to isolate where the noise is coming from?

 

[genawd16]

I hate to break the news, but most likely, the transfer case replacement will not fix the problem. Been there, done that... I have been battling this vibration for 11 months now, had front AND rear driveshafts replaced along with the u-joints and a transfer case. I had wheels and tires swapped with a different car by the dealer and the final word from the Hyundai field rep delivered by the dealership was "nothing we can do about it". With that being said, both the field rep and two dealerships stated that tires may be a contributing factor. As much as I hate to buy into this theory it looks more and more likely. I worked with the owner of the best tire shop in my state (have been their customer for over 20 years), and we shaved the tires twice already to make them perfectly round. The result is very interesting - vibration disappeared completely when the tires are warm, and it came back again, although much less noticeable after shaving the tires, when they are cold. It looks like the car is way too smooth and sensitive, so any abnormality or flat-spotting causes the vibration sensation. Extremely frustrating and appears to be non-fixable. I have to ether live with it or look for another vehicle (most likely the latter). Just a shame for a 53K car...

Yea, I'm not too optimistic. Is the vibration you're experiencing a shudder right between 28-29mph? It kind of seems like we might be experiencing slightly different issue? Outside of that range, the vibration isn't really an issue; it's just that I drive on roads where I'm always going through that range so it's very noticeable.

When the transmission was having problem with not wanting to downshift a low speed/part throttle, it did vibrate some; almost like it was in too high of a gear, but that went away if I applied enough throttle to get it to downshift. This problem has been fixed by the transmission replacement.

Jesus. That fluttering is insane. It sounds the same as mine except yours is 2 orders of magnitude worse.

That isn't my car, but when I saw that video, I thought his noise wasn't too bad compared to what mine was doing.

Can't believe the dealership can't find the source of this noise.

Take the console off and use a stethoscope?

Put wireless microphones under the car, a foot apart along the driveshaft to isolate where the noise is coming from?

The noise hasn't come back since the driveshaft replacement. It's just been replaced by the shudder vibration right in the same range...the noise maybe had a slightly wider range (maybe like 27-30mph)

 

[osnv]

@genawd16

Yes, the vibration is between 30 and 32 Mph no matter what was done to the car. Once you accelerate and decelerate outside of this range, it's gone. There are multiple thread regarding this issue with no resolution. After a transfer case replacement, I also have a very brief grinding/vibration felt in the driver's seat at 15-16 Mph that is different...Not sure they are related. Short of replacing the whole transmission which, according to the ones who did, would not make a difference, everything else drivetrain related is new.

 

[genawd16]

@genawd16

Yes, the vibration is between 30 and 32 Mph no matter what was done to the car. Once you accelerate and decelerate outside of this range, it's gone. There are multiple thread regarding this issue with no resolution. After a transfer case replacement, I also have a very brief grinding/vibration felt in the driver's seat at 15-16 Mph that is different...Not sure they are related. Short of replacing the whole transmission which, according to the ones who did, would not make a difference, everything else drivetrain related is new.

No, the transmission replacement did not fix the shudder on my car. It did fix the delayed shifts. I feel a slight vibration at 15mph as well, but it's so subtle that I didn't even bother asking them to try to diagnose it.

There is a TSB for the drivers seat mount that I had done. That did make things feel tighter.

They haven't mentioned the tires, but I can't see how tires would cause vibration just at that speed though.

At this point, I'm just going to have them do what they can and go from there. Probably have to get out of it unfortunately.

 

[Kraig Wilkinson]

No, the transmission replacement did not fix the shudder on my car. It did fix the delayed shifts. I feel a slight vibration at 15mph as well, but it's so subtle that I didn't even bother asking them to try to diagnose it.

There is a TSB for the drivers seat mount that I had done. That did make things feel tighter.

They haven't mentioned the tires, but I can't see how tires would cause vibration just at that speed though.

At this point, I'm just going to have them do what they can and go from there. Probably have to get out of it unfortunately.

That stinks. These are really nice cars, to have a problem like that and not be able to get it fixed is just horrible. That noise or any noise would drive me nuts. One of the fellas on this forum had suggested putting a go pro under the car around different areas to see if anything was acting goofy.

 

[RyanB]

Not sure if this will help but I had the flutter issue that was resolved with the drive shaft replacement but the vibration came back at random speeds. At 20-30 I get a slight vibration, 30-65 it's pretty good almost no vibration, 65-80 it comes back, at 88 miles per hour it hits the sweet spot and vibrates like crazy until about 95. Anything over 100 just gets scary! last weekend I took the inner panel off my hood and fixed the vibration hood issue and put a good 5+ lbs of sound mats on the hood. It's only been a few days but I can hardly feel any vibration anymore.

It's not gone but I would say it was at an 8 out of 10 before and is now 2-3. For a cheap try at helping the issue you may want to look at the hood. I never thought that the hood vibration even at lower speeds would be felt throughout the car but in my case it was. Again this wont help if you have the tapping/flutter noise but if your issue is more of a vibration problem I would give it a try. And of course since I typed this I am sure my car will start vibration again on my way home today! LOL

 

[Kraig Wilkinson]

Not sure if this will help but I had the flutter issue that was resolved with the drive shaft replacement but the vibration came back at random speeds. At 20-30 I get a slight vibration, 30-65 it's pretty good almost no vibration, 65-80 it comes back, at 88 miles per hour it hits the sweet spot and vibrates like crazy until about 95. Anything over 100 just gets scary! last weekend I took the inner panel off my hood and fixed the vibration hood issue and put a good 5+ lbs of sound mats on the hood. It's only been a few days but I can hardly feel any vibration anymore.

It's not gone but I would say it was at an 8 out of 10 before and is now 2-3. For a cheap try at helping the issue you may want to look at the hood. I never thought that the hood vibration even at lower speeds would be felt throughout the car but in my case it was. Again this wont help if you have the tapping/flutter noise but if your issue is more of a vibration problem I would give it a try. And of course since I typed this I am sure my car will start vibration again on my way home today! LOL

Good stuff! I think I am going to do that.

 

[genawd16]

UPDATE: Got the car back yesterday after the transfer case replacment. While it did not completely eliminate the shudder between 28-29mph, it is a big improvement from how it was driving. The shudder is very subtle where I have to consciously almost "look" for it to notice it; in normal driving it's ok enough where I don't plan to take it back, at least for now.

Aside from the shudder, the car seems to be driving much better. It accelerates better and goes through the gears much more smoothly.

I'm not sure if the transfer case replacement is directly related to reduction in the shudder, or if it's just a byproduct of things being replaced/tightened, since it is still there, albeit much less so.

Hopefully, it stays this and doesn't go back to how it was.

 

[arcman]

Unless the transfer case was about to seize up, replacing it would have no effect on shifting or acceleration.

 

[picubob]

Exactly.