To GrandPrix08

[Sal Collaziano]

A new thread designated for GrandPrix08 and his dislike for Hyundai (and everything non-American/Pontiac)?

Mods: shouldn't this be moved to the "off topic" area?

Good call! I didn't think of that earlier...

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I certainly don't want this turning into a Genesis "My Space". Negatives opinions are allowed here - and Appreciated! I just don't want to have people feel they're coming along and having their thread pissed on. While that is certainly not the case here - it's easy to perceive such a thing on a message board. Especially when you don't know the people (and their personalities) while posting..

I hope I didn't make anyone thing that negative opinions are unappreciated...

 

[Duaine]

I don't have a problem with GrandPrix08 staying. I to had the problem of him putting the car down without even so much as driving it. I found it interesting in a previous statement that he doesn't care about a test drive as he doesn't care about power.

Gosh there are so many more things you can get out of a test drive rather than just sitting in the car.

I'm curious that since he states that Genesis has dissapionted him and falls short of all the hype. What did he want to see in the car?

 

[RichieRichLancair]

Gosh there are som many more things you can get out of a test drive rather than just sitting in the car.

You don't have to drive a car to tell if you don't like it. Most car salesmen I know say you can't get anything from a test drive. They actually call it the "chump drive". They use it to emotionally tie a prospect up, so they can sell them easier. Basically, if you want to make an emotionally based decision, test drive.

I've bought 15 new cars, I've only test drove 3 of them. I don't remember thinking that any of the cars didn't drive the way I thought they would.

GrandPrix08 has his own criteria. Substituting your criteria for his, probably won't work. You have yours, he has his.

GrandPrix08 gives logically based arguments for his decisions. When he can't he states so. Sitting in the car changed his mind on the interior and seats, and he admitted so. Sounds emotionally mature to me.

Just don't know what the guy can do.

 

[Simonwpb]

I've bought 15 new cars, I've only test drove 3 of them. I don't remember thinking that any of the cars didn't drive the way I thought they would.

In my most recent car shopping, I had a salesman tell me he could not sell me a car unless I test-drove it first. He said it was dealership policy. Needless to say he was an idiot, but I think the policy was real. They must have had someone try to reverse a sale after taking delivery because they did not like the way it handled.

 

[jwaters943]

Wow, I'm exactly the opposite. I won't ever buy a car without driving it first. What if you don't like the steering or the braking or the suspension or the level of noise in the cabin? You can read magazines all you want, but only you can decide what feels good to you. If you get a good dealership they'll encourage you to take it on a variety of surfaces to get a feeling for the ride/handling. Heck, I test drove a Legacy GT once and they had me take it off road.

Oh well, what do I know? I must be a chump.

 

[Simonwpb]

Geez I was only gone for a few days and that was some lively debate!

Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and we do not all have to agree. Automobile preferences vary, isn't that what design is all about?

 

[RichieRichLancair]

Wow, I'm exactly the opposite. I won't ever buy a car without driving it first.

Oh well, what do I know? I must be a chump.

Well when I test drive, the salesmen call it a "chimp drive"

My Dad helped me buy my first car, he was the best negotiator I've ever seen.

He started at invoice and went down from there. It was before the internet and not easy to get the invoice price of a car. He knew the invoice price down to the penny. The salesmen made fun of his price, laughed at him, had trouble catching his breath, said things like I don't know where you got that at, but we paid alot more than that. Lot of silence, I was about to cave, when he said "Let's go talk to my sales manager".

The sales manager showed me the invoice and it was to the penny what my Dad had been saying, that caused the caused the saleman to have the laughing fit outside.

Dad said you have an end of year kickback from Ford of $750 for this vehicle. The salesmanager started laughing and said "YOU'VE GOT TO BE KIDDING!!" My Dad told him that $350 incentive from Ford Finance for the loan, the salemanager said he wouldn't be able to give me the special financing, which was the main reason I was willing to buy. My Dad said you get a $600 flooring allowance, and this guy caved.

I got that car (Bronco II) for almost 2 grand under invoice, like 4 grand under the sticker price. My Dad never raised his voice, never asked for anything, just told them what the invoice price was and the kickbacks they got. Oh yeah I also kept the special Ford financing.

The one thing my Dad told me was if I needed to test drive, go to another dealer and test drive it (which I did). He said when we went there it was to buy. No test drive, no looking it over (I did this the day before) - nothing. On that car he didn't need to negotiate, these guys caved.

My brother in law used to sell Toyotas and Chevys, and he has told me that all the salesmen were really intimidated when someone came in to buy and barely looked at the car and wouldn't test drive it. They freaked.

Unfortunely, I didn't get the negiotating gene. That experience really taught me alot. Mainly, just how full of bs some of these guys are.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I don't have the negotiating gene either! I'll keep that in mind.. Test drive elsewhere - buy without looking at the car at all - just to throw them off.

 

[GenFan]

I negotiate for a living now. I live for it. To me, negotiating the deal is almost as fun as getting the new car.

I love to walk away and see how long it takes for them to call. My wife and I place bets.

Cheap entertainment.

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[gipp]

Many people forget that there is pressure both on the buyer and the seller during every negotiation. Most people just live on the buyer side for the majority of all thier purchase transactions so they tend to forget the sellers pressure. The key in negotiating is to level the playing field and get rid of the emotions. A test drive is a classic emotional event. Turn the tables and put the pressure on the seller.
Lets think of the biggest traditional car sales weekend-Presidents Day. Everyone in the dealership from the owner to the Sales Manager to the actual salesman is under pressure to "win" thier trip to Hawaii or Fiji or the Bahamas is they sell "x" many cars. Are they willing to take $2000 less on a car to win a trip worth $10,000? Of course. That is my favorite weekend to purchase. I do all my homework up front and then walk in with a fixed price point in my mind about 1.5 hours before closing. My last Presidents Day weekend purchase was a $46,200 MSRP Lexus RX300 for $31,000. The same as with Richie's Dad they told me I was crazy, walked me over to the used lot to 'find an RX in your price range'. 45 minutes after the dealership had closed and locked the doors and the janitor was sweeping the floors the sales Manager finally said-"I have one RX300 that has been on the lot for 5 months, it does not have the navigation system you want and is not the color you said you wanted but you can have that one for your price". The sales guy almost fell down on the floor and later told me he had never seen one go out the door below $37,000. Why did the sales manager cave in? -Sellers Pressure- This one last sale put him over his bonus levels for the entire weekend and earned him big, big rewards.
My cousin Barbara bought a Toyota Highlander the next weekend for $36,500.
Set a price in your mind, be prepared to walk out several times, and start with the riduculous low price and negotiate from there. Put the pressure on the dealership and remove it from yourself. You can walk back into the dealership and pay a higher amount whenever you choose to. They are banking on the emotioanl investment you have put into going to the dealership, test driving the car and then they will hit you with professional sales speak to ramp up your emotions. Do not fall for it. Stick to your guns. The exception to this of course comes when you have new models that demand outstrips supply and then it is in reality a sellers market.

 

[RichieRichLancair]

Wow! Talk about time well spent.

15K in a few hours. That's like a third off! I've been leaving a ton on the table.

The President's day sale. I've got to try that.

 

[Simonwpb]

You guys are some tough customers!

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I negotiate for a living now. I live for it. To me, negotiating the deal is almost as fun as getting the new car.

I love to walk away and see how long it takes for them to call. My wife and I place bets.

Cheap entertainment.

I admire that. I need lessons. I think every car I buy is one that sells very easily. Maybe that's my problem.