To those thinking of purchasing a Genesis:Hyundai doesn't care to replace LEMONS

[chirojdoc]

Here's a list of things I have had wrong with my '09 V8 Genesis Sedan in just the first 17,000 miles. I have the technology package, so some of this stuff only has to do with that package.

1. Radio and steering wheel buttons locked up for several days, and continue to do so intermittently.
2. Car would frequently not allow me to take it out of park.
3. Rear view cam stopped working.
4. Stereo sound stops coming from speakers intermittently, sometimes for seconds, sometimes for days.
5. Brake lights go out.
6. Microphone for voice controls and phone bluetooth stops working.
7. Contacts continue to be completely deleted from my car's phone book for no reason, and it doesn't allow me to add new ones. Every once in a while they all show back up for a day or two.
8. Steering wheel will often not come back into place after restarting the car, and I have to manually reach up and put the steering wheel back where I want it.
9. Cruise control will often not engage after I turn it on and press set, and I have to turn it back off, wait a minute, then turn it back on and try again. It has always worked so far on the 2nd try.
10. Air quality control doesn't seem to work all that well anymore, since sometimes I can be sitting behind a beater pumping my car full of noxious fumes and it doesn't engage the recirc. automatically, other times it comes on and there are no other cars around me, other times it works like it should... almost like it's on random.

Things they have been able to fix after probably nearly a dozen times between 3 different dealerships: the brake lights and the gearshift stuck in park.

I don't really think you need more reasons than this not to buy a Genesis. The thing is, if they would just replace this obvious lemon, they would surely have me on here writing great things about Hyundai, but as it stands, I can't even get anyone in charge at Hyundai headquarters to return my calls, so this is my last resort.

 

[Catharpin]

so this is my last resort.

No your last resort is to check your state laws and get in touch with the Office of the Attorney General or Department of Consumer Affairs depending on where you live.

 

[ctrcbob]

You have 17000 miles on your 4.6 Tech, and you just now joined genesisowners.com???

Where you been?? The group had others with one or two of the mentioned problems, but never with all those problems. Has your dealer (or any dealer) fixed any or all of these problems?

Its not that I don't believe you, (I do,) but it just sounds fishy that you've had all these problems and only now, on 9/10, you join the group, and enter your first post.

In addition, I UNDERSTAND EXACTLY HOW YOU FEEL. Many years ago, I had a Honda Accord EX (the best one they made) that gave me nothing but problems. The attitude of the dealer was "this is a Honda, and Hondas don't give problems". Yes, they corrected all the problems, after many visits, but new problems just would just show up. Got fed up, and sold it, and purchased a Toyota LE, that never gave me an iota of problems.

What I'm getting at is even today, I am so turned off of Honda cars, that I would not consider buying another one. Good luck with your problems.

 

[wallymn]

Here's a list of things I have had wrong with my '09 V8 Genesis Sedan in just the first 17,000 miles. I have the technology package, so some of this stuff only has to do with that package.

1. Radio and steering wheel buttons locked up for several days, and continue to do so intermittently.
2. Car would frequently not allow me to take it out of park.
3. Rear view cam stopped working.
4. Stereo sound stops coming from speakers intermittently, sometimes for seconds, sometimes for days.
5. Brake lights go out.
6. Microphone for voice controls and phone bluetooth stops working.
7. Contacts continue to be completely deleted from my car's phone book for no reason, and it doesn't allow me to add new ones. Every once in a while they all show back up for a day or two.
8. Steering wheel will often not come back into place after restarting the car, and I have to manually reach up and put the steering wheel back where I want it.
9. Cruise control will often not engage after I turn it on and press set, and I have to turn it back off, wait a minute, then turn it back on and try again. It has always worked so far on the 2nd try.
10. Air quality control doesn't seem to work all that well anymore, since sometimes I can be sitting behind a beater pumping my car full of noxious fumes and it doesn't engage the recirc. automatically, other times it comes on and there are no other cars around me, other times it works like it should... almost like it's on random.

Things they have been able to fix after probably nearly a dozen times between 3 different dealerships: the brake lights and the gearshift stuck in park.

I don't really think you need more reasons than this not to buy a Genesis. The thing is, if they would just replace this obvious lemon, they would surely have me on here writing great things about Hyundai, but as it stands, I can't even get anyone in charge at Hyundai headquarters to return my calls, so this is my last resort.

For #3, I found there as a loose connection in the trunk.. I was able to fix that. For a number of issues I wonder if the new DIS reflash fix would address a LOT of these issues... There is a free navi update which for the 2009 tech model includes a software rewrite which controls a lot of what you have had issues with...

As for the number of issues and lack of dealer/mfg support.... I would contact Hyundai one final time via letter stating that this issue will be referred to the state (lemon law).. include all the issues you encountered and every visit to the dealer for fix and the result.. May lead to a resolution

 

[chirojdoc]

I have visited 3 separate dealerships on many, many occasions and through many repair attempts they have fixed just two of the problems. I've been dealing with this for quite a while and have been in contact with Hyundai for a while, with no return calls. My biggest concern is that with the amount of driving I do, in 6 months from now when I hit 36,000 miles, most of the technology stuff will be out of warranty, and I just don't trust this particular car. They have been unable to fix most problems, and the dealerships have seen the problems, it's not just my word. And I'll have a POS that it out of warranty aside from the drivetrain, and I'll end up paying a fortune to constantly fix all this stuff. Everything I posted has been documented, I'm not just spouting off stuff to get my car replaced. At this point, I'd rather own a Honda Civic.

 

[chirojdoc]

For #3, I found there as a loose connection in the trunk.. I was able to fix that. For a number of issues I wonder if the new DIS reflash fix would address a LOT of these issues... There is a free navi update which for the 2009 tech model includes a software rewrite which controls a lot of what you have had issues with...

As for the number of issues and lack of dealer/mfg support.... I would contact Hyundai one final time via letter stating that this issue will be referred to the state (lemon law).. include all the issues you encountered and every visit to the dealer for fix and the result.. May lead to a resolution

They have reflashed the computer, twice. Fixed the check engine light coming on, which I didn't list because they knew what the problem was and it was just a minor inconvenience. The replaced the nav system twice and reflashed it. The replaced one of the speakers twice. I'm actually getting a hold of a lemon law attorney, but it shouldn't have to come to that and I wanted everyone out there to know that this is the way Hyundai does business. Now it's gonna cost me money to get Hyundai to do something they should voluntarily do. They have attempted to repair the rear view cam problem 3 times and checked the wires. Now they want to replace the cam itself, but they can't get any.

 

[CapoCriminali]

If they've tried 3+ times to fix the same issue, and you really can't get any help, you should try giving the Hyundai Consumer Affairs department call... They can be reached at 800-633-5151 or online at consumeraffairs@hmausa.com.

Let me know if you have trouble getting ahold of anyone, and if you do, I can reach out to some people I know in other departments within Hyundai USA Corporate and see how they can help me help you.

 

[chirojdoc]

I have actually been calling that number, for the past few weeks I have been calling and talking to representatives, and in the meantime, more and more stuff keeps going wrong with my car... it seems like it's just falling apart. I have a case open with them and they keep saying they have escalated my case and someone should contact me in 2-3 business days, except nobody ever calls, and every time I call to check on the case, that's all they keep telling me. I feel like I'm just being dragged along and kicked off their heels.

 

[ckon]

I don't really think you need more reasons than this not to buy a Genesis. The thing is, if they would just replace this obvious lemon, they would surely have me on here writing great things about Hyundai, but as it stands, I can't even get anyone in charge at Hyundai headquarters to return my calls, so this is my last resort.

I had some problems with my car and my dealership (MUCH less than what you've had!) and the Operations Manager at the dealer went to bat for me with Hyundai. Both he and the Hyundai rep agreed that I had had way too many problems and Hyundai offered to make one of my monthly payments or to provide an extended Hyundai warranty for me. I was very impressed with how they stood up to the problem and the solution they offered me.

It's hard to understand how three dealers have failed so badly at fixing these problems for you without offering you some kind of compensation. I hope you can find some justice. Good luck.

 

[sarge]

I could have written the original post to this thread - it very nearly mirrors my experiences with Hundai Motor America's "customer service". I also have an 09 4.6 with tech package, and I've experienced several of the same symptoms, and some different ones.

I spent hours and hours attempting to contact HMA's customer affairs folks. My car was out of effective service 11 times and counting. It's been 8 months since the first problem occured. In those 8 months, my car has had 4 new amps and a new head unit, and the tilt/telescope switch has been replaced. For 8 months, I've had intermitent Nav/DVD/XM/Radio/Bluetooth. I finally resorted to a Lemon Law attorney. I sincerely wish that it had not been necessary. 1/3 of the settlement will go to the attorney. HMA has flatly refused to take the car back. The customer service rep says he'll roll the dice that a trial would not make him buy the car back for a failed DIS, and that even if he is forced to buy the car back, he'll get a beneficial appraisal that reduces the payment to me significantly.

It has been extremely frustrating. I've learned that a single consumer really has no leverage at all over a car company. Your state AG can't do anything for you so long as Hyundai is honoring the warranty - which means they simply have to keep accepting the car when you take it to the service department.

When you bought your car, you agreed to binding arbitration. You can't just sue Hyundai. You appear before an arbitrator (the BBB in North Carolina) and make your case. Then Hyundai answers your claim. The arbitrator makes a decision (siding with the company an overwhelming percentage of the time), and that's that.

Hyundai has a stone wall of "Customer Affairs" employees whose job is to frustrate you enough that you'll simply give up and go away. They are good at it. If you can get a minute with the Executive VP of Consumer Affairs (Frank Ferrara), you might get some satisfaction. I spoke with him, and while it didn't result in anything concrete in my favor, he did at least seem genuinly concerned about the way I was treated. He expressed regret, and (perhaps coincidently, perhaps not), my claim was settled the following day. The settlement was far from satisfactory, but I am convinced that it was the best I was going to get, and desired to get it all done so that I could unload this lemon.

Good luck - I hope it works out better for you than it did me.

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[CapoCriminali]

WRT Binding Arbitration: http://warranty-arbitration.hyundaiusa.com/Consumer/OptOutSelectionForm.aspx

WRT All the other issues: PM me so we can trade e-mails and I'll reach out to the people I know at Hyundai and see if we can't get this taken care of.

Also, the previous poster may only be speaking about his state. NY, PA and CT (the only ones I have first hand knowledge of) have laws that pertain to this, specifically a set period of time that your car is not-usable, or a specific number of repair attempts on a critical car component (which the steering wheel control, the not-out-of-park issue, and brake lights not working(at least)) before the state's lemon law warranty kicks in. If I was you, I'd look into that, while trying to work this out with Hyundai. It never hurts to have options.

 

[ckon]

WRT Binding Arbitration: http://warranty-arbitration.hyundaiusa.com/Consumer/OptOutSelectionForm.aspx

WRT All the other issues: PM me so we can trade e-mails and I'll reach out to the people I know at Hyundai and see if we can't get this taken care of.

Also, the previous poster may only be speaking about his state. NY, PA and CT (the only ones I have first hand knowledge of) have laws that pertain to this, specifically a set period of time that your car is not-usable, or a specific number of repair attempts on a critical car component (which the steering wheel control, the not-out-of-park issue, and brake lights not working(at least)) before the state's lemon law warranty kicks in. If I was you, I'd look into that, while trying to work this out with Hyundai. It never hurts to have options.

I really hope to see Hyundai succeed with their foray into higher level cars so I really hope these are just isolated incidents, but it sure is disturbing to hear of them.

 

[STREETS]

If it is truly a Lemon as defined by state laws, Hyundai has no choice than to obide by the terms of the legislation.

 

[vega]

I really hope to see Hyundai succeed with their foray into higher level cars so I really hope these are just isolated incidents, but it sure is disturbing to hear of them.

I totally agree. Nobody wants to be saddled with problems in a big ticket item. A prompt and fair resolution would do wonders for Hyundai's PR. Ignoring or patronizing a legitimate customers complaint will lead in the opposite direction.

I purchased a lemon Ford product in the early '90s, and was treated horribly. Although I succeeded in court to get my money back, and then some, I have not had anything good to say about Ford since, nor have I set foot in any of their dealerships. Probably never will again.

It is easier, and less expensive to keep your customers loyal, than to find new ones. Many companies have learned this the hard way, Toyota is just now experiencing the wrath of ignored safety issues. Some will never learn.

 

[chirojdoc]

Before it got this far, I knew this car was trouble and just wanted out of it, I offered Hyundai $5,000 to put me in a different one, and this was when I only had 6,000 miles on it. They pretty much laughed at that and said I would be paying $12,000, not including taxes. I know cars depreciate, but if Hyundai depreciates $12,000 in just 6,000 miles, that's reason enough to never buy another Hyundai. Now I'm past the point of offering them anything, cuz all they care about is passing along their products at the highest price possible without a single car as to whether those products are faulty or not.

 

[STREETS]

I do not know the facts, 2 sides to every story. You need to understand that the "DEALER" is not Hyundai but the reseller. If the Hyundai district manager is doing the laughing then Houston we have a problem. All correspondences and face to face conversations on all unresolved issued should be handled by these Hyundai Motors USA managers. They are the "face" of Hyundai and will do all they can do to satisfy you the customer.

Cars are made by people (OK maybe robots) that makes errors and faults. The Genesis is a fine automobile as proof of the vast majority of members herein and press comments over the past two years. I hope with the district mgr., you can regain the love.

 

[Florida Boy]

Re: Hold up, chirojdoc

No offense, but there's something about the substance and tone of your post that rings entirely false [e.g., cuz all they care about is passing along their products at the highest price possible without a single car[e] as to whether those products are faulty or not.] That's absurd. They've given us quite a car at a good price but, admittedly, every maker puts out a few lemons. It happens, and we all know that.

However, you've itemized at least 10 separate issues with your car.

You claim to have used three different dealers.

None of them, you say, have satisfied you and neither has Hyundai.

But you tell us nothing about where you live, the three specific dealers, or your attempts to utilize your state's lemon law. What's up with that?

Have you or have you not tried to utilize your local lemon law? If not, why not? If so, to what effect?

I can't help but wonder what the heck did you do to that car in the 6000 miles you first put on it? We live in a bitch-and-moan world and I'm weary of the explosion of folks who expect to experience a perfectly uneventful world where everything works "just so" and then blink when they cause a problem with their car.

I certainly apologize if this doesn't apply to you but you're on this message board and being quite selective with your complaint. Details, please.

 

[sarge]

WRT Binding Arbitration: http://warranty-arbitration.hyundaiusa.com/Consumer/OptOutSelectionForm.aspx

WRT All the other issues: PM me so we can trade e-mails and I'll reach out to the people I know at Hyundai and see if we can't get this taken care of.

Also, the previous poster may only be speaking about his state. NY, PA and CT (the only ones I have first hand knowledge of) have laws that pertain to this, specifically a set period of time that your car is not-usable, or a specific number of repair attempts on a critical car component (which the steering wheel control, the not-out-of-park issue, and brake lights not working(at least)) before the state's lemon law warranty kicks in. If I was you, I'd look into that, while trying to work this out with Hyundai. It never hurts to have options.

North Carolina law closely approximates most states Lemon Laws. In North Carolina, and the three states you mention, you must opt out of binding arbitration before you may sue under the Lemon Law. Your advice to become well informed about the law in general and the specific requirments of the Hyundai Purchase Agreement in particular is sound. In m case, I did so. Hyndai still completely failed to honor its warranty, and I had three choices:

1. Continue to be frustrated with a $40K+ brand new car that failed to perform a series of critical functions

or

2. Proceed under binding arbitration and accept the substantial risk that an arbitrator would simply prder Hyundai to replace another amplifier - for the 5th time.

or

3. Get a lawyer and let her deal with the frustrations, and share 1/3rd the settlement should I ultimately decide that Hyundai would probably never buy the car back for a reasonable price.

I opted for choice 3.

I have no idea if the original poster is being perfectly honest, or exagerating his claim, or making it up out of whole cloth. Some posters have opined that his story doesn't quite ring true. Mine is completely factual, and his experience is similar enough to mine that I tend to believe he is being generally accurate.

I appreciate the offer to intercede with officials you know at HMA. I've already talked via phone with the Executive VP of Consumer Affairs, and exchanged emails with the President of HMA. One day afterward I received word from my attorney that HMA had paid the agreed upon amount to settle my claim.

 

[sarge]

If it is truly a Lemon as defined by state laws, Hyundai has no choice than to obide by the terms of the legislation.

Declarative statements leave no room for error - and you are in error.

The law is generally cut and dried. More than 3 repair attempts and its a lemon. The law does not describe the remedy for a lemon, however. If the manufacturer refuses to satisfy you, then you sue. Sueing does not guarantee you a satisfactory outcome, however. Going to court is often a crap shoot. Hyundai has demonstrated a willingness to roll the dice. it's buisness - it is cheaper to risk the odd suit than to simply buy back every vehicle that is nominally a Lemon. That is the words of a senior Hyundai executive, straight from the phone to my ear.

He straightfrowardly described the process to me. Hyundai will avoid buying back a car if possible - in all cases until a customer provides a "final attempt" notice. If the decision is made to buy back, Hyndai will always pay an independent appraiser, and will virtually always arrive at a value lower than the typical miles/100K pro-rated value.

So, Hyundai does have options. They usually exercise them.

 

[Dimitry]

Just be sure to document everything and if a problem occurs, get it fixed. My 09 Genesis was out of service for about 60 days the first year due to various issues, upon filing my claim Hyundai was quick to accept buying back the car. Unfortunately, it took filing the claim for them to do anything. That was my only disappointment in the process.

I would advise you to touch base with an attorney about your specific situation. The good ones have a flat rate if they get the mfg to settle - ei 2000, or nothing at all if they go to court - The attorney fees will cover them well enough (No car company wants the bad publicity of going to court - Especially if you decide to ring of a few local news stations about an interesting problem with a manufacturer)

Dealerships can only do so much, you have to throw steam at consumer affairs to get them running around. Get in touch with the local consumer district manager, and go above their heads if you have to.