2010 almost certainly will have suspension changes

[Mark_888]

That is a pretty poor come back Mark...... you don't own this place just like we don't own this place........ we are just saying..... after 757 posts....... ( my God do you do nothing else but post on here)....... we..... THE MAJORITY have heard enough of you......... its not that we have a problem with listening to peoples issues........ its that after hearing you and especially Doug harp about this particular issue it gets nausiating especially when probably most of us don't have the same issue to the degree that you do..... and no I won't move on.......I have every right to be here as much as you do........ It's real simple...... if you have a problem with the car I suggest you sell it and buy something else....... and stop subjecting the rest of us to your wisdom........... Like I said before......... don't be telling me to ignore this thread...... I have every right to read it and tell you what I think of your comments..... Your proper response would be .... thank you for your comments... we will agree to disagree........ not ...... Ignore this thread and move on........

You are welcome to read and post in this thread if you like. Please don't ask me to stop posting as you did previously. There are plenty of subjects I don't find appropriate and don't want to see, so that is why I suggested you ignore the subject if it bothers you.

I started this thread to provide information that I thought was valuable and relevant. I did not start this thread to complain about anything. If Hyundai didn't think there was a problem with the suspension, then they wouldn't be changing it in 2010 (although I realize it has not been proven yet that they are changing it). It is even possible that they have made some minor changes to 2009 production runs.

I have also posted in many other threads that have nothing to do with this subject so your inference that I posted 757 times complaining about the suspension is way out of line.

 

[BigElm]

I think you guys need to just relax here. If, for whatever reason, you don't agree with Mark and his suspension info; there really is no need to get bent out of shape about it. Everyone is free to hang out here and read what they feel but to ridicule or continue the nonsense that's been going on here; it's' not tolerated.

I would suggest that if you have nothing to add, then don't post!

Because in all honesty, if we're going to nitpick everything, then I can start with kaberle's aggressive extension of 'periods' (........) - Now... is that really nice?

 

[Nabber]

I think putting Mark in the same light as some others is not appropriate. While I may not agree with everything Mark says (or in some cases how he says it), at least he's rational and accurate. Others, not so much.

There was plenty of drama, exaggeration, and misinformation flying about; mostly by a select few whose expectations were out of line for a vehicle competing in this category at this price point.

Just my $.02

 

[doug725]

You may be refering to me. Nothing I posted was exagerated for my vehicle. I constantly attempted to be very clear that I was reporting experience with my vehicle and did not profess to speak for all vehicles or owners or what have you. Though, others did contact me with similar concerns. Also, if you carefully read what was posted - my concern was not due to out of line expectations for a vehicle in this price point, but rather due to odd behavior of my suspension in comparison to any vehicle.

It will be interesting to see if the replacement mentioned above does in fact happen.

I think putting Mark in the same light as some others is not appropriate. While I may not agree with everything Mark says (or in some cases how he says it), at least he's rational and accurate. Others, not so much.

There was plenty of drama, exaggeration, and misinformation flying about; mostly by a select few whose expectations were out of line for a vehicle competing in this category at this price point.

Just my $.02

 

[kaberle]

I think you guys need to just relax here. If, for whatever reason, you don't agree with Mark and his suspension info; there really is no need to get bent out of shape about it. Everyone is free to hang out here and read what they feel but to ridicule or continue the nonsense that's been going on here; it's' not tolerated.

I would suggest that if you have nothing to add, then don't post!

Because in all honesty, if we're going to nitpick everything, then I can start with kaberle's aggressive extension of 'periods' (........) - Now... is that really nice?

The periods I use are simply my style of writing and do not infer aggression

 

[kaberle]

I think putting Mark in the same light as some others is not appropriate. While I may not agree with everything Mark says (or in some cases how he says it), at least he's rational and accurate. Others, not so much.

There was plenty of drama, exaggeration, and misinformation flying about; mostly by a select few whose expectations were out of line for a vehicle competing in this category at this price point.

Just my $.02

Well said Nabber............ I did make the mistake of lumping Mark in with Doug........ My mistake........ Marks comments are much more rational than Dougs........To Mark....... I would not make a good diplomat........ I tend to speak to quickly and from the heart instead of being diplomatic........ I meant no disrespect......... I apologize.......... I know that you post on a variety of subjects and they are not always complaints.......... I was trying to say ( although in an out of line way) ... where do you find the time to post 6 times a day ?...........

So back to the issue........... I am all for changes Hyundai would make to the suspension or any other item on the car that are an improvement.........In the case of the suspension I am offering a counterpoint to the argument that the suspension is harsh for those who may never have driven a Genesis......... thats all........ I don't believe the suspension is harsh to the point where someone should sell their Genesis or not buy one at all......can there be improvements....... yes ... like in all cars including the Infinities and Mercedes of the world...........

 

[doug725]

There's been no lack at all of "counterpoints" in these posts. Many have expressed that they are perfectly happy with their ride and that's great - and I would never acuse them (or you) of exagerating even though I personally never had their/your positive experience in my Genesis. The fact that you personally do not believe it or find it irrational does not mean that I and some others have not had the issues exactly as described. And yes, to the point of selling. What is it exactly you find irrational? As always, anyone considering a purchase is going to have to test and decide for themseleves.

Well said Nabber............ I did make the mistake of lumping Mark in with Doug........ My mistake........ Marks comments are much more rational than Dougs........To Mark....... I would not make a good diplomat........ I tend to speak to quickly and from the heart instead of being diplomatic........ I meant no disrespect......... I apologize.......... I know that you post on a variety of subjects and they are not always complaints.......... I was trying to say ( although in an out of line way) ... where do you find the time to post 6 times a day ?...........

So back to the issue........... I am all for changes Hyundai would make to the suspension or any other item on the car that are an improvement.........In the case of the suspension I am offering a counterpoint to the argument that the suspension is harsh for those who may never have driven a Genesis......... thats all........ I don't believe the suspension is harsh to the point where someone should sell their Genesis or not buy one at all......can there be improvements....... yes ... like in all cars including the Infinities and Mercedes of the world...........

 

[StefanProdan]

I posted to this effect in the test drive thread, but I think it bears repeating here: the suspension in the Genesis was the single thing that kept me from buying one. If it wasn't so bouncy over rough roads I would be a Genesis owner now. I just couldn't do it because if they fixed it for next year and I had to pay $10k or whatever to trade up to a 2010 I would be too mad at myself for not waiting to see if these changes went through.

I test drove it thoroughly to see who in this thread I agreed with and I came down on the side of the people who find there to be a problem with the suspension, but one that could be fixed pretty easily for next year.

 

[JPW]

I called Hyundai's Corporate Phone Number today. I don't own a Genesis but am looking forward to buying one if the suspension issue can be resolved. People can call it an actual issue or a matter of personal taste. In either event I have experienced what others have described and hope for a change. I only hope it isn't dramatic because in most scenarios I do enjoy the ride. Anyway, when I made the call I was impressed to see one of the first questions they ask is whether you are a Genesis owner or a potential Genesis owner and that first option appears to push you straight through the call menu to actually speak to someone (nice job Hyundai!). What I was hoping to get out of this call was definitive information that there would be a suspension change in 2010. The person I spoke with said he has not heard any information that this would be the case and actually he has heard the opposite. He said he is aware of the high number of complaints centered around the suspension but Hyundai contends that it is indeed personal taste and not something they will change. He did go on to say the only difference between the 2009 and 2010 may be the option for a touch-screen NAV system but even that is currently open for debate. I gave him my own feedback regarding the suspension and hope with enough others who take the time to offer feedback and change may be imminent but as for now there may not be a good chance of it.

 

[Mark_888]

I called Hyundai's Corporate Phone Number today. I don't own a Genesis but am looking forward to buying one if the suspension issue can be resolved. People can call it an actual issue or a matter of personal taste. In either event I have experienced what others have described and hope for a change. I only hope it isn't dramatic because in most scenarios I do enjoy the ride. Anyway, when I made the call I was impressed to see one of the first questions they ask is whether you are a Genesis owner or a potential Genesis owner and that first option appears to push you straight through the call menu to actually speak to someone (nice job Hyundai!). What I was hoping to get out of this call was definitive information that there would be a suspension change in 2010. The person I spoke with said he has not heard any information that this would be the case and actually he has heard the opposite. He said he is aware of the high number of complaints centered around the suspension but Hyundai contends that it is indeed personal taste and not something they will change. He did go on to say the only difference between the 2009 and 2010 may be the option for a touch-screen NAV system but even that is currently open for debate. I gave him my own feedback regarding the suspension and hope with enough others who take the time to offer feedback and change may be imminent but as for now there may not be a good chance of it.

It would be suicidal for Hyundai to publicly admit that they were going to improve the suspension in the upcoming model year while they are still trying to sell 2009 models. Of course they will deny it. Please be reasonable.

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[ctrcbob]

He did go on to say the only difference between the 2009 and 2010 may be the option for a touch-screen NAV system but even that is currently open for debate.

No no NO: Don't go to the "Touch Screen" NAV System or screen. When I first bought my Genesis, because my previous car had the touch screen NAV system, I did not like the system used in the Genesis, HOWEVER, I have changed my mind.

In my previous car, the finger prints on the screen always bothered me, plus the screen gets dirty. Also, the wear on the screen surface was such, that even when cleaning with a damp cloth, the area where I would touch showed wear. My best friend has a Prius with the touch screen, and his screen
IS A MESS.

Now that I've learned how to use the system in the Genesis, I love it. The whole DIS is kind of complicated, however the NAV part of it is great in that I don't have to touch the screen.

 

[kaberle]

No no NO: Don't go to the "Touch Screen" NAV System or screen. When I first bought my Genesis, because my previous car had the touch screen NAV system, I did not like the system used in the Genesis, HOWEVER, I have changed my mind.

In my previous car, the finger prints on the screen always bothered me, plus the screen gets dirty. Also, the wear on the screen surface was such, that even when cleaning with a damp cloth, the area where I would touch showed wear. My best friend has a Prius with the touch screen, and his screen
IS A MESS.

Now that I've learned how to use the system in the Genesis, I love it. The whole DIS is kind of complicated, however the NAV part of it is great in that I don't have to touch the screen.

I agree. Plus seems to me that with touch screen you would have to take your eyes off the road more if you were driving while using it.

 

[kaberle]

It would be suicidal for Hyundai to publicly admit that they were going to improve the suspension in the upcoming model year while they are still trying to sell 2009 models. Of course they will deny it. Please be reasonable.

I totally and whole heartedly agree with this. No one in their right mind would admit that changes were coming if they were still trying to sell the 2009 models. Plus whoever they were talking to probably wouldn't be informed of such changes until they actually happen.

 

[JPW]

It would be suicidal for Hyundai to publicly admit that they were going to improve the suspension in the upcoming model year while they are still trying to sell 2009 models. Of course they will deny it. Please be reasonable.

Thanks Mark. That is a great point and you give me hope that you're right. I just wish I could obtain some kind of definitive information that this is the case. They would have to be planning for it months ago to make production for 2010 in the ~August 2009 timeframe.

 

[kaberle]

There's been no lack at all of "counterpoints" in these posts. Many have expressed that they are perfectly happy with their ride and that's great - and I would never acuse them (or you) of exagerating even though I personally never had their/your positive experience in my Genesis. The fact that you personally do not believe it or find it irrational does not mean that I and some others have not had the issues exactly as described. And yes, to the point of selling. What is it exactly you find irrational? As always, anyone considering a purchase is going to have to test and decide for themseleves.

Doug, finally we agree on something. Anyone buying this car is going to have to test drive it themselves and decide for themselves if the suspension is acceptable.This is what mean by perception. You can't say it's not a matter of perception when many do not perceive it to be an issue. That inherently makes it a matter of perception.


What I mean by irrational is your description of the suspension as leg numbing and worst you have ever driven out of 23 cars, gives you a headache etc. IMO a more appropriate way to say it is as described in this Motor Trend article ( follow link and see last paragragh) . The point here is he is saying the "ride is a little nervous" and "the rear springs and shocks feel way to stiff relative to the front".

http://motortrend.automotive.com/109723/112-0907-2009-hyundai-genesis-4-6-sedan-arrival/index.html

This kind of a statement I can live with. It compliments what I have been saying that the suspension is stiff and that you can make it less stiff for sure but that may or may not please all people.

For the record. I take back all previous statements I made about your comments. You have the right to convey everything that you have gone through in driving the Genesis you once had. The rest of us can then agree or disagree. Fair enough.

 

[ImInPA]

Thanks Mark. That is a great point and you give me hope that you're right. I just wish I could obtain some kind of definitive information that this is the case. They would have to be planning for it months ago to make production for 2010 in the ~August 2009 timeframe.

I think that if Hyundai steps up and makes the changes available to 2009 buyers that it would have no impact at all and would actually show how they stand behind their vehicles. It is far more suicidal to simply make the changes for 2010 and hope no one notices. If I were a first year purchaser I would royally pissed off if I had complained to Hyundai about suspension issues, been ignored, then have them fix it for future years.

 

[kaberle]

I think that if Hyundai steps up and makes the changes available to 2009 buyers that it would have no impact at all and would actually show how they stand behind their vehicles. It is far more suicidal to simply make the changes for 2010 and hope no one notices. If I were a first year purchaser I would royally pissed off if I had complained to Hyundai about suspension issues, been ignored, then have them fix it for future years.

Car companies are far more apt to be scared of scaring off potential new customers than those who have already bought their product. There are always changes to cars as they enter future model years, this is not isolated to Hyundai or to suspension issues.Some changes turn out for the better, some for the worse.

Lets just say that Hyundai tweaks the suspension and it satisfies customers who have a problem with the suspension. The new tweaked suspension may not be to my liking. And there in lies the issue for all car companies. Build something that suits the majority ...... not everyone.

 

[doug725]

The Motor Trend article I think does describe the normal Genesis suspension - a little nervous. The demo I drove was a bit nervous, but acceptable obviously. However, it does not accurately describe what my particular vehicle was like - which was exactly as described and way funkier than just the nervous ride characteristic of the Genesis. I had all the problems exacly as described. I never claimed it applied to all the Genny's out there. Indeed, it was the discordance between my extensive test drives and my vehicle and its inconsistent nature that caused me to post here in the frst place. I still think there was something funky about mine. Apparently ,some others had the same problem as I since several people contacted me with similar extreme experience. One or two reviewers have had what seems to be an outlying extreme experience as well. Clearly, not everyone has had that level of experience - but it is/was real. I don't mean this personally at all - but I never understand why some people just refuse to believe that just maybe there were some extreme outlyers with a problem out there.

Doug, finally we agree on something. Anyone buying this car is going to have to test drive it themselves and decide for themselves if the suspension is acceptable.This is what mean by perception. You can't say it's not a matter of perception when many do not perceive it to be an issue. That inherently makes it a matter of perception.


What I mean by irrational is your description of the suspension as leg numbing and worst you have ever driven out of 23 cars, gives you a headache etc. IMO a more appropriate way to say it is as described in this Motor Trend article ( follow link and see last paragragh) . The point here is he is saying the "ride is a little nervous" and "the rear springs and shocks feel way to stiff relative to the front".

http://motortrend.automotive.com/109723/112-0907-2009-hyundai-genesis-4-6-sedan-arrival/index.html

This kind of a statement I can live with. It compliments what I have been saying that the suspension is stiff and that you can make it less stiff for sure but that may or may not please all people.

For the record. I take back all previous statements I made about your comments. You have the right to convey everything that you have gone through in driving the Genesis you once had. The rest of us can then agree or disagree. Fair enough.

 

[kaberle]

The Motor Trend article I think does describe the normal Genesis suspension - a little nervous. The demo I drove was a bit nervous, but acceptable obviously. However, it does not accurately describe what my particular vehicle was like - which was exactly as described and way funkier than just the nervous ride characteristic of the Genesis. I had all the problems exacly as described. I never claimed it applied to all the Genny's out there. Indeed, it was the discordance between my extensive test drives and my vehicle and its inconsistent nature that caused me to post here in the frst place. I still think there was something funky about mine. Apparently ,some others had the same problem as I since several people contacted me with similar extreme experience. One or two reviewers have had what seems to be an outlying extreme experience as well. Clearly, not everyone has had that level of experience - but it is/was real. I don't mean this personally at all - but I never understand why some people just refuse to believe that just maybe there were some extreme outlyers with a problem out there.

Agreed ! Then if your case was an extreme, for most people no or very little changes are required. It's too bad you never got to own a "normal" Genesis. My Genesis doesn't like rough roads either. Just not to the degree that you describe with yours. Most cars don't like rough roads. My 1987 Trans Am GTA hated rough roads. Heck all the cars I have ever owned dislike rough roads. ts just a matter of degree. Thus my "perception comments earlier. My Dad drives a 1978 Grand Marquis. It is "squishy". There are roads where I live he won't drive down because he says they are too rough.

 

[doug725]

Man I wish I had owned a normal functioning one as well! Some cars indeed are not great on rough roads, but I have found the majority of new cars do better than even the "normal" Genesis. Course, mine did not do well even on what previosuly I had regarded as smooth roads. I do think they could up their game a bit. It would make a good product even better IMO. I'd like a reason to revisit the car.

Agreed ! Then if your case was an extreme, for most people no or very little changes are required. It's too bad you never got to own a "normal" Genesis. My Genesis doesn't like rough roads either. Just not to the degree that you describe with yours. Most cars don't like rough roads. My 1987 Trans Am GTA hated rough roads. Heck all the cars I have ever owned dislike rough roads. ts just a matter of degree. Thus my "perception comments earlier. My Dad drives a 1978 Grand Marquis. It is "squishy". There are roads where I live he won't drive down because he says they are too rough.