Genesis's giving up on V8 development

[jimmy buoy]

I'm just glad to have my 5.0 Genesis, and plan on keeping it for many years to come! There's something about having that V8 rumbling under the hood that just makes me feel like I'm driving something special, top shelf. I'll be like one of the old farts out there that still have their V8 Ford Crown Vic's and keep them like new, only the Genny is quite a different animal than the Vic!

 

[Starflyer]

A twin turbo 6 cylinder with electric boost will offer better performance while being able to be available in more markets; and hence, get a better ROI - which is the point, isn't it?

WOW! Electric boost? Didn't know that existed. Must kick in a lot quicker. Wondering if it runs cooler as well since no hot gases spinning the turbo.

 

[YEH]

^ While was talking about additional HP/torque from an electric motor, there is also turbo systems where electric power spins the turbos (before the gases take over), so no turbo lag.

 

[carguy75]

Who really cars whether you get to 60 1 second quicker? I'm betting most Genesis drivers could care less.

I care, however you are right that most Genesis drivers really do not care I bet to have a car that accelerates from 0-60 in 5 seconds or less. Especially ones that buy a Genesis G80 or G90.

The G70 crowd would most likely be the performance seekers demographically speaking due to age and the car type.

 

[carguy75]

high powered n/a v8s are like a work of art. wish they kept it going.

Well said.

Plus, a well designed N/A V8 engine generally gives a long trouble free life to owners that really want a dependable ride that last decades. Turbocharged engines are usually less reliably pass 100k miles and are expensive to repair out-of-warranty in most cases.

 

[carguy75]

In 10 years we will be driving either electrics or 4 cylinder. The G90 will be a big car, the size of a Sonata.

Sound like the 80's where most V8 engines was killed off for more economical engines even in high performance models. Dare I say the Mustang II. Dark times, even though I was not driving during that time period. Gradually, V8 muscle returned in the 90's. The same will happen again. N/A V8 engines will never completely die off, especially under the GM banner.

However, it will not be Hyundai that keep making N/A V8 or V6 engines. In 10years, the Genesis will be powered by a 400hp turbo/supercharged electric motor assisted 1.6L inline four engine that makes 40mpg city/40 mpg highway.

 

[Goaterguy]

^ And no matter how you frame it, it will end up being a poor "investment" for them, just as the Blackwing is for GM.

Or the Mirai

 

[Starflyer]

With the high cost of fuel in other counties (over $10 a gallon), and regulations for higher and higher fleet averages in the US plus gas guzzlers, the V8 is dead issue in the coming years. And the amazing gas mileage and performance that the new V6's and 4's have is the final coffin nail.

I just saw a piece about a new Cadillac straight 4 that does 0-60 in about 5 seconds. And then there's all the new electrics as well. The main advantage with the V8 is smooth quiet power without a turbo.

 

[Kraig Wilkinson]

With the high cost of fuel in other counties (over $10 a gallon), and regulations for higher and higher fleet averages in the US plus gas guzzlers, the V8 is dead issue in the coming years. And the amazing gas mileage and performance that the new V6's and 4's have is the final coffin nail.

I just saw a piece about a new Cadillac straight 4 that does 0-60 in about 5 seconds. And then there's all the new electrics as well. The main advantage with the V8 is smooth quiet power without a turbo.

V8s are dead! My V8s are alive and well. I suppose I will just keep them going. My grandson will be inheriting a lot of gas guzzlers!

 

[carguy75]

With the high cost of fuel in other counties (over $10 a gallon), and regulations for higher and higher fleet averages in the US plus gas guzzlers, the V8 is dead issue in the coming years. And the amazing gas mileage and performance that the new V6's and 4's have is the final coffin nail.

I just saw a piece about a new Cadillac straight 4 that does 0-60 in about 5 seconds. And then there's all the new electrics as well. The main advantage with the V8 is smooth quiet power without a turbo.

LOL. V8 engines will never die any time soon. They will have smaller displacement and be force-inducted by many of the true luxury brands(BMW,Mercedes,Audi, etc) due to performance expectations those companies are know for and must provide since their customer base usually do not care much about gas mileage as the do performance specs and refinement. Noisy turbo-charged 4 and 6 cylinder engines will not cut it in a $100K S-class or 7 series.

However, most other automakers will just go with direct injected turbocharged 4 and 6 cylinder engines for their top of the line performance models.

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[EdP]

LOL. V8 engines will never die any time soon. They will have smaller displacement and be force-inducted by many of the true luxury brands(BMW,Mercedes,Audi, etc) due to performance expectations those companies are know for and must provide since their customer base usually do not care much about gas mileage as the do performance specs and refinement. Noisy turbo-charged 4 and 6 cylinder engines will not cut it in a $100K S-class or 7 series.

However, most other automakers will just go with direct injected turbocharged 4 and 6 cylinder engines for their top of the line performance models.

Don't forget electric. The EU is really pushing hard on emissions, Germany is mandating all gas stations have electric chargers.

Like the concept or not, they are smooth, quiet, and have great acceleration.

 

[Starflyer]

...customer base usually do not care much about gas mileage as the do performance specs and refinement. Noisy turbo-charged 4 and 6 cylinder engines will not cut it in a $100K S-class or 7 series.

They may not care about gas mileage, but world governments (including the US) do care and will either tax or legislate V8's out of existence. Me, I don't care as I'm a low mileage driver (less than 5000k yearly). If my '18 G80 Sport had a V8 option, I probably would have gone for one as I'm not big fan of turbos.

I wouldn't bet against seeing some new rules in 2021, depending on how the election this fall goes. It may not rivil the madness after the French Revolution of 1789, but there will be CHANGE.

 

[MG8]

naturally aspirated more impressive

 

[MG8]

Well said.

Plus, a well designed N/A V8 engine generally gives a long trouble free life to owners that really want a dependable ride that last decades. Turbocharged engines are usually less reliably pass 100k miles and are expensive to repair out-of-warranty in most cases.

agree, more parts that will eventually go out and have to replace.

 

[carguy75]

Don't forget electric. The EU is really pushing hard on emissions, Germany is mandating all gas stations have electric chargers.

Like the concept or not, they are smooth, quiet, and have great acceleration.

Good point. Electric motors are becoming better and better. Tesla is leading the way, however the Tesla cars are expensive and fall part(interior,rust,etc) due to cost cutting to reduce the price due to the expensive battery/motor components. The battery replacement on an older Tesla also can cost as much as an new small compact car. The electric car still has a long way to go before it becomes mainstream.

Hell, imagine that you had electrical grid black-out after a storm that lasts a few days in your area, how would charge your car? You will be stranded at home until you can charge your electric car if it is your only ride. However, I am sure the electric car tech will improve as battery life increases.

 

[carguy75]

They may not care about gas mileage, but world governments (including the US) do care and will either tax or legislate V8's out of existence. Me, I don't care as I'm a low mileage driver (less than 5000k yearly). If my '18 G80 Sport had a V8 option, I probably would have gone for one as I'm not big fan of turbos.

I wouldn't bet against seeing some new rules in 2021, depending on how the election this fall goes. It may not rivil the madness after the French Revolution of 1789, but there will be CHANGE.

Well I am sure the big luxury brands will just create a fuel efficient 20-speed automatic transmission, add high performance force induction to a highly advanced 3.5L(or smaller) V8 so the car can do 0-60mph in 2 seconds while satisfying the bare minimum MPG required by regulation when the time comes.

V8 engines are well balanced for smooth operation even when making a lot of power, so luxury brands will keep them around for a long time to satisfy their customer base expectations. Even the current 2020 G90 still has the 5.0 V8 as an option, so even Genesis knows that it can not sell a true luxury car without a V8 engine.

 

[SuperKing]

Why don't they make more straight 6's instead of V6's, I'd take that a straight 6 hybrid if a V8 is no longer an option. A straight 6 is about as smooth as a V8 but still makes the wrong noises. No turbos though, had 3 turbo cars in the past and I'm done with the issues turbochargers bring.

 

[EdP]

Good point. Electric motors are becoming better and better. Tesla is leading the way, however the Tesla cars are expensive and fall part(interior,rust,etc) due to cost cutting to reduce the price due to the expensive battery/motor components. The battery replacement on an older Tesla also can cost as much as an new small compact car. The electric car still has a long way to go before it becomes mainstream.

Hell, imagine that you had electrical grid black-out after a storm that lasts a few days in your area, how would charge your car? You will be stranded at home until you can charge your electric car if it is your only ride. However, I am sure the electric car tech will improve as battery life increases.

Another issue so far is what to do with the old batteries. Unless they can be recycled there will be landfills loaded with them. Not to mention cobalt mining

In time, much can be overcome but I'm not buying one yet. The power grid thing is not a problem. There will be generators operated by a treadmill or bicycle. Walk ten miles on the treadmill and charge the battery enough for a 2 mile ride to the grocery store.

 

[Aquineas]

Yeah I think V8s are doomed (as are ICEs in general, but that's further out). Lexus dropped theirs, Genesis will eventually drop theirs, the Germans will probably go V6 TT Hybrid or pure electric. They've definitely taken notice of how much success Tesla has had in Europe (particularly in Norway) and I can't imagine they're happy about it. Don't get me wrong, I loved my 5.0 and miss the butta smoothness. But it was a long-legged engine, with things not getting interesting until about 3200 RPM. There's a bit of wait at a stoplight when you sometimes need it now. What's ironic about that is that the previous iteration 5.0 that was in the 2012-2014 Genesis had even longer legs.

 

[Backslack]

Why don't they make more straight 6's instead of V6's, I'd take that a straight 6 hybrid if a V8 is no longer an option. A straight 6 is about as smooth as a V8 but still makes the wrong noises. No turbos though, had 3 turbo cars in the past and I'm done with the issues turbochargers bring.

It's because of packaging issues. Straight 6's have to be mounted longitudinally, require a long hood, and can't be used in smaller vehicles. That problem is compounded when you have to make space for turbos as well, and pretty much all straight 6's nowadays have turbos. Genesis/Lexus use twin turbos for their 6-cylinders while the Germans only use a twin scroll. The latter requires much less space, meaning more room for the inline 6.

Genesis was able to shove in a straight 6 diesel into a GV80, but I don't believe that was turbocharged.