Rough Ride (rear)

[bishop666]

Have any of you noticed a difference in the road smoothing capability (i.e. ride) between the 6 and 8 cylinder versions of the Genesis? I test drove a 6 cylinder version and found the ride to be quite smooth the 8 cylinder that I have just taken delivery of, however, is clearly not and remains a bone of contention due to the selling dealer's apparent non-disclosure of said difference!

 

[DesertGen]

Have any of you noticed a difference in the road smoothing capability (i.e. ride) between the 6 and 8 cylinder versions of the Genesis? I test drove a 6 cylinder version and found the ride to be quite smooth the 8 cylinder that I have just taken delivery of, however, is clearly not and remains a bone of contention due to the selling dealer's apparent non-disclosure of said difference!

I had just the opposite impression. Was planning on buying a V6, having test drove one twice (powerful enough for my needs). On a whim I asked to drive the V8 for comparison sake and I was blown away by how much nicer it was in nearly every way. It was quieter, smoother, and better riding imho. The only negative (not much of a negative) was that the gas pedal response on the V8 seemed to have a little lag. However, now that I have owned it for a week and a half I have no issues at all. Love the car, the look, the ride, the sound, everything.

 

[bishop666]

It is interesting to note your contrasting opinion. Have you noticed any significant tire noise? I have noticed a considerable amount of tire noise on smooth, concrete paved roads that can be heard quite distinctly over the Genesis w/Tech pkg sound system. According to our local representative it is a known issue that they are "looking into."

 

[VaiFan]

I think we need a poll.
This needs to be broken down in to 17" wheels
18" wheels
V6 vs. V8

My suspicion is that the V8 with 18" wheels and a thicker rear sway bar ride harsher than the V6.

I wonder if the rear sway is the the main culprit here?

I would be willing to swap rear sway bars temporarely as an experiment with someone that has a V8 in order to check it out.

 

[Calvin]

VaiFan;

I agree, maybe a poll would show us some differences between the 6 and 8 and location in the country etc.

 

[thomaspf]

If you want differentiation by country I think you should add the air springs to your matrix. I am not sure but I don't think you can buy the Genesis in Korea without the air springs?

Makes you wonder ...


Cheers

Thomas

 

[Michael_S]

As people noted earlier in the discussion, the Genesis sedans are shipped from Korea with the tires over-inflated. This is done on purpose, because it helps prevent tire damage while the cars are stationary in boats, trucks, and trains in transit.

Once the vehicle arrives at a dealer, the tires are supposed to be drained down to the recommended tire pressure. But sometimes they forget, or they don't drain enough air out.

So the only way you can compare a test drive in a V6 and a V8 is if you check the tire pressure yourself first. Otherwise, one or both could have over-inflated tires, which seriously influence ride quality.

 

[VaiFan]

if someone puts up a poll, a stipulation for participation should be that you have been using manufacturer's recommended PSI in the tires for at least a week or two before voting.

 

[keithl]

I have been on the fence the last week about pulling the trigger ona V6 Tech Genesis. And after reading this thread and others like it and some of the reviews I see a pattern. I have driven the car several times and they even gave me a laoner for 2 days. I don't beleive the tires are that much to blame. This is clearly some bad design choices on dialing in the suspenstion. I find the car is trying to give a soft smooth ride while still handling very well. The problem is the Hyundai engineers missed the boat on this. I find the car gets a tad choppy at times. I am sure it has to do with spring rates, shock valving and dampening. My guess is the 2010 or surely by 2011 we'll see a retuned suspension. I believe from what I am reading the V8 is worse than the V6. I know it seems as if part of the suspension is reacting to some conditions faster than others, yet they are tuned togther so you get this choppy feel on some rougher roads. I have not tried any road yet that has the rythmic issue, but can see why the car is doing this. Hyundai needs to really retune this suspension. Go look at Lexus and even the 2009 Acura TL, it gives a smooth yet very compliant ride.

 

[bpajax]

I have been on the fence the last week about pulling the trigger ona V6 Tech Genesis. And after reading this thread and others like it and some of the reviews I see a pattern. I have driven the car several times and they even gave me a laoner for 2 days. I don't beleive the tires are that much to blame. This is clearly some bad design choices on dialing in the suspenstion. I find the car is trying to give a soft smooth ride while still handling very well. The problem is the Hyundai engineers missed the boat on this. I find the car gets a tad choppy at times. I am sure it has to do with spring rates, shock valving and dampening. My guess is the 2010 or surely by 2011 we'll see a retuned suspension. I believe from what I am reading the V8 is worse than the V6. I know it seems as if part of the suspension is reacting to some conditions faster than others, yet they are tuned togther so you get this choppy feel on some rougher roads. I have not tried any road yet that has the rythmic issue, but can see why the car is doing this. Hyundai needs to really retune this suspension. Go look at Lexus and even the 2009 Acura TL, it gives a smooth yet very compliant ride.

So, given all of that, what's it gonna be? Genesis or not?

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[keithl]

So, given all of that, what's it gonna be? Genesis or not?

I'm still on the fence. Take that ride and the fact that the seats are not very supportive and I'm struggling. The seats lack lateral support which makes corning feel way worse than it is in this car. Since they have the great 27 month lease I may try it figuring I can deal with it for 27 months then hope they resolve the suspension tuning for the 2011 car and do another then or move on to something else. I do love the styling of the car and everything else, but you do buy a car to drive so the ride is very important to me, I do about 18K miles a year.

 

[DanTheMan]

I'm still on the fence. Take that ride and the fact that the seats are not very supportive and I'm struggling. The seats lack lateral support which makes corning feel way worse than it is in this car. Since they have the great 27 month lease I may try it figuring I can deal with it for 27 months then hope they resolve the suspension tuning for the 2011 car and do another then or move on to something else. I do love the styling of the car and everything else, but you do buy a car to drive so the ride is very important to me, I do about 18K miles a year.

Ride is important to all of us...I do about 30K miles per year, and I find the ride damn near impeccable on my V6 PP+ pkg.

Buy the car, and enjoy the ride!

Dan :>)

 

[Mark_888]

I have the V6 and I think both trims have the problem. Maybe the V8 is worse, I don't know.

I don't think it is fundamental design flaw of the suspension per se, just that when they tightened up the North American version from the one sold in Korea (and elsewhere) the new shock/spring combo they selected is a little too "jittery." You can see the North American shock/spring combo here (about half way down the page):
http://blog.cardomain.com/2008/09/17/hyundai-genesis-2/

I believe that the Korea version had air suspension shocks which you can "sort of" see if you download the eBrochure from the Hyundai website. You can see a cutaway drawing of the internal suspension components that looks different than the pic above and may be from the Korean model. That suggests to me that a swap of the shock/spring can be made at a reasonable cost without totally redesigning the suspension.

In any event, the current suspension is not terrible, but I do think Hyundai will fix it in upcoming models. The only question is what can current owners do about, and can a Hyundai fix be retrofitted easily to the 2009 model. I don't think it is so bad that Hyundai would feel obligated to fix 2009 models, although it would definitely boost their reputation in the community if they did. I would satisfied if they made the change for current cars at cost.

I suppose the suspension issue could have been discovered from a test drive, but looking back at my own test drive it was on very smooth roads, and I just assumed that a car of that apparent sophistication would handle the minor rough spots at least satisfactorily (and I wasn't looking for a soft ride).

Like the problem with the rain water draining into the trunk when you open the trunk lid, it does appear that Hyundai doesn't think everything through as carefully as some other automakers.

 

[sandy]

In any event, the current suspension is not terrible, but I do think Hyundai will fix it in upcoming models.


Maybe....but most owners (and reviewers) seem to like the suspension the way it is now. Hyundai would have to be sure any suspension change is a net positive; by pleasing Joe who was unhappy, do they lose John and Bill who were happy. Every mfg in just about every industry faces this challange: trying to "tune" a product to satisfy the greatest number of target customers and realizing you can't please everyone. After all, the Genesis is not a "niche" car and had to be designed to appeal to a wide group of consumers. The description on their website of the five point multi-link susupension indicates to me they gave this subject a lot of technical attention and the suspension they decided to deliver to the U.S. market was carefully thought out. Personally, I think Hyundai succeeded. If they can come up with a suspension that would make everyone happy, more power to them. But that would be like having one color that would appeal to everyone.

 

[cviz]

I recently lowered the air pressure in my tires from 37 psi to 33 psi. As mentioned earlier in the thread the dealer forgot to adjust the air pressure in the tires. The difference in the ride was night and day. It's so much better with the tires at the proper psi. I had my wife's cousin in the back seat today and she commented on how smooth the ride was. So no complaints here.

 

[Mark_888]

In any event, the current suspension is not terrible, but I do think Hyundai will fix it in upcoming models.


Maybe....but most owners (and reviewers) seem to like the suspension the way it is now. Hyundai would have to be sure any suspension change is a net positive; by pleasing Joe who was unhappy, do they lose John and Bill who were happy. Every mfg in just about every industry faces this challange: trying to "tune" a product to satisfy the greatest number of target customers and realizing you can't please everyone. After all, the Genesis is not a "niche" car and had to be designed to appeal to a wide group of consumers. The description on their website of the five point multi-link susupension indicates to me they gave this subject a lot of technical attention and the suspension they decided to deliver to the U.S. market was carefully thought out. Personally, I think Hyundai succeeded. If they can come up with a suspension that would make everyone happy, more power to them. But that would be like having one color that would appeal to everyone.

Most reviewers that I saw have complained about the suspension. That includes reviewers ranging from Consumer Reports to Car and Driver (who can hardly be considered lovers of soft rides).
[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9jpYDtAiWY"]YouTube - 2009 Hyundai Genesis Sedan - Car and Driver[/ame]

But the problem is that, as you stated, the five point multi-link suspension is fairly sophisticated, and the problem only shows up on certain road conditions. I am not complaining about a firm ride (which I like), I am talking about a very jittery ride only when certain road conditions occur (which I would not in any way call severe road conditions), and loss of control on very rough roads. It is possible to have a firm ride, but that is also compliant when road conditions are not perfect, and that don't start oscillating even on minor road irregularities.

The Korean 5 point multi-link susupension may have been well thought out, but as to whether the suspension changes made to the North American version were carefully thought out, I doubt it. Yes the need for a "firmer" ride in North America was thought out, but I don't think the particular shock/spring assembly they ended up with was carefully thought out and tested. I think the rear springs are just a little too tight. The springs may be fine if you have 4 or more passengers in the car (I haven't tried that), but not quite right with only 1-2 in the car in my experience.

When I (and others) specifically asked at the Hyundai Think Tank chat last Wednesday whether the Genesis suspension would be fixed, Michael Deitz, Product Manager for the Hyundai Genesis responded that he is committed to to improving the car (understandably, he was not going to admit in public that the suspension has problems).

I am still a little unsure if the problems are related to tire pressure. Hyundai recommends 33 psi, which is rather high in my experience in terms of manufacturer recommendations. I am not sure why they did that, and whether it was needed to get certain gasoline mileage ratings from the EPA or whether there are other reasons. I have ordered an accurate tire gauge on the Internet and intend to experiment with various tire pressures when I get it.

 

[August West]

I'm rather saddened to find out about this serious flaw in the Genesis suspension. Over the past few weeks I've been looking at sedans and ended up test driving and liking the Genesis very much. In fact, I found a 4.6 yesterday that was exactly what I was looking for. The numbers the dealer worked out didn't look too bad and I almost went for it but decided to wait and think about it a little more. After finding this thread with members who have suspension issues and reading as many reviews as I could find I am thinking I was wise to hold off buying. It seems they all mention the suspension, and not in a positive way. From "unsettled" to "heaving and wallowing down the road" they are all critical of the Genesis suspension to some extent.

Although my test drives didn't find any fault with the suspension they were all on nice smooth roads and highways. It appears certain surface irregularities tend to cause the problems and apparently we didn't encounter any of those. It is unfortunate because Hyundai got so much of the rest of the car right. I like the looks inside and out. It was comfortable, had great power, the Lexicon was outstanding and the cooled seat rocks. But, looking at the big picture I just can't bring myself to drop $40,000 (a lot of money for me) on a car with such a fundamental flaw that at best is irritating and could be potentially dangerous from the descriptions here. And since Hyundai apparently hasn't admitted there is a problem we don't even know if it can be easily rectified or how much it might cost.

Anyway, I just want to thank you guys for sharing your experiences so other can make an informed decision. Thank goodness for the internet.

 

[Mark_888]

I'm rather saddened to find out about this serious flaw in the Genesis suspension. Over the past few weeks I've been looking at sedans and ended up test driving and liking the Genesis very much. In fact, I found a 4.6 yesterday that was exactly what I was looking for. The numbers the dealer worked out didn't look too bad and I almost went for it but decided to wait and think about it a little more. After finding this thread with members who have suspension issues and reading as many reviews as I could find I am thinking I was wise to hold off buying. It seems they all mention the suspension, and not in a positive way. From "unsettled" to "heaving and wallowing down the road" they are all critical of the Genesis suspension to some extent.

Although my test drives didn't find any fault with the suspension they were all on nice smooth roads and highways. It appears certain surface irregularities tend to cause the problems and apparently we didn't encounter any of those. It is unfortunate because Hyundai got so much of the rest of the car right. I like the looks inside and out. It was comfortable, had great power, the Lexicon was outstanding and the cooled seat rocks. But, looking at the big picture I just can't bring myself to drop $40,000 (a lot of money for me) on a car with such a fundamental flaw that at best is irritating and could be potentially dangerous from the descriptions here. And since Hyundai apparently hasn't admitted there is a problem we don't even know if it can be easily rectified or how much it might cost.

Anyway, I just want to thank you guys for sharing your experiences so other can make an informed decision. Thank goodness for the internet.

First, I don't think the problem is "serious." If you look at the overall reviews, even from Consumer Reports, they rated it higher than any other upscale sedan, and most of the competition cost thousands more than the Genesis (except maybe for V8 Genesis).

Second, I think it can be fixed without redesigning the suspension. All they have to do is put slight different shock/spring on the car, and maybe only on the rear. In fact I would not be surprised if they just may a slight adjustment to the rear springs on newer models without even announcing that they have done it.

I also don't really fault Hyundai for not "admitting" there is a problem, at least not until they come up with a solution, The magnitude of the issue is not so great that one can call it a "defect." I think you have to drive the car yourself and determine whether it bothers you. Maybe you need to find some slightly rougher roads for your test drive. If it the ride is fine for the roads you drive on, then you don't need to worry.

 

[gentecv8]

I got my 4.6 in the beginning of Jan and have been driving it on all types of roads, and honestly, I don't quite understand what the fuss is about re: suspension. In my driving experience, the suspension works just fine (may be Hyundai has already tweaked the suspension, springs, dampening, etc.). It is stiff, yes, but so was my C320 sport, and the Genesis does a better job of handling road irregularities than my MB. Additionally, I find the 4.6 provides excellent road-feel, better than the C320. I'm a very happy owner.

 

[Mark_888]

I got my 4.6 in the beginning of Jan and have been driving it on all types of roads, and honestly, I don't quite understand what the fuss is about re: suspension. In my driving experience, the suspension works just fine (may be Hyundai has already tweaked the suspension, springs, dampening, etc.). It is stiff, yes, but so was my C320 sport, and the Genesis does a better job of handling road irregularities than my MB. Additionally, I find the 4.6 provides excellent road-feel, better than the C320. I'm a very happy owner.

I just want to clarify that no one is complaining about a firm suspension. We all know Genesis is somewhat firm, and we like it that way or we would not have bought the car. But under certain road conditions (which maybe not everyone has encountered) the car starts acting jittery, like something on the end of a very tight spring that won't quit moving around, even at fairly low speeds.

Someone suggested above that under certain road conditions a resonance develops where the movements of car become exaggerated. I don't know what the exact problem is, but almost every professional reviewer has commented on it. Consumer Reports described it as unsettled. Car and Driver (video above) said that the "control went away" on some marginal roads, and was not as good as a BMW (which has a very firm suspension). Car and Driver also claimed that the Genesis is softer than an Infiniti M35/45, which they consider to be the best sports sedan out there, so they weren't critical of the Genesis suspension because it was too firm.