Time to get serious - need help about Genesis selection

[Glashub]

Oh my God, I thought I was going to go out of my mind last night driving through Laurel Canyon in my 2010 Acura TL SH-AWD. The car has no sound proofing to speak of and every little rut is jarring and the dash creaks a bit. Time to get a Genesis which I remember from test driving is solid as a rock.

Here's the situation: 2 2012 4.6's in LA and Orange counties. Neither in a color I love. 2 R-specs. One in a color I'd like. One of the challenges is that the cars are about 100 miles apart. The R-spec in Oxnard the 4.6 in Long Beach. There are plenty of 3.8's. And plenty of 2011 in both 4.6 and 3.8.

I'd like to know a few things:
1. What weaknesses were improved in the 2012 over the 2011 outside of tranny and GDI and I the real world are those improvements enough to justify about $3500 more (according to Zag).

2. Has anyone used Zag (price on Zag about the same as Hyundai Circle)? Can I negotiate even more at the dealership even though I connected through Zag?

3. Carmax - Never used it but I've seen where others here have...how does that work when you take a car in for an appraisal? Any costs? Any pressure?

4. Zag pricing with incentives for a 4.6 is about $39,500 before TTL. Fair?

5. Can anyone share driving experiences of the R-spec on bad roads which is what LA mostly has. I mean shockingly bad.

6. Do I really need a V-8 given the better weight balance and gas mileage given by a V-6? Does that offset the thril and smoothness of owning a V-8?

Decisions, decisions.

Thanks for your help. You folks are very generous here. My favorite forum.

 

[nextcar]

for a 2011 V8, you should be able to get a deal that's better than Zag.
i paid 36,200 after rebate but before tax/licence.

i assume you have driven the 3.8 and 4.6, so you should know the difference in ride between them.

 

[Genesiswannabee]

It is important to test drive both the 2012 3.8 and the 4.6. I selected the 4.6 because I felt the ride was better and I did not feel any ride imperfections. The 3.8 ride is vastly improved over 2011 I just liked the ride better on the 4.6.

Drive them both and you will know which is better for you.

Larry

 

[Mark_888]

Anyone who thinks the 2010 Acura TL SH-AWD is "jarring" should probably not purchase an R-Spec, which has been described as "unnecessarily harsh" by several reviewers.

 

[Glashub]

Thanks guys. Went to Carmax and got a quote on the TL. $31,000. Great experience. Seems low for a TL SH-AWD with 5800 miles though. Went and test drove a V-6. Loved the car. The TL drive like a Vette compared to that. The ride of the 2012 does seem much improved over the 2011 as I remember it. But, alas, they only have V-6 base in stock plus the 1 premium.

Mark_88 I suspect you're right. Interestingly the salesman I test drove with drove the R-spec and claims there is not that much of a difference in the ride between the R-spec and the normal Genesis. BTW, the salesmans name is Will at Glendale Hyundai. He is very knowlegable about the Genesis and the sales manager was cool too.

Nextcar, Zag has the 2011 priced a few hundred more....thanks for the info.

 

[timc1475]

I'd like to know a few things:
1. What weaknesses were improved in the 2012 over the 2011 outside of tranny and GDI and I the real world are those improvements enough to justify about $3500 more (according to Zag).
Besides the two you mentioned upping to the next MY is always best. The suspensions of 2012 has been tweaked for better isolation on really rough roads. (You will not notice it as much on smooth roads).Don't forget better trade in.
2. Has anyone used Zag (price on Zag about the same as Hyundai Circle)? Can I negotiate even more at the dealership even though I connected through Zag?
More so possibly on a 2011 than 2012.I checked the zag vs circle and the circle was 400 dollars less with all incentives factored.
3. Carmax - Never used it but I've seen where others here have...how does that work when you take a car in for an appraisal? Any costs? Any pressure?
Carmax is simple and amazing. You're met with a smile and there is no cost to appraise. If you accept their offer it is good for 8 days and they will write you a bank draft that very day! The whole process took me under 30 min. and they actually offered me more for my trade than ANY of the 5 dealerships I went to!
4. Zag pricing with incentives for a 4.6 is about $39,500 before TTL. Fair?
You did not mention if your referring to which MY?

5. Do I really need a V-8 given the better weight distribution and gas mileage the trill and smoothness of the V-8?
I think you meant to say V6 at the tail of this question. Everyone is different in this reguard. Myself the V8 rocks. But only you can make this decision as the potential buyer, the V6 has plenty of power for you as well.
Decisions, decisions.

6. Can anyone share driving experiences of the R-spec on bad roads which is what LA mostly has. I mean shockingly bad.
Never ever choose the V8 r-spec if you have many very bad roads as the suspension is designed sporty which equals a no go on any bad roads at speeds over 35 mph. Drive it above that speed on "very bad roads", and the vibration into the interior cabin is immense and the even the steering wheel vibrates like a jack hammer. Having said that even so I ordered one due to the fact roads in my area in IL. are "ok" and I do not mind a stiffer ride. Now if my roads were mostly bad I would have chosen the non r-spec V8.
7. Do I really need a V-8 given the better weight balance and gas mileage given by a V-6? Does that offset the thril and smoothness of owning a V-8?
This question reiterates your question #5. The thrill of the V8 for me outweighs the couple mpg you save with the V6. And having that smooth quiet power on hand 24/7/365 is sweet! And not to mention that you can pass other cars quickly & safely & easily within a given window of oppertunity, means alot to me. Oh and the occasional tromp on the gas pedal from a stop light can give you that sinister grin as you see the perplexed people in their cars, in your rear view mirror...
Decisions, decisions.

 

[Glashub]

timc1475, I cleaned my original post up. My wife was talking as I was trying to write. To paraphrase Descartes she believes, "I talk; therefore I am.

Thanks for your time. Then it looks like a V-8 for me...as soon as I can find one.

 

[nextcar]

7. Do I really need a V-8 given the better weight balance and gas mileage given by a V-6? Does that offset the thril and smoothness of owning a V-8?
This question reiterates your question #5. The thrill of the V8 for me outweighs the couple mpg you save with the V6. And having that smooth quiet power on hand 24/7/365 is sweet! And not to mention that you can pass other cars quickly & safely & easily within a given window of oppertunity, means alot to me. Oh and the occasional tromp on the gas pedal from a stop light can give you that sinister grin as you see the perplexed people in their cars, in your rear view mirror...
Decisions, decisions.

you're right. the v6 does not save much more compared to the v8.
i checked out www.fuelly.com.
avg 4.6 MPG is 20
avg 3.8 MPG is 21.5

for an average driver, you'll pay about $200 per year more in gas cost by going with the 4.6.

 

[timc1475]

timc1475, I cleaned my original post up. My wife was talking as I was trying to write. To paraphrase Descartes she believes, "I talk; therefore I am.

Thanks for your time. Then it looks like a V-8 for me...as soon as I can find one.

LOL, your most welcome and the best of luck to you and your search Glashub.
PS: Remember motozuma.com to save an additional $500.00 buckeroos!

 

[Mark_888]

you're right. the v6 does not save much more compared to the v8.
i checked out www.fuelly.com.
avg 4.6 MPG is 20
avg 3.8 MPG is 21.5

for an average driver, you'll pay about $200 per year more in gas cost by going with the 4.6.

I believe those are 2011 numbers. The V6 added GID for 2012 with increased HP and better MPG.

The 2012 EPA numbers are as follows:

Engine - City / Highway / Combined

3.8 - 19 / 29 / 22
4.6 - 17 / 26 / 20

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[Gen0814]

Can't tell you the diff between 2011 & 2012, never driven 2011. Have driven 2012 3.8 and 4.6, feels like night and day. As you see, we got 4.6 and love it!
Regarding Carmax, I went there to get a quote on my 2008 Infiniti M35 expecting a rather low number based on what I've read. Don't know if detailing the car a day before played any role (car did look good!) but I got much more than I expected, somewhere between excellent and good trade-in on KB. There was no pressure, no gimmicks, fast and professional. It helped a lot in dealer trade-in, because initially they gave me about $4K less then Carmax. After an hour of negotiation we reached an agreement, they gave me about $1k less than Carmax, but considering tax advantage on trade-in we even made $300 more. So, definitely take it to Carmax, you have nothing to lose.

In MD, Zag price was much higher than Circle, so I used Circle pricing and Motozuma. No problems, dealer accepted both.

 

[Glashub]

Yeah, KBB has trade-in for my car at $33,700..excellent condition. CARMAX has mine at a price between "good" and "fair". Impossible. The car has about 5800 miles on it and nobody has ever sat in the backseat...yet they put that at "good". It seemed perfunctory. Just some harried guy marking "good" rather really thinking about it. My former Acura dealer offered my $32,000 sight unseen. CARMAX may be a mixed bag of nuts. The car shines and has no visible defects. The front seats are like new.

 

[hwks1]

Yeah, KBB has trade-in for my car at $33,700..excellent condition. CARMAX has mine at a price between "good" and "fair". Impossible. The car has about 5800 miles on it and nobody has ever sat in the backseat...yet they put that at "good". It seemed perfunctory. Just some harried guy marking "good" rather really thinking about it. My former Acura dealer offered my $32,000 sight unseen. CARMAX may be a mixed bag of nuts. The car shines and has no visible defects. The front seats are like new.

Carmax knows thier business pretty well. They dont make up trade in values - they use thier national database to determine resale value. One thing that drags down the TL is weak new car sales numbers because of the exterior styling. In other words it makes it harder for them to sell your car = lower trade in.

Use their offer as a guide, see if you can do better with your Hyundai dealer - they will have motivation to get you of of your car and into theirs

 

[nextcar]

I believe those are 2011 numbers. The V6 added GID for 2012 with increased HP and better MPG.

The 2012 EPA numbers are as follows:

Engine - City / Highway / Combined

3.8 - 19 / 29 / 22
4.6 - 17 / 26 / 20

you are correct in that they do not have 2012 cars reported. only 2009-2011 genesis models were included.

fuelly.com is based on actual drivers reporting real world mileage, instead of the bizarre testing condition used by the EPA.

i was happy with my genny reaching 32 MPG on the freeway earlier in the month. but lately with the temp reaching 110 degrees, and my AC maxed out, my MPG has been much lower.

 

[Glashub]

Carmax knows thier business pretty well. They dont make up trade in values - they use thier national database to determine resale value. One thing that drags down the TL is weak new car sales numbers because of the exterior styling. In other words it makes it harder for them to sell your car = lower trade in.

Use their offer as a guide, see if you can do better with your Hyundai dealer - they will have motivation to get you of of your car and into theirs

Not everyone is a fan of the TL's looks. Forgot about that.

 

[newman]

Not everyone is a fan of the TL's looks. Forgot about that.

I took my 2002 TL (you know - when the styling was incontrovertibly awesome) to carmax and also felt their offer was too low. I am selling mine privately.

Good luck buddy - I think you will be very happy. It sounds to me that the 4.6 might be the perfect car for you.

Cheers
Newman

 

[trotti]

6. Can anyone share driving experiences of the R-spec on bad roads which is what LA mostly has. I mean shockingly bad.
Never ever choose the V8 r-spec if you have many very bad roads as the suspension is designed sporty which equals a no go on any bad roads at speeds over 35 mph. Drive it above that speed on "very bad roads", and the vibration into the interior cabin is immense and the even the steering wheel vibrates like a jack hammer. Having said that even so I ordered one due to the fact roads in my area in IL. are "ok" and I do not mind a stiffer ride. Now if my roads were mostly bad I would have chosen the non r-spec V8.

I disagree with this response entirely. The R-Spec is quite smooth at speed and in no way would I ever (at high speeds or low speeds) describe it as providing "jack hammer" like vibration through the steering wheel.

Drive the car and you'll notice that although there's feel to the road and perhaps a bit stiffer than some prefer, it's by no means an uncomfortable or jarring experience. To the contrary, it's quite smooth and I have yet to receive one negative comment regarding the ride from any of the passengers I've carted around (although, admittedly, I only have 1,000 miles on the car so I haven't had a large amount of feedback yet).

Regarding the OPs question about which to get - try them all out and see for yourself. Yeah, it may be 100 miles one way or the other, but at least you know you've made the right decision. That CarMax quote will last for a week and it'll be no skin off your back to add 100 miles before selling it.

 

[trotti]

I took my 2002 TL (you know - when the styling was incontrovertibly awesome) to carmax and also felt their offer was too low. I am selling mine privately.

Good luck buddy - I think you will be very happy. It sounds to me that the 4.6 might be the perfect car for you.

Cheers
Newman

I took my truck to CarMax and got a quote I thought was low as well. Put it in my driveway with a for sale sign on it and sold it in 5 days. No Craiglist, no Cars.com, nothing. Also, I was able to get 176% of what CarMax offered.

My pet theory on this is that CarMax can't itself sell an 12 model year old (2000) vehicle - it has to sell it to a third party. Now we have three parties making profit off of the sale (CarMax, third party and me). I would rather it just be me Not that CarMax is duping me, it's just how that scenario works. If it was a newer car, it'd just be CarMax and I imagine I'd of gotten a price closer to what I sold it for.

Also, with the private sell I met the buyer, answered every question in detail about the truck and as a result, he's happy, I'm happy and I didn't have to bother CarMax with selling it to the third party. Not to mention I'm glad it's going to a good home (as sappy as that may sound).

So, FWIW, consider the old 89 cent For Sale sign

 

[Gen0814]

Private sale will almost always yield higher value, but there is usually more work involved, and a lot of people sacrifice higher profit for ease of selling. I've sold a few cars privately before (newspaper ad), it took a while but it worked. I've heard bad stories of Craiglist sales, so, just to be on a safe side, wouldn't do that. Car selling websites, probably, is the best way to go. But you also need to consider add fees, time involved to sell, sales tax advantage...

I leased my last car, the lease was ending in September so I had to act fast before the end of next month. My car was worth more than a residual value so it made perfect sense to sell it rather than return at the end of the lease (and pay $400 disposition fee). I searched websites to see what my car with same features and mileage is selling for privately (off course, dealer prices were much higher). Carmax gave me about $1-1.5K less that average private selling price. If I'm to sell it privately I'll have to first purchase my car from manufacturer, pay sales tax, sell to someone who will also pay sales tax.
My situation is not common, off course. I made more profit trading it in (dealer matched Carmax) considering sales tax than I would if selling privately.

 

[acoga]

Anyone who thinks the 2010 Acura TL SH-AWD is "jarring" should probably not purchase an R-Spec, which has been described as "unnecessarily harsh" by several reviewers.

It's really best to drive it yourself. I just sold my 2005 Acura TL and got an R-Spec. The ride is definitely on the firm side but pleasantly so, IMO. Not jarring in the least. That was my major concern initially. YMMV if you have bad roads, I suppose, but I find the R-Spec's ride to be perfectly acceptable.