Week long test ride

[RSPEC429]

The new Gennie absolutely is the better car. The previous Gennie and the pre-facelift 300 were much more evenly matched. I actually cross shopped the two, along with the EcoBoost MKS, back in '12 and ended up with the Genesis. This time around, the 300 is not in the running because it is basically the same car that it was back in 2012. The full redesign of the Genesis is far more alluring than the nip-tuck the 300 received.

 

[craigt]

I never considered anything from Chrysler (nor Ford or GM) when shopping for a car last year. My price target was around $30k. The cross-shop candidates were used '10 BMW 5 series and C-Class Benz. The Benz was way too small, and for the price of a used 5 series, a new Genesis was a far better deal.

I still wouldn't consider anything from the big 3. I like solid feel and good engineering. Outside of a Corvette, they don't make anything that appeals to me. Perhaps once the kids are in (and out) of college....

 

[Bill K]

I would say that the 300 is in the same class as the Azera, not the Genesis. The 15 Genesis is two classes above it.

 

[svensk]

The 200 is a 9 speed auto.

Thanks for correcting me. The 8 speed in the 300 is ZF sourced, and I think has been fine. The 9 speed in the 200 is garbage.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

The new Gennie absolutely is the better car. The previous Gennie and the pre-facelift 300 were much more evenly matched. I actually cross shopped the two, along with the EcoBoost MKS, back in '12 and ended up with the Genesis. This time around, the 300 is not in the running because it is basically the same car that it was back in 2012. The full redesign of the Genesis is far more alluring than the nip-tuck the 300 received.

I find the interior of the new 300 much better than the first generation. Still not as good as the Genesis, though.

I would say that the 300 is in the same class as the Azera, not the Genesis. The 15 Genesis is two classes above it.

You really can't compare the two because the 300 is rear wheel drive and all wheel drive while the Azera is front wheel drive only. One is available with a pretty powerful V8 - the other only with a V6. They're very different cars. While the Genesis is a more luxurious car than the 300 - it plays in the same league. Chrysler simply doesn't do as good a job with their car as Hyundai does with theirs...

 

[FastDEW1]

One of the great things about life is that we all have choices. Buy what you like.

I am just curious, I never race my car and not interested in doing so, but the 300 has a bunch more torque down low and larger tires I believe as well, and you can get the V8 with AWD. Does it get out of the hole faster? Wonder how they would run against each other?

Seems like AWD and V8 would really rip off the line!

 

[Bill K]

The interior of the 300c didn't impress me.
Seats, radio, controls seemed sub-standard compared even to the 1st gen Genesis.

 

[RSPEC429]

You really can't compare the two because the 300 is rear wheel drive and all wheel drive while the Azera is front wheel drive only. One is available with a pretty powerful V8 - the other only with a V6. They're very different cars. While the Genesis is a more luxurious car than the 300 - it plays in the same league. Chrysler simply doesn't do as good a job with their car as Hyundai does with theirs...

Car and Driver ranks the 300 behind the Toyota Avalon and the Chevrolet Impala in the full size sedan segment: http://www.caranddriver.com/chrysler/300

They rank the Genesis 8th in the mid-size luxury category behind the A6, CTS, E-Class, 5-Series, XF, Ghibli, and GS in that order: http://www.caranddriver.com/hyundai/genesis

Take those ranking as you like. If you place the Genesis in the full size sedan segment, I would wager that the Gennie wipes the floor with the Avalon, Impala and the 300. Place the 300 in the mid-size luxury segment, and I don't see it out-competing an Infiniti Q70, which the Genesis happens to be ahead in C&D's rankings. Again, take those rankings as you see fit.

 

[RSPEC429]

One of the great things about life is that we all have choices. Buy what you like.

I am just curious, I never race my car and not interested in doing so, but the 300 has a bunch more torque down low and larger tires I believe as well, and you can get the V8 with AWD. Does it get out of the hole faster? Wonder how they would run against each other?

Seems like AWD and V8 would really rip off the line!

The AWD/V8 combo is no longer available: http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2015-chrysler-300-v-8-first-drive-review

"This year, the V-8 can no longer be paired with all-wheel drive, owing to that combo’s abysmal take rate; evidently, people who already commit $2500 extra for AWD are disinclined to throw another three grand at the lump under the hood."

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I don't know how they judge their cars but all I needed to see was Chevy Impala #2 and Kia Cadenza #5. What is so good about the Impala to put it so far ahead of the Cadenza (?) - which is a pretty impressive/feature-rich car...

The Chrysler 300 isn't an extremely impressive car by any means - but I compare it to the Genesis in the same way many people compare the Lexus ES to the Genesis. They get cross-shopped like crazy. They may not truly be competitors - but...

This discussion contains a lot of Chrysler and 300 bashing. I owned a 2007 years ago and, while I liked the car, service was so bad that I'll never own another Chrysler product. I'm certainly not a Chrysler "fan boy" but (and I guess I need to say) "in my opinion", the 300 is a very nice/good car...

But... Maybe I'm just a serial automobile enthusiast who can find something he likes about any car...

Car and Driver ranks the 300 behind the Toyota Avalon and the Chevrolet Impala in the full size sedan segment: http://www.caranddriver.com/chrysler/300

They rank the Genesis 8th in the mid-size luxury category behind the A6, CTS, E-Class, 5-Series, XF, Ghibli, and GS in that order: http://www.caranddriver.com/hyundai/genesis

Take those ranking as you like. If you place the Genesis in the full size sedan segment, I would wager that the Gennie wipes the floor with the Avalon, Impala and the 300. Place the 300 in the mid-size luxury segment, and I don't see it out-competing an Infiniti Q70, which the Genesis happens to be ahead in C&D's rankings. Again, take those rankings as you see fit.

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[RSPEC429]

I don't know how they judge their cars but all I needed to see was Chevy Impala #2 and Kia Cadenza #5. What is so good about the Impala to put it so far ahead of the Cadenza (?) - which is a pretty impressive/feature-rich car...

The Chrysler 300 isn't an extremely impressive car by any means - but I compare it to the Genesis in the same way many people compare the Lexus ES to the Genesis. They get cross-shopped like crazy. They may not truly be competitors - but...

This discussion contains a lot of Chrysler and 300 bashing. I owned a 2007 years ago and, while I liked the car, service was so bad that I'll never own another Chrysler product. I'm certainly not a Chrysler "fan boy" but (and I guess I need to say) "in my opinion", the 300 is a very nice/good car...

But... Maybe I'm just a serial automobile enthusiast who can find something he likes about any car...

C&D had a comparison test recently and I was really gunning for the Cadenza as well, but they noted that the structure was loose and that the steering was bland. They also pegged it for the highest as-tested price, but all the other vehicles could easily be loaded up a bit more to even that out. You can read the article here if you are inclined to: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2014-kia-cadenza-page-3

I'm not anti 300 by any means. Like I said, I cross-shopped it with the Genesis back in '12 and considered taking a look at them again, but the nip-tuck it received just wasn't enough to pull me from the fully redesigned Genesis. There seems to be plenty of "generic" looking 300's out on the streets as well. The Genesis on other hand are a bit more rare in my parts, which I like.

The 300 does have an awesome available indigo/linen interior though

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I'll read the article tomorrow. I'm getting to this kinda late tonight. The Cadenza is a little high priced. But I do believe it has a few features not found on at least some of the vehicles it competed with. I love the looks of the interior...

The second generation Genesis is a bigger upgrade from the first generation than the second generation 300 is to it's first. The 300 is not on my shopping list but I do still think it's a vehicle worth looking at for people in the market. And I hear the SRT-8 is making a come back so that should keep things interesting...

C&D had a comparison test recently and I was really gunning for the Cadenza as well, but they noted that the structure was loose and that the steering was bland. They also pegged it for the highest as-tested price, but all the other vehicles could easily be loaded up a bit more to even that out. You can read the article here if you are inclined to: http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/2014-kia-cadenza-page-3

I'm not anti 300 by any means. Like I said, I cross-shopped it with the Genesis back in '12 and considered taking a look at them again, but the nip-tuck it received just wasn't enough to pull me from the fully redesigned Genesis. There seems to be plenty of "generic" looking 300's out on the streets as well. The Genesis on other hand are a bit more rare in my parts, which I like.

The 300 does have an awesome available indigo/linen interior though

 

[Cacicgt7]

Thanks for correcting me. The 8 speed in the 300 is ZF sourced, and I think has been fine. The 9 speed in the 200 is garbage.

Actually the 9 speed is also a ZF transmission and besides just cycling through a lot of gears is far from garbage. But what do I know, I only own it.


Long time lurker (since 2010) but almost never post on this forum... but just in this thread I'll add my 5 cents.

I'm with a couple of the others out here. People who haven't sat in/test drove/ or checked out new Chrysler or hell even GM/Ford products are living under a rock. They've absolutely improved in the past 3-4 years. I ended up buying the 200 I have now (2015) because my Genesis didn't work so well in the mountains and snow of Colorado (yes even with snow tires) and I wanted the AWD. I've been extremely impressed with what I've seen (and leaning here more at the 2015 lineup, but the 2013-2014 300 wasn't bad, just not as good as the Genesis).

Even the new Chevy Impala was surprising. I do really like the 2015 Genesis but there's other things out there and to speculate that it's all "awful" without looking or trying something is completely naive. Some forum members are very much sounding like the exact people who called the Genesis "not worthy" of competing against the 5 series or other luxury brands because it's a Hyundai. Pot meet kettle.

 

[craigt]

People who haven't sat in/test drove/ or checked out new Chrysler or hell even GM/Ford products are living under a rock. They've absolutely improved in the past 3-4 years.

That may be true, but the history of those companies is what is preventing me from spending any money in any of their products. They all really crapped on safety, reliability, and integrity for so long that I can't be true to myself by supporting their actions.
</rant>

 

[FastDEW1]

Actually the 9 speed is also a ZF transmission and besides just cycling through a lot of gears is far from garbage. But what do I know, I only own it.


Long time lurker (since 2010) but almost never post on this forum... but just in this thread I'll add my 5 cents.

I'm with a couple of the others out here. People who haven't sat in/test drove/ or checked out new Chrysler or hell even GM/Ford products are living under a rock. They've absolutely improved in the past 3-4 years. I ended up buying the 200 I have now (2015) because my Genesis didn't work so well in the mountains and snow of Colorado (yes even with snow tires) and I wanted the AWD. I've been extremely impressed with what I've seen (and leaning here more at the 2015 lineup, but the 2013-2014 300 wasn't bad, just not as good as the Genesis).

Even the new Chevy Impala was surprising. I do really like the 2015 Genesis but there's other things out there and to speculate that it's all "awful" without looking or trying something is completely naive. Some forum members are very much sounding like the exact people who called the Genesis "not worthy" of competing against the 5 series or other luxury brands because it's a Hyundai. Pot meet kettle.

+1

 

[svensk]

Actually the 9 speed is also a ZF transmission and besides just cycling through a lot of gears is far from garbage. But what do I know, I only own it.


Long time lurker (since 2010) but almost never post on this forum... but just in this thread I'll add my 5 cents.

I'm with a couple of the others out here. People who haven't sat in/test drove/ or checked out new Chrysler or hell even GM/Ford products are living under a rock. They've absolutely improved in the past 3-4 years. I ended up buying the 200 I have now (2015) because my Genesis didn't work so well in the mountains and snow of Colorado (yes even with snow tires) and I wanted the AWD. I've been extremely impressed with what I've seen (and leaning here more at the 2015 lineup, but the 2013-2014 300 wasn't bad, just not as good as the Genesis).

Even the new Chevy Impala was surprising. I do really like the 2015 Genesis but there's other things out there and to speculate that it's all "awful" without looking or trying something is completely naive. Some forum members are very much sounding like the exact people who called the Genesis "not worthy" of competing against the 5 series or other luxury brands because it's a Hyundai. Pot meet kettle.

The 200 forums are filled with unhappy campers regarding the 9-speed. http://blog.caranddriver.com/holy-shift-zf-9-speed-automatic-problems-mount-chrysler-releases-third-software-update-for-jeep-cherokee/

 

[geops]

That may be true, but the history of those companies is what is preventing me from spending any money in any of their products. They all really crapped on safety, reliability, and integrity for so long that I can't be true to myself by supporting their actions.
</rant>

I can say the exact same thing about the history of Hyundai. 8 - 10 years ago I wouldn't touch a hyundai with a stick. Now I'm driving one...

 

[craigt]

I can say the exact same thing about the history of Hyundai. 8 - 10 years ago I wouldn't touch a hyundai with a stick. Now I'm driving one...

I think the difference is deceit vs. expectations. Hyundai 10 years ago made disposable cars. Everyone knew that.

Let's not debate this since it is doubtful we'll ever agree. Back to the topic...

 

[RSPEC429]

I own a '99 Wrangler, an '08 Navigator, an '08 550i and the '12 Genesis. I also had a '00 Excursion up until a few months ago. I've had the least problems with the Chrysler product believe it or not. Each has had its own unique problems, but I cannot say any were/are a dud. Don't be so close minded. Every company has its screw ups and its successes.

 

[chipandem]

That may be true, but the history of those companies is what is preventing me from spending any money in any of their products. They all really crapped on safety, reliability, and integrity for so long that I can't be true to myself by supporting their actions.
</rant>

I'm with you on this. When my wife and I were looking for a new car last year, the first person we asked was the head mechanic and long time friend at the shop we take our cars to. We ran some different cars by him to get his thoughts on them. He immediately said don't bother with the Euro cars unless your well prepared to keep up with the expensive maintenance, and that too many folks fall into this dream of owning a BMW and never take care of it properly. He then listed his order of preference regarding his top picks for make.

1. Toyota/Honda TIE
3. Hyundai
4. Ford/Mazda TIE

He specifically said do not get yourself involved in a Chrystler/Dodge/Jeep vehicle. We pretty much knew what he meant and didn't inquire any further. Granted, a lot of the American car manafacturers have been competing well and making some really nice stuff, but it's hard to shake that bad association with a name brand. Again, only his opinion but being a mechanic for 25+ years I'm sure he's seen his share of car nightmares.