Concerns about Surcharge

[Jbgv60]

What dealership in NJ did you contact? I spoke with one in NJ and they assured me the GV60 would not be marked up over MSRP, that their dealership has a policy against it.

 

[Jbgv60]

Called my Genesis dealer in NJ, and they told me they are expecting to put a $8,000 markup on the GV60 when it releases.

Called Genesis Concierge "Priority One" and they said they don't care about what the dealer does.

Get your act together Genesis! This entire process feels bootleg and is the opposite of what "luxury" should be.

Recommend calling Priority One and making the complaint about dealers charging above MSRP. It would at least force them to think about it.

What NJ dealership are you referring to? I called my local Genesis dealership in South Jersey last week and they assured me that if they get my Priority One allocation that they will not charge over MSRP (said it’s their policy doing so).

 

[jimmyricardo92]

This is hilarious people arguing about a car that isn't even released yet lol. You guys have way to much time.

 

[Looney100]

I read an article a couple months ago that said that of all the various BRANDS of new vehicles in the US, only four or so of them had sold vehicles for less than sticker price (on average). This is simple supply and demand. Sellers of goods (generally) get to decide what their price is, and we buyers get to decide whether or not we're going to pay that. No need to get worked up about it.

What's the difference for us between the car having a $100 sticker price and the dealer charging $20 above that, and a $120 sticker price and buying at MSRP? In either case the car is ours if we're willing to pay $120, we get to decide whether or not to do so.

A few years ago, I was shopping for a somewhat exclusive vehicle. I did my research and pulled dealer cost data, incentives, etc. and went to negotiate. Dealer offered me some token amount off MSRP, which left a tonne of money in their pocket. From their perspective, they only got a few vehicles in each year, and if I didn't buy it, someone else would, so why would they offer me much of a discount? There was no reason for me to get upset at that, it's just how a profit-seeking business works. I chose not to buy. They sold that vehicle to someone else that was willing to pay the price, and found one elsewhere that was just a couple months old and saved a huge amount of money. Win-win.

 

[azurecardinal]

So you admit that you distorted what Genesis told you. Just because you are angry doesn’t mean you have a “license to lie.”

I can't tell if you're just a troll, or is a dealer.

 

[azurecardinal]

What NJ dealership are you referring to? I called my local Genesis dealership in South Jersey last week and they assured me that if they get my Priority One allocation that they will not charge over MSRP (said it’s their policy doing so).

Genesis Freehold. Which is surprising because they are usually very reputable.

 

[PMCErnie]

I can't tell if you're just a troll, or is a dealer.

Just a guy who doesn’t like distorted info like you gave us in post #1.

 

[azurecardinal]

Just a guy who doesn’t like distorted info like you gave us in post #1.

First of all, Ford and GMC both care about what their dealer does and actively worked to prevent surcharging on electric vehicle orders, and is successfully at it. When Genesis says "we're not in control," it means that they "don't care" enough for all intents and purposes, as it is exactly what comes off to their customers.

Secondly, I find it exceptionally interesting how many people like you are defending an absolutely atrocious practice by the derelict industry of sleezy auto dealers. You wouldn't happen to have some skin in the scalping game, would you? Why don't you argue for change instead of focusing on pedantics?

 

[azurecardinal]

I read an article a couple months ago that said that of all the various BRANDS of new vehicles in the US, only four or so of them had sold vehicles for less than sticker price (on average). This is simple supply and demand. Sellers of goods (generally) get to decide what their price is, and we buyers get to decide whether or not we're going to pay that. No need to get worked up about it.

What's the difference for us between the car having a $100 sticker price and the dealer charging $20 above that, and a $120 sticker price and buying at MSRP? In either case the car is ours if we're willing to pay $120, we get to decide whether or not to do so.

A few years ago, I was shopping for a somewhat exclusive vehicle. I did my research and pulled dealer cost data, incentives, etc. and went to negotiate. Dealer offered me some token amount off MSRP, which left a tonne of money in their pocket. From their perspective, they only got a few vehicles in each year, and if I didn't buy it, someone else would, so why would they offer me much of a discount? There was no reason for me to get upset at that, it's just how a profit-seeking business works. I chose not to buy. They sold that vehicle to someone else that was willing to pay the price, and found one elsewhere that was just a couple months old and saved a huge amount of money. Win-win.

The difference here is that the dealer does not set the MSRP, and it's a number set by the manufacturer with dealer profits already baked in.

What is happening here is akin to if Best Buy sold PS5s at $700 ($200 over MSRP) due to "supply and demand." No reputable merchant should ever charge over MSRP, and these car dealership markups are much more like scalpers than merchants.

Just because "it's a car" and "it's been done before" doesn't mean us consumers should accept the status quo. The general attitude of "just accept the situation" in here is frankly disgusting.

 

[Cptstnkpnts]

First of all, Ford and GMC both care about what their dealer does and actively worked to prevent surcharging on electric vehicle orders, and is successfully at it. When Genesis says "we're not in control," it means that they "don't care" enough for all intents and purposes, as it is exactly what comes off to their customers.

Secondly, I find it exceptionally interesting how many people like you are defending an absolutely atrocious practice by the derelict industry of sleezy auto dealers. You wouldn't happen to have some skin in the scalping game, would you? Why don't you argue for change instead of focusing on pedantics?

You are getting up in arms over something that has not happened yet. They haven't even announced pricing and you are upset about them charging over MSRP. I've been following this thread and PMCErnie is right you are spinning this as negatively as you can with absolutely zero information. Not to mention you joined the site on Monday and you have exclusively posted to this thread. Who is the real troll here?

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[EdP]

First of all, Ford and GMC both care about what their dealer does and actively worked to prevent surcharging on electric vehicle orders, and is successfully at it. When Genesis says "we're not in control," it means that they "don't care" enough for all intents and purposes, as it is exactly what comes off to their customers.

Wow, quite a spin. They told you the absolute truth and you spin it the way you want. Are you familiar with the auto dealer franchise laws? FACT is, Genesis is not in control.

You spoke with a customer service rep, not the policy makers at Genesis. Would you rather he lied to you? Made up a fascinating story of how they plan to control dealers and get around the law?

 

[Looney100]

Auto dealers in the US are a powerful lobby. This is why, despite almost everyone hating the sales model, it is still the primary method by which people acquire vehicles. Dealers are often local business people that employ a significant number of staff, and therefore wield a lot of power.
MSRP = Manufacturer's SUGGESTED Retail Price. It is just a suggestion, and the ability for one party to force another party to sell an item at a certain price is severely limited in law - regardless of the industry.
I don't like dealers any more than most, but I don't begrudge them their ability to decide their own selling prices and take advantage of favourable market conditions. We consumers certainly don't have trouble taking advantage when things are in our favour.

 

[kqian111]

If dealers weren't marking up prices in this crazy market, then the scalpers surely will flip them at market value. Why would the dealers watch this on the sidelines and let some schmuck pocket the difference?

This is just capitalism at work.

 

[Looney100]

If dealers weren't marking up prices in this crazy market, then the scalpers surely will flip them at market value. Why would the dealers watch this on the sidelines and let some schmuck pocket the difference?

This is just capitalism at work.

Also, vehicle supply is limited. Dealers and sales people have fewer vehicles to sell, so need more margin per unit to keep the lights on.

 

[mc137]

Also, vehicle supply is limited. Dealers and sales people have fewer vehicles to sell, so need more margin per unit to keep the lights on.

Sure. But everyone has record profits right now because the improvement in margins has far exceeded the reduction in inventory. Keeping the lights on is not a problem.

Yes it is capitalism. Just another instance of short term market exploitation with a bet the long term market strategy is not hurt that badly. Kia learned what can happen. Their dealers killed the market intention of the Stinger.

Given the Genesis project of establishing a luxury cachet, the calculation is more difficult because of the bottom-of-the-barrel dealer network reputation (at least in the US).

 

[kqian111]

At the end of the day, a car purchase is transactional in nature and no one is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to buy if you feel it's overvalued. Just like you probably don't want to buy a house in this crazy hot market regardless if purchasing from a big box builder or a private seller. And if you did buy, you may have buyer's remorse but the decision was yours.

In a few years when all this boils over, are you going to think back to how mfg/dealers tried to rake you over the coals when they had the market power or will you be basing your future purchasing decisions on circumstances at that time? Probably the latter.

 

[EdP]

In a few years when all this boils over, are you going to think back to how mfg/dealers tried to rake you over the coals when they had the market power or will you be basing your future purchasing decisions on circumstances at that time? Probably the latter.

Dealers, yes. How are the manufacturers raking you over the coals? You did mention both.

 

[mc137]

At the end of the day, a car purchase is transactional in nature and no one is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to buy if you feel it's overvalued. Just like you probably don't want to buy a house in this crazy hot market regardless if purchasing from a big box builder or a private seller. And if you did buy, you may have buyer's remorse but the decision was yours.

In a few years when all this boils over, are you going to think back to how mfg/dealers tried to rake you over the coals when they had the market power or will you be basing your future purchasing decisions on circumstances at that time? Probably the latter.

There is a lot you assume in saying a car purchase is only transactional. For you business might be just that - like buying vegetables. Speaking for myself, I never consider future business with someone I think who is being unfair. To repeat, right now dealers have never been more profitable.

I do agree with you that dealers have the right to charge whatever they wish. That said, it is telling those dealers don't have the gonads to advertise their price so consumers can make a choice in a marketplace. How would you feel if the asking price of your vegetables was not known until you were checking out - it's transactional after all.

The higher order bit is this: Genesis has the challenge of building loyalty to a luxury brand. This tactical thinking by dealers is not helpful.

 

[PMCErnie]

There is a lot you assume in saying a car purchase is only transactional. For you business might be just that - like buying vegetables. Speaking for myself, I never consider future business with someone I think who is being unfair. To repeat, right now dealers have never been more profitable.

I do agree with you that dealers have the right to charge whatever they wish. That said, it is telling those dealers don't have the gonads to advertise their price so consumers can make a choice in a marketplace. How would you feel if the asking price of your vegetables was not known until you were checking out - it's transactional after all.

The higher order bit is this: Genesis has the challenge of building loyalty to a luxury brand. This tactical thinking by dealers is not helpful.

Your faulty logic assumes that dealers have vehicles to sell. Given the empty lots these days, most dealers do not have inventory. You must be aware of the reasons by now.

 

[rickcinyyc]

There is a lot you assume in saying a car purchase is only transactional. For you business might be just that - like buying vegetables. Speaking for myself, I never consider future business with someone I think who is being unfair. To repeat, right now dealers have never been more profitable.

I do agree with you that dealers have the right to charge whatever they wish. That said, it is telling those dealers don't have the gonads to advertise their price so consumers can make a choice in a marketplace. How would you feel if the asking price of your vegetables was not known until you were checking out - it's transactional after all.

The higher order bit is this: Genesis has the challenge of building loyalty to a luxury brand. This tactical thinking by dealers is not helpful.

The one area I'd disagree with you is that dealers have never been more profitable. That may be true for some, but most are hurting in two areas. Used car sales are almost non-existent due to lack of inventory, and sales volume is lower for new cars due to lack of supply. That lack of supply is especially hurting "high volume, low margin" dealers who depend on sheer numbers to profit. When there are fewer cars to sell, they aren't coming out ahead.