The 4.6 V8 Tau

[Sal Collaziano]

I have a feeling this will be an engine rarely seen amongst the Hyundai Genesis lineup. It's going to be quite expensive - especially for a Hyundai. However, the power is extremely impressive. Especially considering how much more powerful it is than the Cadillac Northstar engine. And, just when CAFE is starting to cause domestic automobile companies to shy away from V8s, here comes a very powerful V8 from Hyundai.

The NVH (noise, vibration, harshness) level is very important to me with this particular engine. When Lexus came on board with their game changer, the LS400, in 1990 - the engine was powerful, very smooth and very, very quiet. A "game changer" today must do the same.

Discuss....

 

[GrandPrix08]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

Well, I have a lot of doubt on this new engine. For, Hyundai simply don't have much experience when it comes to designing their own engine. From their birth of late 60's(when they were nothing more than an imported other makes and sold in Korea under Hyundai name), and from the 70's until about early 90's, they were using the engine they bought from Mitsubishi. It wasn't until the mid 90's(I think) until they first developped their own engine. Also, the V8 engine is their absolute first in their history, so, I think only the time will tell if they are any good or any reliable. The rumors I hear is that, the V8 model will top out fully loaded at around 39K to 40K, which I think is rather too high for a Hyundai. Well, Hyundai can market those cars sooner or later, but to me, it's just too early to bring those kinda cars into the strict market like North America. I don't think American car buyers are ready to fork over that kinda money to the product by the make that was once synomous with easily breakable, un-reliable, cheap, appliance cars that were the laughing stocks of various talk shows and the general public, at least, for now. Since they are still not considered as good as Toyota, Honda or any other Japanese brands standards, they are close, but just not there yet.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

They know that a lot rides on this engine. So let's see what happens. I'm sure they gave it their best effort. However, they have to prove themselves here.. I'm very anxious to start seeing reviews from skeptics...

 

[GrandPrix08]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

Yeah, but sometimes giving the best effort isn't enough. They have to test it extensively in order to prove what it can do in a long run. Let's hope they do well, but I won't be surprised if they don't either. It's their first ever V8, so.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

True.. There will be some risk to buying the Genesis with the v8... We'll find out how big a risk that is a few years down the road.

 

[EdVoylesHyundai]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

The rumors I hear is that, the V8 model will top out fully loaded at around 39K to 40K, which I think is rather too high for a Hyundai. Well, Hyundai can market those cars sooner or later, but to me, it's just too early to bring those kinda cars into the strict market like North America. I don't think American car buyers are ready to fork over that kinda money to the product by the make that was once synomous with easily breakable, un-reliable, cheap, appliance cars that were the laughing stocks of various talk shows and the general public, at least, for now. Since they are still not considered as good as Toyota, Honda or any other Japanese brands standards, they are close, but just not there yet.

As for the price, people said the same thing of the Veracruz before it came out. We sell more of the $37k variety than the $31k variety. I think that people will recognize the value and will pay it, assuming the quality is there. I am confident that will not be an issue. Hyundai has demonstrated recently that they are perfectly capable of building a solid $35k automobile. And I hear that the quality control standards have been cranked up for the Genesis, so I expect them to be even better.

As for the reputation of the brand, don't forget that Toyota's first foray into the American market was a complete flop: unreliable, too slow, overheated, etc... It has been long enough that people have forgotten about that. I think that Hyundai is on their way to putting that rough past behind them. Don't forget that the Elantra & Santa Fe were just named best in class by Consumer Reports. The Elantra beating out the Civic and Corolla, among others and the Santa Fe topping the Pilot and Highlander. In fact, of all of the vehicles that Consumer Reports lists as "Recommended", Hyundai had 2 out of the 5 least expensive models. This is in addition to all of the JD Power awards, etc... They have come a long way.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

As for the price, people said the same thing of the Veracruz before it came out. We sell more of the $37k variety than the $31k variety. I think that people will recognize the value and will pay it, assuming the quality is there. I am confident that will not be an issue. Hyundai has demonstrated recently that they are perfectly capable of building a solid $35k automobile. And I hear that the quality control standards have been cranked up for the Genesis, so I expect them to be even better.

As for the reputation of the brand, don't forget that Toyota's first foray into the American market was a complete flop: unreliable, too slow, overheated, etc... It has been long enough that people have forgotten about that. I think that Hyundai is on their way to putting that rough past behind them. Don't forget that the Elantra & Santa Fe were just named best in class by Consumer Reports. The Elantra beating out the Civic and Corolla, among others and the Santa Fe topping the Pilot and Highlander. In fact, of all of the vehicles that Consumer Reports lists as "Recommended", Hyundai had 2 out of the 5 least expensive models. This is in addition to all of the JD Power awards, etc... They have come a long way.

Great post! Welcome aboard!

 

[gentau]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

As for the price, people said the same thing of the Veracruz before it came out. We sell more of the $37k variety than the $31k variety. I think that people will recognize the value and will pay it, assuming the quality is there. I am confident that will not be an issue. Hyundai has demonstrated recently that they are perfectly capable of building a solid $35k automobile. And I hear that the quality control standards have been cranked up for the Genesis, so I expect them to be even better.

As for the reputation of the brand, don't forget that Toyota's first foray into the American market was a complete flop: unreliable, too slow, overheated, etc... It has been long enough that people have forgotten about that. I think that Hyundai is on their way to putting that rough past behind them. Don't forget that the Elantra & Santa Fe were just named best in class by Consumer Reports. The Elantra beating out the Civic and Corolla, among others and the Santa Fe topping the Pilot and Highlander. In fact, of all of the vehicles that Consumer Reports lists as "Recommended", Hyundai had 2 out of the 5 least expensive models. This is in addition to all of the JD Power awards, etc... They have come a long way.

Good post. If I didn't agree with what you have said, I probably wouldn't be on this forum in the first place. However, there are also some hidden risks in your statements. People on forums such as this are "car people". We tend to study track records and improvements on vehicles from year to year. Most of us have noted the steady improvement made by Hyundai in the areas you mentioned. It is not people like us that must be convinced to venture into the Hyundai show room.

I suspect that if you asked most people of the general buying public to make a short list of their future new car prospects, you would not find many that would include the Hyundai nameplate. The public perception of Hyundai is changing; but I'm not convinced that it has changed enough for the average buyer to consider paying $40K for a first year model with an unproven record.
If the buyer is to recognize the value, he must first be convinced to go into the showroom. Only a good marketing plan will achieve that goal. That marketing plan must consist of advertising the merits of the car as well as a palatable price. The Super Bowl ads were a good start in the right direction; but similar publicity should be given to the car right up until introduction at the dealerships.

Regarding the V8 engine, I am not overly concerned that it is a new design; or that it is a first for Hyundai. Computer designs and computer simulations have taken a lot of the guesswork out of new engine development. The old days of building a few prototypes and running them until something breaks are going by the wayside.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Re: The 4.6 V8 Tao

...and another great post. We seem to have found some very knowledgeable members in our short existence.

 

[Genesis X]

I concur. Hyundai is on the same path as Toyota and Honda so many years ago. they are receiving high marks from Consumer Reports and people pay attention to that. If you are not a car guy it becomes quite like a bible when considering a vehicle purchase.
I can say for myself that although I do believe they are on the right track they still have long road to hoe. If the price is substantially less than either the Acura brands or Lexus brands then I will definitly consider a Genesis. If the price point is closer to the competition then I will most likely choose the proven brand.

This car has the possibility to change everything.

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[Sal Collaziano]

This car has the possibility to change everything.

Exactly! The Genesis is a game-changer. It's going to be a very interesting next few months.. We should start seeing V6 models in showrooms in June - and V8s in September...

 

[GrandPrix08]

As I have said a number of times, Hyundai may fail on its first year selling the Genesis. Even if it does, Hyundai shouldn't despair and try to market it better and more aggresive ways. It's not easy for any new car to sell on its first year. Long term reliability comes to play. It all depends on how well Hyundai can advertise the car and how much they can price it down against its competitors. Part of the reason that I still believe it's too early for Hyundai to bring such a car into North America. They could have tried selling it in other worlds first to see if it does well, and get much needed track record, then, bring them into strict US/Canada market.

Hyundai/Kia brand IS doing well, and is slowly changing the public perception, but they have to realize that they are not there yet. Their re-sale value still is among the worst side, and unlike Japanese brands, no-one claims Hyundai as his/her favorite brand, or the fans of their cars. They still have a way to go. It's their choice whether to sell Genesis or the cars like it, but the success isn't really guaranteed right away. First, they should really learn to design their own unique style, rather than copying others and mishmash them together. To me, that's the first thing they will have to perfect.

 

[EdVoylesHyundai]

As I have said a number of times, Hyundai may fail on its first year selling the Genesis. Even if it does, Hyundai shouldn't despair and try to market it better and more aggresive ways. It's not easy for any new car to sell on its first year. Long term reliability comes to play. It all depends on how well Hyundai can advertise the car and how much they can price it down against its competitors. Part of the reason that I still believe it's too early for Hyundai to bring such a car into North America. They could have tried selling it in other worlds first to see if it does well, and get much needed track record, then, bring them into strict US/Canada market.

Hyundai/Kia brand IS doing well, and is slowly changing the public perception, but they have to realize that they are not there yet. Their re-sale value still is among the worst side, and unlike Japanese brands, no-one claims Hyundai as his/her favorite brand, or the fans of their cars. They still have a way to go. It's their choice whether to sell Genesis or the cars like it, but the success isn't really guaranteed right away. First, they should really learn to design their own unique style, rather than copying others and mishmash them together. To me, that's the first thing they will have to perfect.

Excellent. I agree with most of what you said. Some good news regarding the resale values came out last week. Forbes released their list of 10 cars that depreciate the most over the first 5 years and there wasn't a single Hyundai on the list!

Hyundai is going to have to market this car aggressively AND support it with strong lease programs. A large percentage of high-end car buyers lease them rather than buy them b/c they realize that cars are depreciating assets and as such should be leased and not purchased.

I do think Genesis will be a game-changer for Hyundai, but I don't think it will be the sedan. I think the Coupe will be the car that gets enthusiasts into the brand, just as the G35 coupe did for Infiniti. The aftermarket implications for the Coupe are strong. I believe the 2.0 will be a beefed version of the engine in the Elantra now, so tuners will pay more attention to the Elantra. Plus, it opens the door for a "hot-hatch" like the SRT-4 or Cobalt SS with minimal engineering costs. Go-fast parts for the 3.8 will trickle over to the Genesis, Azera, Veracruz. I could go on for pages about the impact these cars could have, but none of it matters if the cars are crap. I really want these cars to be home-runs. To do that, they are going to have to be truly great cars, not just good cheap cars.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Good point about the Coupe and the comparison to the G35 and what it did for Infiniti...

 

[unknown_owner]

Well my two cents. I have been to 2 major auto shows: Philly and NY and you would have been surprised to see a good number of people actually looking at the Genesis and asking questions. I hear in forums that the Genesis is still a Hyundai and it's going to fail and that noone is going to buy it. Well the people likely to buy it, may not even use the internet, so a lot of people's judgements maybe being made from a select fews opinions. Alot of the negative comments I see are from people who are still holding on to the fact that Hyundai was real crappy when they came out. But like every great company now, they are bound to sparkle and this may be it. Yes, the Tau is their first engine, but I'm sure it's not something that they just put together last month. I'm sure a lot of research and development has gone into it. I coaxed my wife into buying the Veracruz last year March after practically not hearing one word about it, but the price was right and we got a lot for our money. That SUV is great! My wife loves it to death and people are still breaking their necks to look at it. I drive it every once in a while myself.

I work for a software company that was started 20 years ago and when they were first started, yes they were bad. But they listened to their clients and have worked hard over the years, always trying new things and improving. We are now the #1 software company for what we do. Granted Software engineering and car manufacturing are 2 diff't categories but they meet the same end: to cater to clients that want something. I'm sure that if people look around at all the things they buy today and like, there was a point in time when that company's products were really crappy.

My cousin has '02 745 and I like the acceleration on it. I hope the Tau can give that same if not better acceleration.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Great post, Unknown_Owner. I totally agree.. 99% of the people on forums are "enthusiasts" - and they don't let go of old memories easily. They still talk about the Cadillac Cimarron - which is long old news... Times have changed.. Even Honda and Toyota made crappy vehicles in the 70s.

I'm very confident that the Hyundai Genesis will give the same type of acceleration found in an 02 BMW 745i - if not a bit more...

 

[GrandPrix08]

Well, since the V8 is the very first engine they made in the history of the company, I have some doubts. As you said, it couldn't have been developped in the last minute by mixing and matching the technologies of other companies, and Hyundai could have been done a lot of researches in order to make this engine, they need time to fully test this engine in order to ship it outside of Korea. Once again, I am saying that, this car should have been tried on other parts of the world first. Since, if they fail this time in the US/Canada, they can kiss goodbye to the reputation they've been building in North American market. If they fail this time, people's perception will go to, 'NEVER pay premium for a Hyundai, just keep regard them as a cheaper alternative' or 'That's why they were cheaper, you get what you pay for'.

I sure hope they succeed, but only time will tell if they will establish themselves as a mainstream like Toyota and Honda or not. Also, the same V8 will be used on the upcomming Kias as well, so if they fail, it's a failure for not just a Hyundai, but its sibling company as well. The only 2 Korean makes in US/Canada.

I feel the V6 models will be the main cars they will be selling at first, considerring that Hyundai has experience building V6s, and their V6 models are currently doing pretty well in US. V8s will have to wait for the long term relibility stats to set in for the cars to really fly out the showroom floor. The various magazines and media's help may needed for them to test the car as long term subject to really give the public a peace of mind that it is OK to buy the V8 Hyundai.

I wouldn't really give high expectations for them yet. For, as an old saying 'If the expectation is too high, disappointment is greater'. Getting all kinds of hypes can't always be a good thing.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Hey. I wonder if they decided to keep the V8 out of the Genesis Coupe for just this reason - reliability. I mean - who's going to be testing the performance of the Genesis more than Coupe owners? The sedan owners will tend to be more docile. They'll drive the sedan like a luxury vehicle. The coupe owners will be more like the Tiburon, G35, 350Z owners and really test the motor. I bet this is why they're holding back for now. To see how the engine does with normal to fairly hard driving - before they place it into a vehicle that's going to be driven very hard (and modified).

 

[gentau]

Hey. I wonder if they decided to keep the V8 out of the Genesis Coupe for just this reason - reliability. I mean - who's going to be testing the performance of the Genesis more than Coupe owners? The sedan owners will tend to be more docile. They'll drive the sedan like a luxury vehicle. The coupe owners will be more like the Tiburon, G35, 350Z owners and really test the motor. I bet this is why they're holding back for now. To see how the engine does with normal to fairly hard driving - before they place it into a vehicle that's going to be driven very hard (and modified).

If that's the case, I suppose I don't exactly fit their profile.
http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/silvergto/?action=view&current=SDRAgainstRick1-27-07.flv

 

[Sal Collaziano]

If that's the case, I suppose I don't exactly fit their profile.
http://s43.photobucket.com/albums/e364/silvergto/?action=view&current=SDRAgainstRick1-27-07.flv

Nice GTO! Silver? 6.0?