Do you fully trust your self pacing cruise control?

[TinsleyC]

My 2019 G80 LKA bounces between the lanes, like a bowling ball bouncing off gutter rails. It also can't handle a moderate curve, it drives right into the next lane (or into the ditch, if I let it). Just not a good experience, I cannot trust it at all. The SCC works well, though.

 

[SuperKing]

My 2019 G80 LKA bounces between the lanes, like a bowling ball bouncing off gutter rails. It also can't handle a moderate curve, it drives right into the next lane (or into the ditch, if I let it). Just not a good experience, I cannot trust it at all. The SCC works well, though.

To be fair, it's working as advertised. It's lane keep assist, not highway driving assist. It's supposed to keep you in the lane which it's doing for you, not drive the car for you.


This is what you're looking for...

 

[TinsleyC]

But when I drove the G70, before buying the G80, it was a completely different experience. The G70 kept centered in the lane and took corners well.

 

[SuperKing]

But when I drove the G70, before buying the G80, it was a completely different experience. The G70 kept centered in the lane and took corners well.

The G70 has HDA, G80 does not... only LKAS

 

[Comp625]

The G70 has HDA, G80 does not... only LKAS

Ohhh, that explains it. What speed does the G70's HDA work down to? I test drove the 2021 Sonata and seem to recall its system working really well even on non-highway roads.

 

[SuperKing]

I'm not sure? When I get my G90, I'm probably going to replace HDA with Openpilot anyways because I can use it anywhere at any speed. I'll try out HDA for a few months to see how it is but Openpilot is constantly being updated and improved upon. With HDA, what you get is what came with the car... lol

 

[Comp625]

I'm not sure? When I get my G90, I'm probably going to replace HDA with Openpilot anyways because I can use it anywhere at any speed. I'll try out HDA for a few months to see how it is but Openpilot is constantly being updated and improved upon. With HDA, what you get is what came with the car... lol

I thought about OpenPilot too but having to mount a camera phone-like device on your windshield detracts from the aesthetic ambiance of a luxury vehicle.

 

[SuperKing]

I thought about OpenPilot too but having to mount a camera phone-like device on your windshield detracts from the aesthetic ambiance of a luxury vehicle.

Like the software, the hardware is also being improved upon as well. The next version of the hardware is smaller according to leaks. It's also opensource so you could run it on whatever hardware you like if you have the know-how. There are versions that run on a small board and uses the factory camera. Nothing mounted on your windshield. Only works on Honda vehicles right now though.

 

[Comp625]

Like the software, the hardware is also being improved upon as well. The next version of the hardware is smaller according to leaks. It's also opensource so you could run it on whatever hardware you like if you have the know-how. There are versions that run on a small board and uses the factory camera. Nothing mounted on your windshield. Only works on Honda vehicles right now though.

That would be dope! Using the factory camera would be awesome, and theoretically, could also work in older vehicles from the mid-2010's where ACC and LKAS were first being introduced.

On another note, did the G80 have HDA in 2019 or 2020? I know it doesn't in 2018MY. I also assume it's in the newest 2021MY refresh, but am curious if anything was done for the 2019MY or 2020MY.

 

[SuperKing]

I don't think HDA was available in the DH models at all? The model was a little long in the tooth to be spending R&D money to add new features like that. Better to just add it to the replacement model.

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[TinsleyC]

The G70 has HDA, G80 does not... only LKAS

I was not aware. Just assumed they were the same technology. Thanks

 

[StarPower]

I use the automated systems, but I don't trust them. These systems cannot anticipate, they can only act as programmed based on limited inputs. When I'm using them my role shifts from driver to systems operator. My job is to monitor the road just as if I were driving manually; anticipate how traffic will behave, the systems' response to traffic, and how traffic will react to that response; proactively intervene if the expected response is not desired; evaluate if the systems are behaving as expected; and take full manual control in any situation where the actual response is not as expected or desired.

While these systems can alleviate some physical fatigue from driving (e.g., shifting my foot between the accelerator and brake pedal in traffic), they still requires constant mental attention. The only added steps are to anticipate and evaluate system response, which becomes pretty intuitive once you get used to the systems and their quirks, so it doesn't require significantly more concentration than full manual control. I've found that the greatest risk when using these systems that I can be lulled into complacency and allow my concentration to drift.

 

[Starflyer]

I'm NOT testing the autobraking period. However, with a different Toyota Rav4 with autobraking, I had it kick it BIG time recently at a Costco parking lot. I was slowly backing out of parking spot when the Rav4 SLAMED on the brakes because of a car coming down the parking lot at 90 degrees from me. I would have stopped normally, but the Rav4 was quicker on the draw.

I've had the red Brake warning light flash on my dashboard maybe 5 times, but I was already on the brakes before the autobrakes activated so don't know how quickly they work compared to the Rav4.

 

[tarhoosier]

I was driving down a busy street and there was a Y intersection with vehicles traveling my direction having right of way to both arms of the Y. An odd traffic pattern. The vehicle ahead had right turn signal intending to take the right arm of the Y and he slowed to make the curve. I was taking the left Y and saw he would clear before I was at the curve to the left for my direction. I was sure from all movements that this was without danger. This technology is speed dependent so will activate sooner if one is traveling faster. I maintained my speed of 35-40 mph. As I approached the car ahead the auto emergency brake flashed red and HIT, and I mean HIT. It then released after a quarter second as my curve and the progression of the car ahead gave clearance. I was thrown into the seat belt for an instant but carried through my intended path. Fortunately there was no one on my bumper behind me.
It works and will make me reassess what extra cushion of space I need to allow for such uncommon situations.

 

[XGC75]

I use the automated systems, but I don't trust them. These systems cannot anticipate, they can only act as programmed based on limited inputs. When I'm using them my role shifts from driver to systems operator. My job is to monitor the road just as if I were driving manually; anticipate how traffic will behave, the systems' response to traffic, and how traffic will react to that response; proactively intervene if the expected response is not desired; evaluate if the systems are behaving as expected; and take full manual control in any situation where the actual response is not as expected or desired.

While these systems can alleviate some physical fatigue from driving (e.g., shifting my foot between the accelerator and brake pedal in traffic), they still requires constant mental attention. The only added steps are to anticipate and evaluate system response, which becomes pretty intuitive once you get used to the systems and their quirks, so it doesn't require significantly more concentration than full manual control. I've found that the greatest risk when using these systems that I can be lulled into complacency and allow my concentration to drift.

A good approach. I have OpenPilot on a Comma 2 installed into my G70 and it works amazingly well for highway driving. It makes systems like Cadillac Supercuise seem dated for requiring premapped roads, and OP will engage whenever you want without fail. It can even drive laneless for intersections, backroads and (unmanned) construction zones. However, it doesn't look around you, give room for bicyclists or brake for pedestrians. It doesn't yet stop at lights or stop signs.

It's a bit of a case of the uncanny valley - the closer it gets to fully automated driving (sans steering wheel), the more aware you need to be of its operation.

 

[2450NW]

I won't pretend I know anything about OpenPilot or how it's implemented in a vehicle. But I'm curious about why anyone would install open-source third-party software that can control a several-ton vehicle capable of traveling at highway speeds, and then trust that software to keep them safe? Doesn't installing this software immediately render any manufacturer warranty null and void? Doesn't having this software installed on a vehicle make the owner immediately liable for any accident?

I'm not trying to be insulting or disrespectful to anyone on these pages. Most of the contributors on this site seem to be reasoned, right-thinking people. And yet, I read these OpenPilot submissions with disbelief. I'm simply dumbfounded. What is it that I'm missing here?

 

[XGC75]

I won't pretend I know anything about OpenPilot or how it's implemented in a vehicle. But I'm curious about why anyone would install open-source third-party software that can control a several-ton vehicle capable of traveling at highway speeds, and then trust that software to keep them safe? Doesn't installing this software immediately render any manufacturer warranty null and void? Doesn't having this software installed on a vehicle make the owner immediately liable for any accident?

I'm not trying to be insulting or disrespectful to anyone on these pages. Most of the contributors on this site seem to be reasoned, right-thinking people. And yet, I read these OpenPilot submissions with disbelief. I'm simply dumbfounded. What is it that I'm missing here?

Any number of things. This is level 2 driver assistance, first of all. That means while OP is running, I'm always the operator of the vehicle by definition. If OP wants to slide into the emergency lane, I'm the one willing it to happen. Else, I'm overriding OP (and training the model). Fault-based insurance means if someone rear-ended me with OP is running, OP is not a factor at fault. If I rear-end someone while OP is running, I'm at fault. I'm the operator.

Almost exactly the same concepts as aviation, really.

Why I do it is another question. Aside from the obvious comfort and convenience benefits, I think the way OP works is the right way for manufacturers to get into automated driver's assistance from an engineering design and legal standpoint. And the more we can automate the better - people are responsible for the deaths of tens of thousands of people per year on the roads. You or I could be one of them. Let's systematically do something about that.

 

[G-41686]

I also said the system won't work and you'll hit the car... so... be quick? LOL

My car (2015 Equus) will stop for a car stopped at a light. Not long ago I found out how to get conventional cruise control. You just turn on cruise control and lift the switch that is below the "cancel" button for 3 seconds or till the display says "conventional cruise control" lights up. Just set your speed and that's it. Just remember it won't stop automatically.

 

[SuperKing]

If your car has a steering wheel and pedals, you are ultimately in control. Don't like what it's doing, override it. These questions have been asked and answered many times already in other threads. It's been beat to death.

 

[G-262115]

What about liability?