Is my Genesis Dealer trying to pull a bait and switch?

[KusaKusa]

Aren't sellers and vendors accountable for paying taxes on their sales profits? I'd imagine it's their problem, not yours.

 

[PFWiz]

I don't understand the problem.
Do you have the car?
If they call asking for more money (this has happened to me) simply say no. When they tell you that "you have to pay" tell them they can come to your place and take the car. It is even better if you had a trade in. Then you can tell them they need to return that car in the same condition it was given to them. (It is always fun when they tell you they have already wholesaled it).
There is a 99% chance they will either fix it or eat it. They desperately don't want the car back.
You just need to learn to play the game, my wife and I actually think it is fun....

 

[Unprocessed1]

I don't understand the problem.
Do you have the car?
If they call asking for more money (this has happened to me) simply say no. When they tell you that "you have to pay" tell them they can come to your place and take the car. It is even better if you had a trade in. Then you can tell them they need to return that car in the same condition it was given to them. (It is always fun when they tell you they have already wholesaled it).
There is a 99% chance they will either fix it or eat it. They desperately don't want the car back.
You just need to learn to play the game, my wife and I actually think it is fun....

Didn't have a trade in. But I live 200 miles away my car is parked in a gated three level parking garage. Also, the car had 600 miles on it when I got it, and would have more than 1000 if I returned it to the dealership.

 

[Unprocessed1]

Does Genesis send customers satisfaction surveys? Wondering if they’re sent by the dealer or corporate.

 

[csu87]

Aren't sellers and vendors accountable for paying taxes on their sales profits? I'd imagine it's their problem, not yours.

not usually when buying cars.

I buy most my cars out of state, and have never paid sales tax to the dealer; always to my state when i go to register it. Dealers can estimate what taxes youll owe and have you pay at the time of purchase and then they send that amount to your home state, but you are still responsible for the remainder if they estimated low.

Its why a lot of people set up an address in Montana for exotics. No state sales tax.

 

[csu87]

I don't understand the problem.
Do you have the car?
If they call asking for more money (this has happened to me) simply say no. When they tell you that "you have to pay" tell them they can come to your place and take the car. It is even better if you had a trade in. Then you can tell them they need to return that car in the same condition it was given to them. (It is always fun when they tell you they have already wholesaled it).
There is a 99% chance they will either fix it or eat it. They desperately don't want the car back.
You just need to learn to play the game, my wife and I actually think it is fun....

It probably wont be the Dealer calling and asking for money, it will probably be his home state sending him a bill when he tries to get it registered.

Again, what the dealer did is shady (changing the sales price of the car on the signed paperwork from the unsigned and not legally binding price sheet) but at the end of the day, the customer is the one that is responsible for paying the proper taxes in their jurisdiction unless the dealer expressly has in the contract that the dealer will handle all state/local taxes and fees

 

[EdP]

It probably wont be the Dealer calling and asking for money, it will probably be his home state sending him a bill when he tries to get it registered.

Again, what the dealer did is shady (changing the sales price of the car on the signed paperwork from the unsigned and not legally binding price sheet) but at the end of the day, the customer is the one that is responsible for paying the proper taxes in their jurisdiction unless the dealer expressly has in the contract that the dealer will handle all state/local taxes and fees

Its a lease. Won't they be billing the actual owner?

 

[jetrep]

I suspect some posters aren't fully understanding the issue as these things vary by state and most people have never bought a car out of state. If one was buying a car within their state and the dealer is handling registration and taxes this would be more cut and dry.

Often when buying out of state you pay the sales tax to the selling state. Let's say that's 6%. The dealer doesn't typically handle the registration since it's out of state. It's on you to take care of registration and make sure taxes are covered in your state. If the sales tax in your state is 6% or less you're all good; most states will deduct what you paid in tax in the other state. If sales tax in your state is 8% you still have to come up with the 2% payable to your state at time of registration.

It sounds like what this selling dealer did is a slick and very sleazy way of duping an out of state buyer. They couldn't pull this off for in-state customers.

If I'm interpreting correctly they actually are screwing the buyer from two sides....they are effectively raising the purchase price effectively raising the tax burden and less than anticipated tax has been paid since the buyer was expecting 100% of taxes to be covered in the original estimate.

 

[Unprocessed1]

I suspect some posters aren't fully understanding the issue as these things vary by state and most people have never bought a car out of state. If one was buying a car within their state and the dealer is handling registration and taxes this would be more cut and dry.

Often when buying out of state you pay the sales tax to the selling state. Let's say that's 6%. The dealer doesn't typically handle the registration since it's out of state. It's on you to take care of registration and make sure taxes are covered in your state. If the sales tax in your state is 6% or less you're all good; most states will deduct what you paid in tax in the other state. If sales tax in your state is 8% you still have to come up with the 2% payable to your state at time of registration.

It sounds like what this selling dealer did is a slick and very sleazy way of duping an out of state buyer. They couldn't pull this off for in-state customers.

If I'm interpreting correctly they actually are screwing the buyer from two sides....they are effectively raising the purchase price effectively raising the tax burden and less than anticipated tax has been paid since the buyer was expecting 100% of taxes to be covered in the original estimate.

Exactly. And they covered the full and proper state sales tax in their quote.

 

[csu87]

I suspect some posters aren't fully understanding the issue as these things vary by state and most people have never bought a car out of state. If one was buying a car within their state and the dealer is handling registration and taxes this would be more cut and dry.

Often when buying out of state you pay the sales tax to the selling state. Let's say that's 6%. The dealer doesn't typically handle the registration since it's out of state. It's on you to take care of registration and make sure taxes are covered in your state. If the sales tax in your state is 6% or less you're all good; most states will deduct what you paid in tax in the other state. If sales tax in your state is 8% you still have to come up with the 2% payable to your state at time of registration.

It sounds like what this selling dealer did is a slick and very sleazy way of duping an out of state buyer. They couldn't pull this off for in-state customers.

If I'm interpreting correctly they actually are screwing the buyer from two sides....they are effectively raising the purchase price effectively raising the tax burden and less than anticipated tax has been paid since the buyer was expecting 100% of taxes to be covered in the original estimate.

Definitely is state dependent, but for every car ive purchased out of state (bought in Idaho, Texas, Oklahoma and Arizona while living in Colorado) I havent had to pay that states sales tax and only paid sales tax for colorado when i went and registered it. The final sales price and contract has no taxes added so you can avoid overpaying taxes, since its much harder to get the overpayment back. This is the case in many states and is the reason why people set up residency in states like montana that dont have sales tax for high dollar cars. There is a whole industry for people wanting to avoid taxes on cars and setting up residency in the couple states that dont charge sales tax.

The bolded is the issue. Dealer pulled a fast one, customer didnt catch it. Can he go back to the dealer and get them to change it, maybe. but its most likely going to be a battle. especially for someone who is out of state and the dealer most likely doesnt see them as a repeat customer.

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[csu87]

Its a lease. Won't they be billing the actual owner?

depends on how Virginia handles it. I havent looked at virginias laws on it, but a lot of states put the burden on the person registering and using the vehicle.

 

[Unprocessed1]

Any downside to sending a text to the sales manager letting him know I noticed the discrepancy between the quote and the lease, which is not what we agreed to, and will not be pleased if I’m going to be billed $1300 in additional sales tax?

 

[EdP]

depends on how Virginia handles it. I havent looked at virginias laws on it, but a lot of states put the burden on the person registering and using the vehicle.

I only ever leased one car in CT. It was registered to GMAC, not me.

Who actually owns a leased vehicle?
When you lease a car, you have no ownership interest in the vehicle. The title is kept by the leasing company, and you'll have specific limits on how you can use it, how many miles you can drive without a penalty, how you are expected to maintain it, and what condition it must be returned in.

 

[Bill in Alexandria]

You should ALWAYS read your contracts carefully (which you did). Stealerships play a lot of games. I actually had a very smooth and pleasant transaction (beginning to end was less than 45 minutes) with my local used car dealership.

However, my credit union made a "mistake" on my loan with an additional percentage point than what we had agreed upon, which I pointed out and they corrected.

Why are "mistakes" always in their favor?????

 

[EdP]

Any downside to sending a text to the sales manager letting him know I noticed the discrepancy between the quote and the lease, which is not what we agreed to, and will not be pleased if I’m going to be billed $1300 in additional sales tax?

I'd not open that possible can of worms. My reply to anything would be "not my problem"

 

[Etex]

Any downside to sending a text to the sales manager letting him know I noticed the discrepancy between the quote and the lease, which is not what we agreed to, and will not be pleased if I’m going to be billed $1300 in additional sales tax?

Hold on, I have a possible explanation to your numbers & you may be ok. Did you put down $4,000?

 

[Unprocessed1]

Hold on, I have a possible explanation to your numbers & you may be ok. Did you put down $4,000?

I actually put down down almost $8k (would never out that much down on a lease but it all came from my old lease that I sold for a nice profit).

 

[Etex]

I actually put down down almost $8k (would never out that much down on a lease but it all came from my old lease that I sold for a nice profit).

Ok, you have $2,629.26 in 1st pmt + fees.
Dealer is claiming $1,257.11 of financed taxes (actual difference $60,102.11 - $58,825 = $1,277.11). If approx $4,000 went towards reducing price (principal) down, in order to get lower pmts, they may have not applied all $ towards taxes, and rolled the remainder into the lease.

 

[Unprocessed1]

Ok, you have $2,629.26 in 1st pmt + fees.
Dealer is claiming $1,257.11 of financed taxes (actual difference $60,102.11 - $58,825 = $1,277.11). If approx $4,000 went towards reducing price (principal) down, in order to get lower pmts, they may have not applied all $ towards taxes, and rolled the remainder into the lease.

I don’t think that would make a difference in terms of what they apply it to since everything would just get added together to calculate the monthly payment. Also doesn’t explain the marked up sales price.

I do know they applied part of the down payment to the fees so the “capitalized reduction” on the lease is about $2k less than my down payment.

 

[tarhoosier]

I think this shows how confusing to a buyer/lessee this transaction can be. We are combining our experience and knowledge and still struggling to explain.
Edit: Especially if the seller is TRYING to be confusing