G70 2.0T 6MT Owner - Has anyone else with this noticed?

[egenesis12]

....a noticeable lag/bog upon initial acceleration after engaging the car from a stop with the manual? To be more clear, when i hit the friction point and get the car rolling in 1st gear, and then fully release the clutch and give it some gas i get a very noticeable power lag. lag is actually the wrong word, more like power reduction that lunges me forward before things start to even out and then I get the power. Hard to describe, but it seems to be a characteristic of the car, and i have observed this both with the g70 6MT i own and a different g70 6MT that i test drove.

It happens whether you're in sport mode or comfort, etc. I don't think anything is wrong, and perhaps i have to figure out how to dance with her better, but i have driven stick all my life, in BMW, acura, Porsche, Ford, pontiac, chevy, and i dont think its really me as i never experience this on any other manual car. I would chalk it up to turbo lag, but it feels more significant than that. Has anyone else with the 2.0T 6MT noticed this bog coming off the clutch and into gear? Definitely happens about 50% of the time from a dead stop into 1st gear, and maybe 20% of the time coming off the 1-2 shift. Higher gears do not have this occurrence. Lastly, it happens more when I am being more aggressive with the call for power and quick shifting off the line. Driving slow, smooth and at low rpm around town - it goes away mostly, but not entirely.

oh and by the way, I LOVE THIS FRICKING CAR!

 

[canucklehead604]

^ yes, this has been discussed. the 'lag' is worst in Comfort mode. note sure why Genesis tuned it this way, but that's the deal for now. in Eco, and particularly Sport, the lag is almost completely eliminated. switching drive modes is the 2nd thing i do after firing up every day. most driving is done in Sport. Eco is nice with passengers since it smooths out throttle response and driveline lash.

in CAD there is a TSB for a 2.0T ECU retune which is said to improve driveability as well as increased boost/power. i will get this ECU update when i go in for my first complimentary service.

 

[egenesis12]

^ yes, this has been discussed. the 'lag' is worst in Comfort mode. note sure why Genesis tuned it this way, but that's the deal for now. in Eco, and particularly Sport, the lag is almost completely eliminated. switching drive modes is the 2nd thing i do after firing up every day. most driving is done in Sport. Eco is nice with passengers since it smooths out throttle response and driveline lash.

in CAD there is a TSB for a 2.0T ECU retune which is said to improve driveability as well as increased boost/power. i will get this ECU update when i go in for my first complimentary service.

Thanks for the comment. I switch to sport mode each time as well and doing that does not alleviate the intial bog, and almost exacerbates the sensation of the bogging since the the throttle opens faster so its much more dramatic after the bog. Anyway, yes, i find it entertaining if its turbo lag, but i can see it getting frustrating over time to constantly lurch forward in my seat after letting out the clutch and pressing the gas and LOSING forward acceleration until the turbo comes online. I would be happy with a TSB to improve this.

 

[canucklehead604]

^ if you're getting the lag worse in Sport than Comfort you may have a separate issue. i hope the ECU update gets rolled out in the US market as well.

 

[LandOfConfusion]

Can someone who has driven both the 2.0t automatic transmission and the manual please reply here with some comparison of this "lag" issue between the AT and the MT? I've driven the AT and didn't notice it. I want to buy an MT, but I can't test drive one -- there isn't one in my local area. If it's as bad as I am hearing, I may want to reevaluate whether to get the MT at all.

 

[egenesis12]

Can someone who has driven both the 2.0t automatic transmission and the manual please reply here with some comparison of this "lag" issue between the AT and the MT? I've driven the AT and didn't notice it. I want to buy an MT, but I can't test drive one -- there isn't one in my local area. If it's as bad as I am hearing, I may want to reevaluate whether to get the MT at all.

I'd love to be pointed to any previous threads that discuss this. Can anyone provide me with a link?

 

[danygenesis]

I'd love to be pointed to any previous threads that discuss this. Can anyone provide me with a link?

Just a quick search and I got this one.

6MT Owners - Discussion Thread

i wanted to start a thread dedicated to 6MT trims, either CAD or US Spec. i assume there are other 6MT owners out there by now, and hopefully we have another forum member or three...so let's discuss issues related to our 'rare' trims. One thing i've noticed so far is that unless i am in...

genesisowners.com

 

[Toddasaurus]

I read in a couple big car reviews (either C&D or MotorTrend, can't remember which) that addressed this "issue." Evidently, Genesis USA actually tuned the ECU like this on purpose - supposedly to help have a smooth clutch engagement. This is ONLY for the 6spd manual, the 8spd 2.0 does not have this "feature."

That said, if you have a 6spd manual G70, the ECU cuts power during clutch engagement, I believe while only in 1st gear, to smooth things out a little bit. Personally, this would drive me crazy.

 

[canucklehead604]

if switching to Sport mode isn't helping the OP he likely has some other issue that needs to be addressed.

 

[NLJ]

The 8AT can bog down with the 2.0T due to too much grip if you have the PS4 tires. Let it slip a little and you're good to go!

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Help support this site so it can continue supporting you!

 

[egenesis12]

I think it's the combination of this "tuning" + turbo lag which is pretty significant that come together to make the engine response feel like mud (even in sport mode, just less so) until 3k rpm accelerating from a stop in the 6MT. My car is fine as a different 6MT I test drove was identical with this "characteristic". While I would prefer a more linear power delivery, it makes it interesting sort of like a big turbo track car where there's nobody home from 1.5k to 3k and then whhhoooooossshhhhh. Guess it just takes some getting used to and maybe I am hypersensitive since I am coming from a 6.4L Hemi V8. Again, very happy with the car. It's a complete package.

 

[LandOfConfusion]

I read in a couple big car reviews (either C&D or MotorTrend, can't remember which) that addressed this "issue." Evidently, Genesis USA actually tuned the ECU like this on purpose - supposedly to help have a smooth clutch engagement. This is ONLY for the 6spd manual, the 8spd 2.0 does not have this "feature."

That said, if you have a 6spd manual G70, the ECU cuts power during clutch engagement, I believe while only in 1st gear, to smooth things out a little bit. Personally, this would drive me crazy.

Thanks. Found this interesting tidbit in MotorTrend:

Is there room for improvement? Sure. The manual version has a weird dip in power at the end of clutch engagement during first-gear starts. Genesis claims it's a feature, not a bug, promoting smooth starts. This goes against the enthusiast philosophy, and hopefully it will be defeatable in future versions. The nice quilted seats could benefit from extendable upper thigh supports, and I'd welcome a true manual mode on automatic-equipped versions without having to turn off the traction control completely.

Link: Genesis G70 First Drive

To all 6MT owners: Who here has spoken to their dealer or to Genesis North America about an ECU update to remap throttle? I believe a CAD owner got an ECU update because of a TSB there. Can we go all in to lobby for this in the US?

 

[egwhite44]

I have gotten used to this now after 4k miles of driving. people who have driven my car notice it immediately but i dont anymore.

Maybe i'm making up for the loss of power with the clutch or giving it more gas going into 1st gear than i would otherwise without realizing.

 

[egenesis12]

I have gotten used to this now after 4k miles of driving. people who have driven my car notice it immediately but i don't anymore.

Maybe i'm making up for the loss of power with the clutch or giving it more gas going into 1st gear than i would otherwise without realizing.

Yea, same here. After 1200mi and a month of ownership, I've learned to adapt. Since owning the car, i have spent most of the time in sport mode. I then spent 1 week in comfort mode and the "dip" is definitely more pronounced in comfort mode. I have since resorted back to full-time sport mode and, while it is still present even in sport mode, the quicker throttle response in sport mode makes it easier to navigate around the dip. I would say i get the dip 1x in every 10 clutch releases in sport mode, maybe 2x.

A few other thoughts now along these lines since owning the G70 6MT for over a month and over 1k miles. The dip is something you will NEED to adapt to and almost relearn your clutch/throttle workmanship to overcome, and it CAN be largely overcome as I and others are stating, but get caught asleep with it and you will get the dip. Beyond the dip, another maybe even more bothersome (to me at least) way the car drives is that right after the disengagement of the clutch and engagement of throttle, the first 3 forward gears worth of acceleration come with a noticeable "resistance of power" between 2-3.5k. I am not referring to the dip now, but moreso on turbo lag perhaps or perhaps tuning of the lower end RPM range that might be for EPA ratings. To attempt a description, starting in 1st gear, once you let all the way out on the clutch and are now rolling (assuming no "dip") when I press deeply into the throttle and the RPMS begin to rev-up, the RPMS/power freely comes on from 1.5k to 2k. Then, around 2k, i notice a feeling of "resistance" in the power until about 3.5k when the car feels freed of 200lbs it seems. While i could simply chalk this up to turbo lag or the tuning of the torque curve, it's a weird sensation because the low low end feels peppy (1.5k to 2k) but then its like someone turned on a BIG AC unit or something and i get some muddiness in the acceleration until a sensation of someone turning off the BIG AC unit occurs around 3-3.5k and the car spins up freely from there to redline. If it was purely turbo lag, i would assume the low low end would be muddy as well and the car would begin to spool and spin linearly up as the RMPs climb. Instead, what i feel is a quick surge of free power followed by a resistance of power followed by a normal buildup of power. Again, i am not referring to the initial clutch "dip."

My leading suspicions are that this is the car's tuning for MPG and hopefully can be defeated in a Genesis ECU update or Aftermarket tune. I have learned to live with the dip (although eradicating that would be amazing) but at a minimum, i would be more pleased with the low-to-mid range power band smoothed out a bit. I'd be happy with getting 15city, 24HWY (US #) if i could have a more free rev band. My car tricks you at first by letting you think you are about to blast off, then holds back some power for a few hundred RPMS before releasing ALL the power in the middle to upper RPM range. Is it a bog? idk, Is it tuning trickery to try to make the most out of 255hp? maybe. All i know is its a sensation that i wish to live without. I feel it in 1st, 2nd and 3rd during >50% throttle runs from a stop.

Anyone else?

 

[LandOfConfusion]

Yea, same here. After 1200mi and a month of ownership, I've learned to adapt. Since owning the car, i have spent most of the time in sport mode. I then spent 1 week in comfort mode and the "dip" is definitely more pronounced in comfort mode. I have since resorted back to full-time sport mode and, while it is still present even in sport mode, the quicker throttle response in sport mode makes it easier to navigate around the dip. I would say i get the dip 1x in every 10 clutch releases in sport mode, maybe 2x.

A few other thoughts now along these lines since owning the G70 6MT for over a month and over 1k miles. The dip is something you will NEED to adapt to and almost relearn your clutch/throttle workmanship to overcome, and it CAN be largely overcome as I and others are stating, but get caught asleep with it and you will get the dip. Beyond the dip, another maybe even more bothersome (to me at least) way the car drives is that right after the disengagement of the clutch and engagement of throttle, the first 3 forward gears worth of acceleration come with a noticeable "resistance of power" between 2-3.5k. I am not referring to the dip now, but moreso on turbo lag perhaps or perhaps tuning of the lower end RPM range that might be for EPA ratings. To attempt a description, starting in 1st gear, once you let all the way out on the clutch and are now rolling (assuming no "dip") when I press deeply into the throttle and the RPMS begin to rev-up, the RPMS/power freely comes on from 1.5k to 2k. Then, around 2k, i notice a feeling of "resistance" in the power until about 3.5k when the car feels freed of 200lbs it seems. While i could simply chalk this up to turbo lag or the tuning of the torque curve, it's a weird sensation because the low low end feels peppy (1.5k to 2k) but then its like someone turned on a BIG AC unit or something and i get some muddiness in the acceleration until a sensation of someone turning off the BIG AC unit occurs around 3-3.5k and the car spins up freely from there to redline. If it was purely turbo lag, i would assume the low low end would be muddy as well and the car would begin to spool and spin linearly up as the RMPs climb. Instead, what i feel is a quick surge of free power followed by a resistance of power followed by a normal buildup of power. Again, i am not referring to the initial clutch "dip."

My leading suspicions are that this is the car's tuning for MPG and hopefully can be defeated in a Genesis ECU update or Aftermarket tune. I have learned to live with the dip (although eradicating that would be amazing) but at a minimum, i would be more pleased with the low-to-mid range power band smoothed out a bit. I'd be happy with getting 15city, 24HWY (US #) if i could have a more free rev band. My car tricks you at first by letting you think you are about to blast off, then holds back some power for a few hundred RPMS before releasing ALL the power in the middle to upper RPM range. Is it a bog? idk, Is it tuning trickery to try to make the most out of 255hp? maybe. All i know is its a sensation that i wish to live without. I feel it in 1st, 2nd and 3rd during >50% throttle runs from a stop.

Anyone else?

Yes, I notice this also, and you've articulated it well. It's as if there is a small part of the powerband in which the turbo (or something) simply isn't working, but it's not a classical turbo lag sensation. When the full power sets in, around 3K or 3.5K rpm, the switch instantly flips to "on," as if a valve to the NOS bottle opened. There's a quick and sudden jerk in the drivetrain at that moment in time, regardless of what you're doing with the throttle input. Very quirky.

BTW, none of this is nearly enough to make me regret the 6MT. I love it. I do hope, however, that Genesis issues an ECU update for this.

 

[egenesis12]

Yes, I notice this also, and you've articulated it well. It's as if there is a small part of the powerband in which the turbo (or something) simply isn't working, but it's not a classical turbo lag sensation. When the full power sets in, around 3K or 3.5K rpm, the switch instantly flips to "on," as if a valve to the NOS bottle opened. There's a quick and sudden jerk in the drivetrain at that moment in time, regardless of what you're doing with the throttle input. Very quirky.

BTW, none of this is nearly enough to make me regret the 6MT. I love it. I do hope, however, that Genesis issues an ECU update for this.

YES! I Love my car and everything about it. A few tweeks would just push it that much higher. But none of these little bitches i have laid out related to the behavior have made me regret anything. Highly recommend the G70 6MT to all.

 

[Gnarlly]

Yea, same here. After 1200mi and a month of ownership, I've learned to adapt. Since owning the car, i have spent most of the time in sport mode. I then spent 1 week in comfort mode and the "dip" is definitely more pronounced in comfort mode. I have since resorted back to full-time sport mode and, while it is still present even in sport mode, the quicker throttle response in sport mode makes it easier to navigate around the dip. I would say i get the dip 1x in every 10 clutch releases in sport mode, maybe 2x.

A few other thoughts now along these lines since owning the G70 6MT for over a month and over 1k miles. The dip is something you will NEED to adapt to and almost relearn your clutch/throttle workmanship to overcome, and it CAN be largely overcome as I and others are stating, but get caught asleep with it and you will get the dip. Beyond the dip, another maybe even more bothersome (to me at least) way the car drives is that right after the disengagement of the clutch and engagement of throttle, the first 3 forward gears worth of acceleration come with a noticeable "resistance of power" between 2-3.5k. I am not referring to the dip now, but moreso on turbo lag perhaps or perhaps tuning of the lower end RPM range that might be for EPA ratings. To attempt a description, starting in 1st gear, once you let all the way out on the clutch and are now rolling (assuming no "dip") when I press deeply into the throttle and the RPMS begin to rev-up, the RPMS/power freely comes on from 1.5k to 2k. Then, around 2k, i notice a feeling of "resistance" in the power until about 3.5k when the car feels freed of 200lbs it seems. While i could simply chalk this up to turbo lag or the tuning of the torque curve, it's a weird sensation because the low low end feels peppy (1.5k to 2k) but then its like someone turned on a BIG AC unit or something and i get some muddiness in the acceleration until a sensation of someone turning off the BIG AC unit occurs around 3-3.5k and the car spins up freely from there to redline. If it was purely turbo lag, i would assume the low low end would be muddy as well and the car would begin to spool and spin linearly up as the RMPs climb. Instead, what i feel is a quick surge of free power followed by a resistance of power followed by a normal buildup of power. Again, i am not referring to the initial clutch "dip."

My leading suspicions are that this is the car's tuning for MPG and hopefully can be defeated in a Genesis ECU update or Aftermarket tune. I have learned to live with the dip (although eradicating that would be amazing) but at a minimum, i would be more pleased with the low-to-mid range power band smoothed out a bit. I'd be happy with getting 15city, 24HWY (US #) if i could have a more free rev band. My car tricks you at first by letting you think you are about to blast off, then holds back some power for a few hundred RPMS before releasing ALL the power in the middle to upper RPM range. Is it a bog? idk, Is it tuning trickery to try to make the most out of 255hp? maybe. All i know is its a sensation that i wish to live without. I feel it in 1st, 2nd and 3rd during >50% throttle runs from a stop.

Anyone else?

I notice the same power dip/resistance with my 6MT and I totally believe its a conscious attempt to increase gas mileage stats for the EPA. Kinda sad for the most pure "sport" model in the lineup. I too have learned to live with it, keeping the car in Sport mode when not on the highway, and adjusting my throttle and clutch engagement but I hope we see an ECU update some time down the road. It's my #1 complaint with the car.

 

[MorrisGray]

Are all of you with the manual transmission using regular 87 octane or premium gas?

 

[egenesis12]

Are all of you with the manual transmission using regular 87 octane or premium gas?

100% 93 octane 100% of the time. Sunoco or Exxon only for me.

 

[EdP]

100% 93 octane 100% of the time. Sunoco or Exxon only for me.

Do you think among Top Tier gas the brand makes any difference? In most cases, it is all coming out of the same tank at the terminal, just some different additive packages. Over the years I've used probably every major brand and never found a difference. Some engines, especially in older cars, really needed premium fuel, less today when designed to run on 87 octane.