Long term reliability of HTRAC AWD transfer case due to inability to change the transfer case fluid?

[ThoughtfulOne]

A few days ago, I saw this post on Reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/aqflbu

Anyways, before you read on, I would like you to read the post.

1. The AWD transfer case appears to be sealed and cannot be serviceable.
2. The Magna Actimax when used on the BMW xDrive appears to have been known for failures.
3. It is looking like there may be issues down the road for the Genesis HTRAC versions, as they use this case.

Anyways, the original poster was a Hyundai tech, and I've interacted with him on Reddit before, so I do have some trust for the poster. The fluid, Shell TF0870 can be bought online, but if the unit is sealed, then we are out of luck.

This will also be an issue on:

1. The 2015/2016 DH Genesis HTRAC
2. All Genesis G70, G80, and G90 HTRAC
3. The AWD versions of the Kia Stinger
4. The AWD versions of the new Kia K900
5. Whatever future Hyundai, Kia, or Genesis HTRAC versions

So quite a few people are going to be affected on this forum.

This is not a cheap repair we are talking about:

47300-4E000 Genuine Hyundai Transfer Assembly

Genuine 47300-4E000 Transfer Assembly fits 2014-2016 Hyundai Genesis. HyundaiPartsDeal offers 473004E000 for $2750.99.

www.hyundaipartsdeal.com

47300-4E000 is the part in question (Kia has a different numbering system so I'm not sure about the Stinger).

 

[EdP]

A few days ago, I saw this post on Reddit:

1. It is looking like there may be issues down the road for the Genesis HTRAC versions, as they use this case.

What is the failure rate? Personally, I'm not concerned as I don't expect to run out of warranty. Unless you know the failure rate you cannot say if it is a big deal. An anecdote is not a statistic. Is the Hyundai/Genesis case the same as the BMW or have there been changes to improve it?

Have there been many Hyundai/Genesis complaints?

If the fluid was changed, would that alter the failure rate? It may or may not be relevant. If you attempt to change the oil you will void the warranty so if under 100,000 miles you are better off waiting.

Any mechanical device will eventually wear and fail.

 

[ThoughtfulOne]

What is the failure rate? Personally, I'm not concerned as I don't expect to run out of warranty.

The issue here is that not everyone on the forums is leasing - or planning to trade in.

I think that we will, have to wait a few years to find out if this is a major weak point on the car.

Unless you know the failure rate you cannot say if it is a big deal. An anecdote is not a statistic. Is the Hyundai/Genesis case the same as the BMW or have there been changes to improve it?

Have there been many Hyundai/Genesis complaints?

If the fluid was changed, would that alter the failure rate? It may or may not be relevant. If you attempt to change the oil you will void the warranty so if under 100,000 miles you are better off waiting.

Any mechanical device will eventually wear and fail.

The problem I have with this right now is that they made a part where the fluid cannot be changed. The Hyundai HTRAC is based on the Magna Actimax, which is the same system that BMW uses.

News Release - Magna AWD System Helps Hyundai Genesis Achieve New Levels of Driving Performance

www.magna.com

News Release - Magna Strengthens All-Wheel-Drive Market Position with Next-Generation Actimax Transfer Case

www.magna.com

The xDrive does have a bad reputation elsewhere. Hyundai claims that they enhanced it, but I'm not entirely sure how or if this affects reliability.

Yes, any device will fail, but fluid changes can certainly extend the life of parts. I've always tried to change a bit ahead of the intervals.

Ford is surely not the only company where you want to be ahead of the intervals.

 

[NLJ]

So we get Austrian built units and BMW gets Mexican built units?
Anyway sounds like a lot of fear mongering to me.
Maybe BMW tuned it too aggressively or did something else stupid to it during customization!

 

[Acpantera]

I can't find any where in the owners manual that says to ck or replace the oil in the transfercase, it does however tell you what oil and how much it takes

 

[hguh9591]

What is the failure rate? Personally, I'm not concerned as I don't expect to run out of warranty. Unless you know the failure rate you cannot say if it is a big deal. An anecdote is not a statistic. Is the Hyundai/Genesis case the same as the BMW or have there been changes to improve it?

Have there been many Hyundai/Genesis complaints?

If the fluid was changed, would that alter the failure rate? It may or may not be relevant. If you attempt to change the oil you will void the warranty so if under 100,000 miles you are better off waiting.

Any mechanical device will eventually wear and fail.

If you are a second owner, then you do not benefit from the 10/100000 warranty. I would be interested in the range of likely total repair cost ( parts and labor). I am considering purchasing a 2015/2016 Genesis AWD. The cost of this repair is something for me to add into my budget. The possibility of a need for this work won't discourage me from getting the car; but it will give me another repair to consider in the long term if I play to drive my car for another 100,000 miles. I had an 1999 Audi A4 and I had a year with over $5K in repairs and maintenance. This is the price of driving a nice car.

 

[Toddasaurus]

I'm still holding out hope that you can replace the fluid in the transfer case. For those of us who plan to modify our cars, simple things like this are paramount. I'll take a peek under my G70 tomorrow and report my findings. *fingers crossed*

 

[Toddasaurus]

Just checked under my new G70. I am unsure if there is a drain bolt, but there is one possible bolt I'm seeing. Keep in mind though, it's such a tight fit in there that you may have to completely remove the case to figure out a way to re-fill it. And I don't even know if this bolt is high enough to refill it, or low enough to drain all of it...

Here are some really up close pics to illustrate. Sorry I don't have a gigantic hydraulic lift in my tiny garage.


Xfer case P/N?


Driver's side, rear facing portion of lower case...


Possible fluid access here, but doesn't seem low enough for a real drain bolt... This is the passenger side rear facing portion of the case. More likely this bolt is to hold something together inside the case, and isn't mean for fluid access at all.



Bottom of the case...



Rear prop shaft. Notice the rubber damper ring that attaches the shaft to the case.



And finally, front prop shaft.



Thoughts....
First of all, the case is pretty small/compact. It really doesn't look like it would be too horrible to remove it. Would be a little more complicated than pulling a rear differential, but totally doable. That said, if you had to replace it, it's a job I would feel comfortable doing on my own. But, on that same note, at some point maybe it wouldn't be such a bad idea to try and service it later on down the road. You could technically split it in half without a huge hassle once the case is out and change fluids, but without a service manual I wouldn't dare do that.

Other things to note...
The auto tranny looks like a breeze to drain the fluid and/or remove the entire pan. Problem is, I don't know how to refill it. Can't find any spot when looking in the engine bay. Lol.

 

[jimbrown618]

Here's what is shown on the Hyundai Canada owners web site when you plug in the VIN for my vehicle:

I scrolled through the different maintenance time intervals till I reached the below service list:

120,000 KM Service
120 Months Service
Includes below services

• Service #3
• Inspect all drive belts
• Inspect propeller shaft (AWD/RWD)
• Replace engine air filter
• Replace climate control/cabin air filter
• Replace spark plugs
• Replace transfer case oil (AWD)
• Replace rear differential oil (AWD)

So I have the 5.0L AWD so it seems that there is conflicting info.......guess I'll have to give my local dealer service here in Halifax a call to confirm...

 

[ThoughtfulOne]

So I have the 5.0L AWD so it seems that there is conflicting info.......guess I'll have to give my local dealer service here in Halifax a call to confirm...

Did they ever get back to you on this?

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[Husky]

I'm sorry to hear this. It's just plain stupid to design something expensive and hard to replace like a transfer case (or tranny or differential), that's full of bearings and gears, without providing a means to replace the lubricant periodically. I don't care how good the lubricant is, there will always be wear, breakdown and contamination. (Or it's smart for planned obsolescence. )
I hope they don't plan to follow BMW's lead in designing cars meant to be thrown away after 100k miles. (which is sadly ironic, given that after decades of dealing with rusty cars, we finally have cars whose bodies can last much longer than that.)
This kind of thinking/designing is what causes the value of many expensive cars to plummet after some years and miles - most people can't afford to fix and maintain them.

 

[Husky]

Just checked under my new G70. I am unsure if there is a drain bolt, but there is one possible bolt I'm seeing. Keep in mind though, it's such a tight fit in there that you may have to completely remove the case to figure out a way to re-fill it. And I don't even know if this bolt is high enough to refill it, or low enough to drain all of it...

Here are some really up close pics to illustrate. Sorry I don't have a gigantic hydraulic lift in my tiny garage.


Xfer case P/N?
View attachment 18974

Driver's side, rear facing portion of lower case...
View attachment 18975

Possible fluid access here, but doesn't seem low enough for a real drain bolt... This is the passenger side rear facing portion of the case. More likely this bolt is to hold something together inside the case, and isn't mean for fluid access at all.
View attachment 18976


Bottom of the case...
View attachment 18977


Rear prop shaft. Notice the rubber damper ring that attaches the shaft to the case.
View attachment 18978


And finally, front prop shaft.
View attachment 18979


Thoughts....
First of all, the case is pretty small/compact. It really doesn't look like it would be too horrible to remove it. Would be a little more complicated than pulling a rear differential, but totally doable. That said, if you had to replace it, it's a job I would feel comfortable doing on my own. But, on that same note, at some point maybe it wouldn't be such a bad idea to try and service it later on down the road. You could technically split it in half without a huge hassle once the case is out and change fluids, but without a service manual I wouldn't dare do that.

Other things to note...
The auto tranny looks like a breeze to drain the fluid and/or remove the entire pan. Problem is, I don't know how to refill it. Can't find any spot when looking in the engine bay. Lol.

Thanks for looking and taking such nice pics. It doesn't look so good for changing the transfer case fluid. I forgot to look at this when I was under my car. I'll have to look at the rear diff and see if it has plugs.
My last (2014) BMW had drain and fill plugs for the rear diff if I recall correctly.

 

[Toddasaurus]

Thanks for looking and taking such nice pics. It doesn't look so good for changing the transfer case fluid. I forgot to look at this when I was under my car. I'll have to look at the rear diff and see if it has plugs.
My last (2014) BMW had drain and fill plugs for the rear diff if I recall correctly.

So, according to the FSM, the transfer case is not serviceable - this includes oil. I was looking through the diagrams of the transfer case on both the FSM and on various OEM parts websites and there truly is no way to drain the oil, unless you can remove the breather at the top of the case. OR, if you want to risk splitting it open....though I have no idea how it looks inside, so that could lead to trouble.

I assume this is the same as X-Drive BMW's because they use a very similar transfer case, supplied by the same company: Magna International.

 

[Husky]

I remember changing the transfer case fluid in one of my BMWs, but I don't recall if it was the E90 or newer F30 model. I'll do a little digging.

 

[jimbrown618]

Did they ever get back to you on this?

I'll be at the dealer this Friday for maintenance and will ask about the transfer case. I had a look at the Hyundai maintenance manual and here is what it said:

Inspection
Prohibition on checking, refilling and replacing the transfer case oil
- Do not check, refill and replace the transfer case oil because the oil for the transfer case only (ultra-low viscosity of ATF SHELL TF
0870) is filled when coming out of the factory.
- Do not check and replace the oil.
- No drain plug
- In case that the transfer case (AWD) oil-related failure code (DTC) appears, replace the transfer oil case assembly.

So guess the previous comments are right and oil can't be changed even though the maintenance schedule listing mentions the procedure.

I looked further in the manual and a few paragraphs later they detail how to remove the oil and show a drain and fill plug, Anyway I'll see my dealer on Friday and have also attached the transfer case part of the maintenance manual here also.

 

[OneLonelyPlayah]

I'll be at the dealer this Friday for maintenance and will ask about the transfer case. I had a look at the Hyundai maintenance manual and here is what it said:

Inspection
Prohibition on checking, refilling and replacing the transfer case oil
- Do not check, refill and replace the transfer case oil because the oil for the transfer case only (ultra-low viscosity of ATF SHELL TF
0870) is filled when coming out of the factory.
- Do not check and replace the oil.
- No drain plug
- In case that the transfer case (AWD) oil-related failure code (DTC) appears, replace the transfer oil case assembly.

So guess the previous comments are right and oil can't be changed even though the maintenance schedule listing mentions the procedure.

I looked further in the manual and a few paragraphs later they detail how to remove the oil and show a drain and fill plug, Anyway I'll see my dealer on Friday and have also attached the transfer case part of the maintenance manual here also.

Any idea where an individual could get the manual for a 2018 G80? Or for that matter, even a 2015-16? I prefer to do a lot of my own maintenance and have typically always owned the service manuals for my vehicles. This one, though, is proving to be a challenge to obtain...

 

[GarnetTy1473]

Any idea where an individual could get the manual for a 2018 G80? Or for that matter, even a 2015-16? I prefer to do a lot of my own maintenance and have typically always owned the service manuals for my vehicles. This one, though, is proving to be a challenge to obtain...

Service manuals are only available online, and only accessible by dealers.

 

[EdP]

Service manuals are only available online, and only accessible by dealers.

When I bought my first Sonata the manuals were on line and free.
Year or two later there was a modest price to use them
I guess it did not work well, but even if I don't do my own work it can be handy to have one.

I had a problem with the cruise control on a MB. Dealer diagnosed and replaced parts. I questioned but but the service manager insisted he was right. I got two miles and had the same problem. Went back and drew a wiring diagram from what I saw in the manual and showed him why he was wrong. He then fixed it correctly for less than half the price.

Maybe a lot of service managers don't want customers to do things like that.

 

[GarnetTy1473]

When I bought my first Sonata the manuals were on line and free.
Year or two later there was a modest price to use them
I guess it did not work well, but even if I don't do my own work it can be handy to have one.

I had a problem with the cruise control on a MB. Dealer diagnosed and replaced parts. I questioned but but the service manager insisted he was right. I got two miles and had the same problem. Went back and drew a wiring diagram from what I saw in the manual and showed him why he was wrong. He then fixed it correctly for less than half the price.

Maybe a lot of service managers don't want customers to do things like that.

I remember back when they were. I don't even remember the site now. Last I remember of it, people were having a harder and harder time getting registered for it. I haven't heard of it in years though.

 

[Husky]

I remember changing the transfer case fluid in one of my BMWs, but I don't recall if it was the E90 or newer F30 model. I'll do a little digging.

It was the E90. The newer BMWs also have a transfer case with no drain or fill plug, same as the G70 I guess. Lots of Bimmer forum people complaining about this as well. Crazy.