Electrify America Sucks

[Kassey22000]

Really Alfer, you have to come into the EV forums with political snark? Don’t think we have enough division in society already?

 

[Alfer]

What's divisive about facts? They/he promised 1000's of EV charging stations, there are what, 4 done? Now that the supposed leader of that initiative is going to be gone very soon, where are the 1000's of stations going to come from now to assist EV drivers in dire need of them?

 

[EdP]

What's divisive about facts? They/he promised 1000's of EV charging stations, there are what, 4 done? Now that the supposed leader of that initiative is going to be gone very soon, where are the 1000's of stations going to come from now to assist EV drivers in dire need of them?

I think it is more involved than just politics. Europe has many chargers, but they also have a much different attitude. They are not stealing the cords and not blocking them with big diesel pickups. I'd not invest in a business to install and profit from their use under the conditions of drivers here. Europe has over 630,000 vs our 200,000.

 

[Looney100]

Really Alfer, you have to come into the EV forums with political snark? Don’t think we have enough division in society already?

I’m going to break from the norm here, and (somewhat) support the legitimacy of Alger’s question.
Given his history, I’m not at all surprised to see him make such a comment, but it’s fair to suggest that anything within the IRA not already complete is at substantial risk.
I wonder if this subsidy may be safe, given that Mr 47’s best friend stands to personally benefit from charging subsidies. There’s some reason that Tesla’s share price shot up 15% the day after the election. (Grift. Grift is the reason)

 

[ljnelson109]

Off peak home charging is sufficiently inexpensive to me that I just charge at home and in 18 months have yet to use EA. In my case the nearest EA charger is 4 miles away and next to a supermarket. Not much else to do while charging there. There are a couple by malls but they are probably at least 20 miles or more away.

I have an all electric home (7 tons of AC, heat pump for swimming pool, etc. etc.). The cost of charging off peak is so small, comparatively, that I can't even tell on my bills. The much bigger impact is cooking dinner during peak hours.

As I mentioned, I did my first full charge at home last week. I just got this report from my power company. I bet you can tell which day I charged the GV60. And, before you ask, I am not on time of use service so I happily plugged in when I got home from work that day.

 

[Artie Shane]

Well, well...
The fastest I've ever charged in the past has been about 204kw. This surprised and kind of delighted me. I went from about 30% to 59% in a very short period of time, but of course then it throttled back down to 178kw, and then 30kw as I got to 80%. But for all the negative about EA (and I have certainly posted some complaints), this was a very good day.

 

[CVale]

My highest was 234kW. I don't recall the starting SOC but generally don't go unless I am down below 40%. I will continue to collect data. I guess the moral of the story is, when presented with a choice, I was trying to grab the 350kW station but it doesn't sound like it buys me much.

On cooler days, I am starting the routing at least 5 miles away. The pre-conditioning has never started immediately. Again, I haven't been paying attention to figure out if it starts by time or distance.

Agree that Electrify America is just horrible. The worst.

 

[EVsquatch]

What's divisive about facts? They/he promised 1000's of EV charging stations, there are what, 4 done? Now that the supposed leader of that initiative is going to be gone very soon, where are the 1000's of stations going to come from now to assist EV drivers in dire need of them?

Why do you assume that you can snap your fingers and 1000's of EV chargers are going to appear? Funds need to be allocated, contractors need to bid and be vetted. Contracts then need to be awarded, then the work has to be permitted/zoned, etc. Infrastructure of this scale takes time.

Ask Elon musk how long it took Tesla to build out their network.
Ask Rivian who has been promising charging to their owners and has been at it since 2021 how many chargers they have installed.
Look back in history and see how long it took for the US government to subsidize and help build out gas stations.

The fact that the outgoing administration prioritized investment in EV infrastructure is a far cry from the incoming administrations threats to eliminate funding and subsidies. I'm not exactly sure the point you are trying to make other than you don't understand how long it takes to scale up massive infrastructure projects.

 

[EVsquatch]

Well, well...
The fastest I've ever charged in the past has been about 204kw. This surprised and kind of delighted me. I went from about 30% to 59% in a very short period of time, but of course then it throttled back down to 178kw, and then 30kw as I got to 80%. But for all the negative about EA (and I have certainly posted some complaints), this was a very good day.


View attachment 60658

My experience on EA the last 6 months vs the last 6 years is night and day. They have clearly gotten better and continue to get better. Let's hope they keep moving in the right direction.

 

[gvjim]

Exciting news, Tesla has finally announced that they will be installing Superchargers that support 1000v. So we should be able to get full speed charging on these stations. They won't start installing them until next year, but that's better than "someday". Hopefully in a couple of years we'll be swimming in high power 800v chargers from EA, Ionna, Tesla and more.

Tesla announces 500 kW charging as it finally delivers V4 Supercharger cabinets

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[Zcd1]

While the preponderance of evidence suggests that Electrify America has indeed mostly sucked, the situation may be improving.

Charged today at an EA 350 KW charger, and plugging in at 40% with no preconditioning, it ramped up to 198KW within a few seconds and delivered >120KW all the way to 80%. Easy peasy.

For context, thisis only about our 6th EA session since buying the car, and all but one session has been pretty decent.

 

[ljnelson109]

Our biggest EA location near me has 10 chargers. 2 of them are 350s and the rest are 150s (which we have learned are actually 175s). I have had a variety of experiences here, including the 350s not really offering much more current than the 150s.

The last two times, though, I have started the charge. The car confirmed that it started and I walked away. I received a notice from the app that there was an error and that I needed to unplug and try again. In both cases, when I went back to the car the charge was still in progress. After the charge completed the session ended as expected and I unplugged the car. BUT, in both cases, the app never reported progress or completion. Both times, the app continued to show an error. I never received the completion email and the app, once it cleared, does not show either session as happening. I am using the promotional plan, so they weren't getting money from me anyway. But the question remains, if I was a pay as you go customer, would they have charged my card for these sessions?

 

[skiingj]

Our biggest EA location near me has 10 chargers. 2 of them are 350s and the rest are 150s (which we have learned are actually 175s). I have had a variety of experiences here, including the 350s not really offering much more current than the 150s.

The last two times, though, I have started the charge. The car confirmed that it started and I walked away. I received a notice from the app that there was an error and that I needed to unplug and try again. In both cases, when I went back to the car the charge was still in progress. After the charge completed the session ended as expected and I unplugged the car. BUT, in both cases, the app never reported progress or completion. Both times, the app continued to show an error. I never received the completion email and the app, once it cleared, does not show either session as happening. I am using the promotional plan, so they weren't getting money from me anyway. But the question remains, if I was a pay as you go customer, would they have charged my card for these sessions?

Before the station upgrades in my area this error occurred once in awhile. All were 350's that never got anywhere close. Hopefully you will get upgraded soon. This website was fairly accurate when the two stations near me got upgraded a couple months ago.

Electrify America Network Updates

 

[OrthoGV60]

Could be a lot of contributing factors but I hate to see the car next to me pulling 170’s and I’m at 68kWs on a 350 charger

 

[brucek]

I have kept a chart of my EA sessions, and they all seemed decent. I think I should add an ambient temperature column since the charging seems to have slowed with lower temps. I always try to let the battery be a pre-condition. If all stalls are filled, will that cause lower charge rates?
I have done very little charging outside of these sessions.
KOP = King Of Prussia Mall, which is my closest charger but is popular. A giant street sweeper truck was charging the last time I was there. I was a little surprised to see that.

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[gvjim]

If all stalls are filled, will that cause lower charge rates?

If you are sharing a cabinet with another car, the available power will be split. The exact split depends on the charging curve of your car vs the other car, and will change over time as the SOC of each car rises. But for example if you are at a station with 4 350 stalls, the overall station probably does not have 1.4Mw available, maybe half or even less. Since on average most cars pull way less than 350, this usually works out pretty well. However at EA I think there is a fixed allocation at each pair of chargers. So if there are two cars at a 4 stall station, it's better if they are on different cabinets. Of course that isn't always possible. Some of the newer charging systems will share the power across up to 8 stalls, which is more flexible. I think Tesla v3 and v4 do this, and I think newer Kempower and Alpitronic units, but EA doesn't use these yet. Ionna is going to use Alpitronic.

BTW, I love your spreadsheet. Very organized.

 

[steveinarizona]

I have kept a chart of my EA sessions, and they all seemed decent. I think I should add an ambient temperature column since the charging seems to have slowed with lower temps. I always try to let the battery be a pre-condition. If all stalls are filled, will that cause lower charge rates?
I have done very little charging outside of these sessions.
KOP = King Of Prussia Mall, which is my closest charger but is popular. A giant street sweeper truck was charging the last time I was there. I was a little surprised to see that.

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View attachment 60906

These are terrific results. With fast charging like this, one really doesn't need a bigger battery (so long, of course, that there are a reasonable number of fast chargers available).

Thanks for this.

 

[EVsquatch]

These are terrific results. With fast charging like this, one really doesn't need a bigger battery (so long, of course, that there are a reasonable number of fast chargers available).

Thanks for this.

You hit the nail on the head. People put too much emphasis on the size of the battery and not the charging speed and efficiency. When I was evaluating my 2023 GV60P I was not impressed with the EPA rated 235 miles of range (even though Edmunds in their independent testing got a number closer to 274 which is much more palatable). What I was impressed with is the 800v architecture and the ability to charge from 10-80% at a 350 kW charger in 18 minutes.

I have never hit the 18 minute mark, but I have gotten close (19-20). It has been fast enough that I have been usually shocked how quickly the 30 minute free session ends and we have to rush our rest stop to go out and end the session to not be charged.

On efficiency - in temperatures ranging from 55-100 degrees I have averaged 3.6 kWh over the last 3,000 miles of ownership in mixed driving. I have the vehicle in a custom driving mode with eco settings for the drivetrain and comfort/sport for everything else. I leave the regen at level 3 unless on the highway where I take it down to 0.

I have yet to own and drive the vehicle in cold weather so it will be interesting to see what I get for efficiency.

 

[EVsquatch]

I have kept a chart of my EA sessions, and they all seemed decent. I think I should add an ambient temperature column since the charging seems to have slowed with lower temps. I always try to let the battery be a pre-condition. If all stalls are filled, will that cause lower charge rates?
I have done very little charging outside of these sessions.
KOP = King Of Prussia Mall, which is my closest charger but is popular. A giant street sweeper truck was charging the last time I was there. I was a little surprised to see that.

​

View attachment 60906

Thanks for posting this. Ambient temperatures would be a very good data point to add including the average speed you achieved for the session, how long you maintained the max speed, and whether or not you preconditioned.

Great stuff and keep up the good work!

 

[Looney100]

Thanks for posting this. Ambient temperatures would be a very good data point to add including the average speed you achieved for the session, how long you maintained the max speed, and whether or not you preconditioned.

Great stuff and keep up the good work!

Battery temperatures are what is important. With preconditioning, the correlation between the two is shaky.