Oil filter/engine damage and warranty coverage

[gatorsoccer]

I currently own a 2009 Hyundai Genesis sedan which I had been very happy with until recently. Two weeks ago the check engine light and check oil pressure light began coming on intermittently. I brought the car to the dealer for service. The dealer told me that there is damage to the lower engine block and that the repair will cost almost $9000. The dealer told me this was caused by what he claims is an improperly installed oil filter and that as a result, the repairs would not be covered by my warranty. The mechanic who installed the oil filter denies that it was installed improperly. In addition, the last oil change on the car was almost 6 months ago and, if the filter was installed improperly as the dealer claims, the check engine or oil lights should have come on to alert me of this situation well before $9000 worth of damage was done to the engine. I disputed the denial of warranty coverage with the dealer and called Hyundai Motor America through the 800 phone number on the website, followed the prompts for Genesis customer service, and initiated a claim for the warranty denial. I was told that someone at Hyundai Motor America would contact me within 3-4 business days. I never heard back from Hyundai Motor America. When I called the dealer to follow up, he told me my claim with Hyundai Motor America was denied. I have attempted to contact Hyundai Motor America but they cannot tell me any information other than that my claim was denied and they told me the case was closed. They have told me that there is no one else I can speak with about it. All of my contact has been through the dealer, as the service representative who supposedly denied my claim has refused to call me to speak about it. He has only offered to meet me in person but will not be able to do so until next month. In the meantime, my car has been sitting at the Hyundai dealer's service department with the engine disassembled and the dealer is now threatening to assert a mechanics lien on the car. If I refuse to have Hyundai make the repair, the dealer is telling me I still owe him a few thousand dollars just for them to disassemble the engine and diagnose the problem. I have not received any denial of my claim in writing nor did anyone at Hyundai even contact me to let me know that the claim was denied. Not only is the denial of warranty coverage unbelievable, Hyundai's customer service over the past 2 weeks has been horrendous. Has anyone else had a similar experience either with this type of oil filer/engine problem or with a warranty coverage dispute, or does anyone have suggestions of how to proceed from here? My owners manual is in the car at the dealer so I don't know if there is some specific information in there that could help me with the warranty issue.

 

[Kevinc5a]

You've done what you can with Hyundai. I don't think you will get any satisfaction until you retain an attorney. Then you will become one of the few animals in the forest with teeth.

 

[Southern Boy]

Sorry to hear about your car. Hope all turns out well for you.

If you follow this link it will tell you how to get to the “owner’s manual” for your car.

I made the last entry which, once you are on the Hyundai site provides step by step instructions on how the obtain the information you are seeking.

http://www.genesisowners.com/hyundai-genesis-forum/showthread.php?t=253&page=2

 

[homeofstone]

Did the dealer save the filter that they said was not installed correctly? Did the dealer make photos of the filter in the car and show specificly how it was installed wrong? Was it the correct filter for the car? If the dealer did not document through photos and save the the filter then Hyundai must do a warranty replacemnt of the engine. If the dealer did document with photos and saved the filter in question then the shop that changed the oil last must pay for all damages.

 

[kw88keys]

About 4 years ago a very similar incident happened to me though it was on the Azera that I owned prior to my current 2011 Genesis. In short, Jiffy Lube installed the oil filter wrong. After about 3500 miles I noticed a clicking in my engine and brought it to the Hyundai dealer. They found a severe leak around the oil filter, lots of oil in the lower part of the engine compartment, and sufficient damage to require replacement of the engine ($8500 parts and labor). It was not covered under the warranty, nor did I think it SHOULD be covered under the warranty. (it was not a defect in materials or workmanship)

For one, the JL did a poor job and number 2, I could kick myself for not routinely checking the oil level until a major problem happened.
Lessons learned - I only have the dealer do my service, and I routinely check fluid levels. As a post script, I did check with an attorney and the chances of going after Jiffy Lube were VERY slim due to the time transpired. So, like me, I think we can consider this a "teachable moment" in current news vernacular.

 

[brfatal]

As someone who used to be a service adviser for Subaru, I would say that everything done so far seems pretty much in line with the practices I saw in place. Once the factory rep says "no", case closed. There is no appeal (I have 1st hand experience with this on my own car when an engine died, only it was a factory defect as proved by an independent shop after I towed it from the dealer). You can talk to your lawyer but I don't imagine that would net much aside from additional expenses. The dealership doesn't necessarily have to present the bad filter. Any good mechanic would document it would photos, but they aren't absolutely required to. As long as it's documented in paper they have something to go off of, where as the customer, who has no mechanical training and never saw a point of failure would have to prove that the filter did not cause it and that it was a factory defect in the case of a lawsuit.

And holy crap Hyundai motors are expensive.

 

[Rey]

Very hard to visually prove a poor installation of an oil filter, like striped threads. The fact that oil leaked out speaks to a bad install, probably a loose install.

As for $9000 motors, do check with nationwide salvage yards as used 4.6s are out there and available. Here is an example for $4K : http://www.ebay.com/itm/09-10-Genes...pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr

 

[osprey]

This is why I use only dealers for my service on all my cars, if there is an issue the small guy will not have funs to cover the mistake.

Also, if you get a lawyer you will pay him more than if you have it fixed.

When you hire a lawyer it is delay , delay, delay, money, money, money.

I am sure not all attorneys are like that.

 

[homeofstone]

Most small shops have insurance that will cover the damages to your engine due to their mistake. Also, its a long shot, but check with your auto insurance comapny and find out if they cover damage casued by a shop. Insurance covers more than just crashes.

 

[Rey]

Let me add another aspect to your story: Did your oil pressure sensor warning illuminate? Usually, it is a bright red light. If any car ever does this it means basically that you have zero oil pressure. The only thing to do is to immediately stop the car and turn off the motor (safely, of course). If the oil pressure warning light never illuminated, then there is a more clear mfg. warranty claim.
It is common for owners to immediately drive to a dealership with the oil light blazing. Recall the story of an Aston Martin owner who did just this to find his motor seized and out of warranty. The owner just could not understand this. He felt that he had done everything correctly taking it to the dealer for maintenance. He thought the dealer checked the oil, and the dealer-check should have been enough.
If your oil light never illuminated, then perhaps you truly have a warranty claim against Hyundai.
I always check my oil level after a refill. I check it after the car has sat overnight and the motor is stone cold. Doing it in this mode establishes a common point of reference. If you check oil after the car is running drain down time can vary. Then ever 500 miles or so, I recheck.
I hate to write this, but as a retired lawyer I cannot recommend hiring a lawyer. Your attorneys' fees can quickly exceed your cost of repair; and there is no guarantee of recovering attorney fees in a favorable verdict. What you can do is sue the lube place in small claims court. Your case is pretty simple. You used there services to change the oil, produce the receipt. Oil leaked out as shown by dealership work order. Present the case that oil never leaks massively from a modern motor unless an oil passage (drain plug/filter in this case) leaks. They will counter by arguing that you could have avoided the damage by checking oil level. Counter argue saying there was little reason to check oil so soon (?) after an oil change. But, if you continued to drive the car after oil light illumination your case is considerably weaker.

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[homeofstone]

Let me add another aspect to your story: Did your oil pressure sensor warning illuminate? Usually, it is a bright red light. If any car ever does this it means basically that you have zero oil pressure. The only thing to do is to immediately stop the car and turn off the motor (safely, of course). If the oil pressure warning light never illuminated, then there is a more clear mfg. warranty claim.
It is common for owners to immediately drive to a dealership with the oil light blazing. Recall the story of an Aston Martin owner who did just this to find his motor seized and out of warranty. The owner just could not understand this. He felt that he had done everything correctly taking it to the dealer for maintenance. He thought the dealer checked the oil, and the dealer-check should have been enough.
If your oil light never illuminated, then perhaps you truly have a warranty claim against Hyundai.
I always check my oil level after a refill. I check it after the car has sat overnight and the motor is stone cold. Doing it in this mode establishes a common point of reference. If you check oil after the car is running drain down time can vary. Then ever 500 miles or so, I recheck.
I hate to write this, but as a retired lawyer I cannot recommend hiring a lawyer. Your attorneys' fees can quickly exceed your cost of repair; and there is no guarantee of recovering attorney fees in a favorable verdict. What you can do is sue the lube place in small claims court. Your case is pretty simple. You used there services to change the oil, produce the receipt. Oil leaked out as shown by dealership work order. Present the case that oil never leaks massively from a modern motor unless an oil passage (drain plug/filter in this case) leaks. They will counter by arguing that you could have avoided the damage by checking oil level. Counter argue saying there was little reason to check oil so soon (?) after an oil change. But, if you continued to drive the car after oil light illumination your case is considerably weaker.

Good advice. ^ And I agree with keeping a close check on the oil level, but my Mercedes does not have a dip stick and is checked through the cars information system in center of speedometer dail which has always worried me if there is a malfuction of the sensor. I prefer having a dipstick like the Genesis and most other cars.

 

[Stoofpilot]

This is why I use the coupons from Hyundai to have them do my oil changes.

 

[osprey]

Most small shops have insurance that will cover the damages to your engine due to their mistake. Also, its a long shot, but check with your auto insurance comapny and find out if they cover damage casued by a shop. Insurance covers more than just crashes.

They may have insurance but collecting and proving they are wrong is a whole different story. Much better chance with the car companies.

 

[the M5 beast]

Was there any oil on the floor where you parked it? My daughter bought a new Sonata. We do all the maintenance on the car (yes my daughter helps or does it herself and the has me check it). Any way she had taken it in for a recall and they gave her one of those free inspections. When she got home I noticed a stream of oil coming from her car. I raised the hood and there was oil coming out of the oil filter cap. I checked the torque and it was good so I took the cap off. There was no o-ring in the cap. It had been a couple months since we changed the oil and there were no leaks. She had lost 2 to 3 qts. of oil. I called the dealership and they refused to replace the oil or o-ring. That is why I never let the dealer service any of my cars. If they have to do any warranty work I tell them to save all the replaced parts. On the hand be glad it wasn't an M5 V-10, that would have set you back $32,000.

 

[jmo51]

How in the hell could many quarts of leak out of the filter and the owner not notice?? I don't get it

John

 

[Mark_888]

Most small shops have insurance that will cover the damages to your engine due to their mistake. Also, its a long shot, but check with your auto insurance comapny and find out if they cover damage casued by a shop. Insurance covers more than just crashes.

I would get a detailed written explanation of the problem from the dealer, and then contact your insurance company. If it is possible that it was caused by road hazard damage to underside of the car, then your auto insurance may cover it. If it was caused by improper installation of the filter, then you can use that against Jiffy Lube.

Jiffy Lube is owned by Shell Oil, one of the largest corporations in the world, although I believe that Jiffy Lube locations are franchises that are independently owned (although usually a franchisee owns a fairly large number of them in a given area). However, Jiffy Lube has about the worst reputation of any oil change place on the planet in terms of incompetence, and I would never trust them with a cartridge filter like the Genesis.

About 20 years ago a friend of mine took his Ford Minivan to Jiffy Lube for an oil change and they talked him into a transmission oil change also. His transmission completely failed a few hundred miles later, almost certainly because they did not use type F transmission fluid (standard on Fords of that era). Jiffy Lube denied any wrong doing.

If you have a written statement from Hyundai that the problem was improper installation, take it to small claims court against Jiffy Lube. It may not pay the entire cost of a new engine, but is better than nothing (small claims judgment limits vary by state).

 

[psychdoc]

Can I ask how this was resolved? My engine just died in a similar fashion in my 2009 Genesis and they are denying coverage because they are blaming the oil filter. Seems to be a theme.

 

[dareckibmw]

I don't think he will answer that, he only posted once and his last activity was 11-18-2012

 

[kn5owa]

This is why I use the coupons from Hyundai to have them do my oil changes.

This is why I do my own service work.

Interesting though - nowhere in this thread is it explained what actually happened. Cartridge type oil filters don't leak. The filter housing/cap and the pan drain plug are the only possible source of leaks. On the so-called "cartridge" system favored by Hyundai, the paper filter is completely enclosed within the filter housing.

 

[kn5owa]

Can I ask how this was resolved? My engine just died in a similar fashion in my 2009 Genesis and they are denying coverage because they are blaming the oil filter. Seems to be a theme.

An oil filter by itself - esp. if it's oem - ain't gonna kill your engine.

But, the so-called "cartridge filter" system utilized by Hyundai presents all sorts of opportunities for the disinterested and/or sloppy mechanic to hose things up.

I sold a 2006 Sonata V6 to a relative a 1000 miles away who never lifted a wrench in his life. Whoever did the service work screwed things up, it apparently lost the oil, and burned the engine up. That's all I know - except the car was in mint condx when it was conveyed.