Why not the Lexus ES350?

TJPark01

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The compression ratio would increase because of DI, thus necessitating the need for premium fuel. We're splitting hairs here. Aside from diesels, I don't know of a petrol DI engine in the world that doesn't demand 91 or higher by the manufacturer.
 

jwaters943

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GM has a couple engines (V6 & 4-cylinder) that are DI and can run on regular IIRC.
 

TJPark01

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Even if it does end up requiring premium, with DI and the upcoming Hyundai-built 8-speed auto the Tau V8 should be capable of achieving a 1-2 mpg increase in fuel economy which would offset the extra cost of premium unleaded.
I hear what you guys are saying, I agree with you it would be sweet. But as is, the V8 has massive amount of power. I'm not sure more would be better. It would be nice for bragging rights, but for everyday use, even the Tau is a bit overkill. The people on this site are probably enthusiasts with a slant towards performance. Unfortunately the car companies build most cars for our parents not us. My hope is that all the techno performance is showcased on the coupe.
 

Sal Collaziano

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I hear what you guys are saying, I agree with you it would be sweet. But as is, the V8 has massive amount of power. I'm not sure more would be better. It would be nice for bragging rights, but for everyday use, even the Tau is a bit overkill. The people on this site are probably enthusiasts with a slant towards performance. Unfortunately the car companies build most cars for our parents not us. My hope is that all the techno performance is showcased on the coupe.
I'd prefer to have the extra power but you do have a point regarding the fact that most people buying cars are not enthusiasts who want or need the extra power. Maybe they can simply have it as an available options for those interested. The Cadillac CTS has a 3.6 liter V6 that you can get either direct injected or not...
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TJPark01

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My mother drove my car (she's 60) and told me the car is too fast. She has a 10 year old Lexus LS. I said, no such thing:D

It's the law of diminishing returns. Cylinder deactivation,DI, twin turbos, 8 gears, oil slick button, rocket launcher, eject button. There comes a point when less is more.
 

dataguy

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It's the law of diminishing returns. Cylinder deactivation,DI, twin turbos, 8 gears, oil slick button, rocket launcher, eject button. There comes a point when less is more.
I disagree. I'd love to have a rocket launcher on LA freeways. :D
 

dataguy

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You'd run out of rockets in 5 mins. That's why you need a big comfy car out here. Cause most of the time all you're gonna be doing is sitting listening to music.
That's the principal reason I can't buy a car with manual transmission. I'd spend most of the time shifting between first and second gear on the freeway.

The rockets could be saved for only the most egregious situations, pretty much someone being a rolling roadblock in the #1 lane and the special hell for someone who drives on the shoulder in gridlock.
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TJPark01

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Yeah, I really liked and seriously considered the A4,BMW3, MB C300, G37, Acura TL. Optioned out, they cost about the same or more than a fully loaded Genesis. At the end of the day, what car would you and your family rather sit in all day?
 

carver2011

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I hope someone can shed some light on the situation I'm about to bring up. I do not own a Genesis but I plan to some day. Since this thread was about comparing the ES 350 to a Genesis I decided to post this here.

I'm sure most if not all of you have heard about the terrible accident a few months ago a family had while driving an ES 350 in San Diego, CA which led to Toyota recalling millions of vehicles after blaming the horrific accident on the floormats in the car. I have been doing a lot of investigating and research on this incident and I have found several articles pointing to the fact that the accident was not caused by floormats. It is now being blamed on something much bigger...the vehicle throttle control systems, cruise control systems, and braking systems.

The reason I am so worried about this topic is that I have friends and family who own Lexus vehicles (the ES 350 in particular) and I would love to know any other opinions on this matter because I wouldn't want any of them to end up like this family did.

I encourage you guys to check out the website www.autocoverup.com

also google search "runaway Lexus" or "runaway Toyota" to see more info on this.
 

Mark_888

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I hope someone can shed some light on the situation I'm about to bring up. I do not own a Genesis but I plan to some day. Since this thread was about comparing the ES 350 to a Genesis I decided to post this here.

I'm sure most if not all of you have heard about the terrible accident a few months ago a family had while driving an ES 350 in San Diego, CA which led to Toyota recalling millions of vehicles after blaming the horrific accident on the floormats in the car. I have been doing a lot of investigating and research on this incident and I have found several articles pointing to the fact that the accident was not caused by floormats. It is now being blamed on something much bigger...the vehicle throttle control systems, cruise control systems, and braking systems.

The reason I am so worried about this topic is that I have friends and family who own Lexus vehicles (the ES 350 in particular) and I would love to know any other opinions on this matter because I wouldn't want any of them to end up like this family did.

I encourage you guys to check out the website www.autocoverup.com

also google search "runaway Lexus" or "runaway Toyota" to see more info on this.
There is no proof regarding those allegations. These is part of "modern" business that if you are a competitor or don't like the company for some reason, then start false rumors about them.
 

TJPark01

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I hope someone can shed some light on the situation I'm about to bring up. I do not own a Genesis but I plan to some day. Since this thread was about comparing the ES 350 to a Genesis I decided to post this here.
I wouldn't jump to any conclusions here. There will always be conspiracy theorists out there, but I tend not to chalk things up to circumstantial evidence. The NHTSA is conducting an investigation, so let's see what they say, before we start throwing Toyota under the bus.
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carver2011

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I didn't mean to point the finger directly at Lexus or Toyota because it has happened to other manufacturers over the years like Audi and Ford. It's just disturbing the amount of reports i've found of this happening to people in the last few years.
 

TJPark01

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I didn't mean to point the finger directly at Lexus or Toyota because it has happened to other manufacturers over the years like Audi and Ford. It's just disturbing the amount of reports i've found of this happening to people in the last few years.
No other manufacturer in the world is as highly regarded in terms of build quality, reliability, and trouble free motoring than TMC. I think what alarms people to some degree, is that if it can happen to Toyota/Lexus, nobody is immune.
 

Mark_888

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I didn't mean to point the finger directly at Lexus or Toyota because it has happened to other manufacturers over the years like Audi and Ford. It's just disturbing the amount of reports i've found of this happening to people in the last few years.
This reminds me of the theory that cellular phones cause brain cancer. There are always thousands of people who get brain cancer near where they hold their cell phones to their head, and people jump to false conclusions based on invalid statistical inferences.

Likewise, there are tens of millions of Toyota vehicles in use and some of their owners just hit the wrong pedal sometimes, or have other problems getting their foot stuck on the pedals (which I have done myself on several cars from time to time due to my own fault). Audi was blamed for the same thing years ago, but it turned out be the fault of the drivers, not the cars. Now I am not saying that the Toyota floor mats should not be redesigned, but most of the conspiracy claims are unproven, and very likely untrue.
 

GripperDon

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As reported on Fox News last week

"A groundbreaking, $30 million study into cell phones has found a link between long term use and brain tumors.

The World Health Organization is about to reveal that its decade-long investigation has found the devices can lead to cancer — and the internationally-respected body will soon issue a public health message with its findings, London’s Daily Telegraph reported today.

The conclusion goes against years of assurances by cell phone companies and scientists that cell phone use is safe.

But last month, Sen. Arlen Specter, D- Pa., organized Senate hearings to examine health implications of talking on-the-go.

The WHO’s Interphone investigation’s results showed, "a significantly increased risk" of some brain tumors "related to use of mobile phones for a period of ten years or more," the Telegraph reported."

Hhmmmmm!
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Mark_888

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As reported on Fox News last week

"A groundbreaking, $30 million study into cell phones has found a link between long term use and brain tumors.

The World Health Organization is about to reveal that its decade-long investigation has found the devices can lead to cancer — and the internationally-respected body will soon issue a public health message with its findings, London’s Daily Telegraph reported today.

The conclusion goes against years of assurances by cell phone companies and scientists that cell phone use is safe.

But last month, Sen. Arlen Specter, D- Pa., organized Senate hearings to examine health implications of talking on-the-go.

The WHO’s Interphone investigation’s results showed, "a significantly increased risk" of some brain tumors "related to use of mobile phones for a period of ten years or more," the Telegraph reported."

Hhmmmmm!
There is no cause and effect that has been proved. Their so-called "proof" is that there is slight statistical increase in odds of people who use cell phones of getting brain cancer compared to those who don't use cell phones. But there are other reasons why someone who uses cell phones is more likely to get cancer based on their other behaviors, such as sitting in front of a computer monitor for more hours per day than the average person who does not use a cell phone.

Or maybe a person who uses a cell phone is more likely to use a microwave oven, or more likely to visit the dentist and therefore more likely to have x-rays near their brain. Also, considering the widespread use of cell phones in all developed nations, it is likely that there is a big difference in diet and life-style compared to people in undeveloped areas who are less likely to use cell phones (more additives in food, less exercise, more obesity, more stress in their lives, etc for people who use cell phones).

Other studies have shown no correlation between cell phones and cancer.
 

ImInPA

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Or...maybe holding a small microwave device close to your head for periods of time causes brain tumors. Americans are very good at rationalizing out any news we do not wish to subscribe to. The truth is, that if it is reported on a news station, it is probably questionable information straight from the get-go. It took years before the oil/gasoline industry came clean on the effects of lead in gasoline, even longer for the tobacco industry to come clean on their research showing how safe cigarettes are. Lest we forget agent orange, thalidimide, asbestos, and numerous other harmful things that industry research and scientists all deemed safe. That cell phones might not be healthy should come as no surprise to any of us. That Toyota may have a safety issue is equally unsurprising to me. No manufacturer is perfect and I accept that. It is how and what they do to remedy their issues that is important. Ford denied anything wrong with the Pinto for years. It took many of them to catch on fire after minor rear impacts before they were forced to come clean. That is what is despicable.
 

STREETS

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I think Arlen Specter was also going to head a Congressional Hearing to investigate Bill Belichick's involvement in Toyota Motor Corps floormats.
 

tjc78

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Prior to owning my Genesis I had an '06 Toyota Avalon. It has the same powertrain as the ES350. It never accelerated on its own, surged or anything like you read about.

Also, the floormat issue is nuts. Toyota (as most manufacturers) provide nice little retaining hooks for the floor mats. People were using the factory carpet mats (securely in the hooks) and then putting solid rubber all weather mats ON TOP of the carpet mats. Of course there is going to be a problem with the mats occasionally jamming the gas pedal you are building the floor of the car up almost 1 1/2" with two mats. Toyota issued a recall of the all weather mats in order to put in specific instructions to REMOVE the factory mat before installing the all weather mats.

The Lexus that crashed had mats on top of mats from the dealer's service department (car was a service loaner) this was not Toyota's fault, but the dealers. Also, why in the heck didn't the driver of said vehicle put it into neutral when it was accelerating out of control???
 
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