Genesis Coupe Buying/Leasing Tips (Read before you sit with your dealer!)

[JohnnyK]

To everyone who is as excited as I am to get behind the wheel of this awesome car, this is for you:​

I have collected as much information on the pricing of this car as possible and want to share it with you all so you are as prepared as possible to call out the Salesman when he feeds you a line of BS.

The Dealer Invoice Prices (Price the dealer pays for the car) are as follows:

2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe:
2.0T, manual: listed retail price: $22,000, invoice price: $20,930
2.0T, automatic: listed retail price: $23,250, invoice price: $22,106
2.0T Premium, manual: listed retail price: $24,250, invoice price: $23,046
2.0T Premium, automatic: listed retail price: $25,500, invoice price: $24,220
2.0T Track, manual: listed retail price: $26,750, invoice price: $25,396
R Spec: listed retail price: $23,750, invoice price: not yet available (I will post it when I have it)
3.8, manual: listed retail price: $25,000, invoice price: $23,500
3.8, automatic: listed retail price: $26,500, invoice price: $24,895
3.8 Grand Touring, manual: listed retail price: $27,500, invoice price: $25,825
3.8 Grand Touring, automatic: listed retail price: $29,000, invoice price: $27,220
3.8 Track, manual: listed retail price: $29,500, invoice price: $27,685
3.8 Track, automatic: listed retail price: $31,000, invoice price: $29,080

As Dimitry discussed in another thread it is a good idea to start your negotiations for the car at the Dealer Invoice Price and work your way up rather than starting at the MSRP and working your way down.


For anyone looking to lease a Genesis as I was here are the papers the dealers get from HMFC regarding leases.

Note that on the second page at the bottom it states "The money Factor to the consumer CANNOT be increased over the published rate."

Don't let the dealer tell you the Interest Rate / Money Factor is any different from these numbers because he is lying.

(To calculate the Interest Rate from the Money Factor simply multiply the Money Factor by 2400. I.E. .00145 x 2400 = 3.48%)


If anyone else has any tips or suggestions please feel free to post them, lets stick it to the dealers!

 

[beowulf]

Awesome post! I'm sure many will appreciate this!

 

[PriorityHyundaiVA]

To everyone who is as excited as I am to get behind the wheel of this awesome car, this is for you:​

I have collected as much information on the pricing of this car as possible and want to share it with you all so you are as prepared as possible to call out the Salesman when he feeds you a line of BS.

The Dealer Invoice Prices (Price the dealer pays for the car) are as follows:

2010 Hyundai Genesis Coupe:
2.0T, manual: listed retail price: $22,000, invoice price: $20,930
2.0T, automatic: listed retail price: $23,250, invoice price: $22,106
2.0T Premium, manual: listed retail price: $24,250, invoice price: $23,046
2.0T Premium, automatic: listed retail price: $25,500, invoice price: $24,220
2.0T Track, manual: listed retail price: $26,750, invoice price: $25,396
R Spec: listed retail price: $23,750, invoice price: not yet available (I will post it when I have it)
3.8, manual: listed retail price: $25,000, invoice price: $23,500
3.8, automatic: listed retail price: $26,500, invoice price: $24,895
3.8 Grand Touring, manual: listed retail price: $27,500, invoice price: $25,825
3.8 Grand Touring, automatic: listed retail price: $29,000, invoice price: $27,220
3.8 Track, manual: listed retail price: $29,500, invoice price: $27,685
3.8 Track, automatic: listed retail price: $31,000, invoice price: $29,080

As Dimitry discussed in another thread it is a good idea to start your negotiations for the car at the Dealer Invoice Price and work your way up rather than starting at the MSRP and working your way down.


For anyone looking to lease a Genesis as I was here are the papers the dealers get from HMFC regarding leases.

Note that on the second page at the bottom it states "The money Factor to the consumer CANNOT be increased over the published rate."

Don't let the dealer tell you the Interest Rate / Money Factor is any different from these numbers because he is lying.

(To calculate the Interest Rate from the Money Factor simply multiply the Money Factor by 2400. I.E. .00145 x 2400 = 3.48%)


If anyone else has any tips or suggestions please feel free to post them, lets stick it to the dealers!

lol, hilarious post what are you possibly sticking to the dealers? a car with no more than a couple grand markup...wow, lmao.

 

[kortERHorse_281]

is that special leasing program "credit score based" !?!?


carlos nice

 

[JohnnyK]

lol, hilarious post what are you possibly sticking to the dealers? a car with no more than a couple grand markup...wow, lmao.

Hey Priority, I should have been more specific. What I am implying is to stick it to the dealers that lie to us. I almost bought this car for 4Gs over sticker after a dealer bent me over with the Money Factor. He told me Hyundai's MF was .00375 whereas it is clearly far from it.

If a dealer is being honest they have nothing to fear by the consumer having this info.

I walked into another dealer armed with this info, made an offer, and they accepted. They were happy to have my business and I'm happy to be a future Genesis owner. In fact, they were the ones who made me copies of this paperwork.

is that special leasing program "credit score based" !?!?

Leasing almost always requires a higher credit score than buying.

 

[PriorityHyundaiVA]

Hey Priority, I should have been more specific. What I am implying is to stick it to the dealers that lie to us. I almost bought this car for 4Gs over sticker after a dealer bent me over with the Money Factor. He told me Hyundai's MF was .00375 whereas it is clearly far from it.

If a dealer is being honest they have nothing to fear by the consumer having this info.

I walked into another dealer armed with this info, made an offer, and they accepted. They were happy to have my business and I'm happy to be a future Genesis owner. In fact, they were the ones who made me copies of this paperwork.



Leasing almost always requires a higher credit score than buying.

Actually it was, it just changed this month to that ultra low rate which is basically 0% in some cases. you cant get ppl on lease factors like you can on finance because the residual is what the manufacturer bases their cars value to be worth.

 

[JohnnyK]

Actually it was, it just changed this month to that ultra low rate

The plan changed from NO HMFC MONEY FACTOR SINCE THE CAR WAS NOT OUT to .00170. Where does .00375 fit in?

And just FYI the dealer was telling me the Money Factor was for March-April, Not February to March.

you cant get ppl on lease factors like you can on finance because the residual is what the manufacturer bases their cars value to be worth.

The residual has nothing to do with the money factor, I am very confused and half interested to know how you are making that connection.

If the residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months that is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00375MF (9%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00145MF (3.48%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00000MF (0%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .01666MF (40%) is $14,500.

The Money Factor changes the amount financed, not the residual.

Kindly explain where I am missing the boat here?

 

[Dimitry]

When leasing, you pay the amount the car is worth. For example, if I lease a bentley worth 100k at the time, and the bank/mfgs decide the car is worth 50k at the end of the lease term (hence; "after x months"), you pay what the car has depreciated in, which in this scenario, would be 50k.

Now, money factor is the "interest" that is charged. It's just a saying of how much interest you will pay during your time with the vehicle. Each .001 MF represents 2.4% percentage on the total lease amount that you have to pay up in addition to your base monthly payments, which can be found out by dividing that amount by the number of months you are leasing the vehicle for.

Let's go back to the bentley example - Assuming a 36 month lease, with a 50% residual from the original 100k, we "financing" 50k, which divided by the 36 month point comes out to 1388, minus any tax/titles/fees (you can add a healthy 5% at least, depending where you are located)

Now, the money factor, is the additional interest on top of what you're paying already, and lets say the MF on the bentley is .003, which is 7.2%. - You would in incorporate that into the payment to give you a rough figure on how much you'll actually end up paying.

With your examples, let's assume that you bargain with the dealer and get it below MSRP, and the TTL gets it right back up to MSRP, leaving with only the MF left to factor in. Let's get those monthly payments!

If the residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months that is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00375MF (9%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00145MF (3.48%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00000MF (0%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .01666MF (40%) is $14,500.

So we're "financing" 14500 for the 36 month term. The base negotiated payment would be 14500/36, which will be 402.78, the 0% MF.

You can add the percentage to the monthly payment, as it is a direct reflection of how much you are actually financing with the added MF.

40% (.016666 MF) would be 20300 financed, 563.89 a month.
3.48% (.00145 MF ) would be 15005 financed, 416.79 a month.
9% (.00375 MF) would be 15805 financed, a 439.08 a month

Thus, for every .00100 MF, you can assume an increase of 2.4% in your monthly payment.

I hope this gives you a better perspective, it definitely has lead me to become much better at vehicle negotiations.

 

[JohnnyK]

When leasing, you pay the amount the car is worth. For example, if I lease a bentley worth 100k at the time, and the bank/mfgs decide the car is worth 50k at the end of the lease term (hence; "after x months"), you pay what the car has depreciated in, which in this scenario, would be 50k.

Now, money factor is the "interest" that is charged. It's just a saying of how much interest you will pay during your time with the vehicle. Each .001 MF represents 2.4% percentage on the total lease amount that you have to pay up in addition to your base monthly payments, which can be found out by dividing that amount by the number of months you are leasing the vehicle for.

Let's go back to the bentley example - Assuming a 36 month lease, with a 50% residual from the original 100k, we "financing" 50k, which divided by the 36 month point comes out to 1388, minus any tax/titles/fees (you can add a healthy 5% at least, depending where you are located)

Now, the money factor, is the additional interest on top of what you're paying already, and lets say the MF on the bentley is .003, which is 7.2%. - You would in incorporate that into the payment to give you a rough figure on how much you'll actually end up paying.

With your examples, let's assume that you bargain with the dealer and get it below MSRP, and the TTL gets it right back up to MSRP, leaving with only the MF left to factor in. Let's get those monthly payments!



So we're "financing" 14500 for the 36 month term. The base negotiated payment would be 14500/36, which will be 402.78, the 0% MF.

You can add the percentage to the monthly payment, as it is a direct reflection of how much you are actually financing with the added MF.

40% (.016666 MF) would be 20300 financed, 563.89 a month.
3.48% (.00145 MF ) would be 15005 financed, 416.79 a month.
9% (.00375 MF) would be 15805 financed, a 439.08 a month

Thus, for every .00100 MF, you can assume an increase of 2.4% in your monthly payment.

I hope this gives you a better perspective, it definitely has lead me to become much better at vehicle negotiations.

Demetri, while I do appreciate your explanation for the sake of others reading this, please read my post carefully. I think you may have misunderstood my grossly exaggerated point I was making PriorityHyundai which is that residuals and Money Factors do not correlate in any manner.

If the residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months that is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00375MF (9%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00145MF (3.48%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .00000MF (0%) is $14,500.

The residual on a $25,000 car is 58% after 36 months with .01666MF (40%) is $14,500.

$14,500 is the residual value, not the financed amount. The financed amount is the (Net Cost - Residual) i.e. 25,000 - 14,500 = 10,500 total amount financed.

Also the caluclation to determine interest you give does not compound the intrest and gives an inaccurate number. A simply was to calculate compounded interest without a large equation is

(Net Cost + Residual) x Money Factor = Monthly Finance Fee

Total Amount Financed / Term = Depreciation Fee

Depreciation Fee + Monthly Finance Fee = Monthly Payment before tax

I.E.

(25000 + 14500) x .00375 = 148.13

10500 / 36 = 291.67

291.67 + 148.13 = $439.80 a month before tax

(This equation may be off by a few dollars in some situations but is always very close to the complex equations the banks use and is a widely used equation in the leasing world.)
More details can be found here http://www.leaseguide.com/mf2400.htm


Now what I am asking PriorityHyundai how the residual somehow determines the Money Factor or vice-versa and he seems to be indicating.

 

[Dimitry]

The only thing i've seen is cars with generally lower residuals have a lower artificial MF by the mfg to make any leasing more attractive. Aside from that, I haven't seen anything else that points to what PH was indicating.

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[PriorityHyundaiVA]

jesus johnny, wake me when you done.

 

[JohnnyK]

Nice answer

 

[PriorityHyundaiVA]

some of you make car buying such a chore. johnny i would respond but i dont feel like the back and forth right now, not worth it. not saying your wrong or right but whateva happen to fun car-buying. people talk all the fun out of it. try walking to and from where you gotta go.

 

[DieselHybrid]

Priority- why knock on someone who is just trying to help?

Jesus Christ is the LORD -not a cuss word, pass it on.
"You shall not misuse the name of the LORD your God, for the LORD will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name." -Exodus 20:7

JohnnyK- I very much appreciate your efforts. Please, keep up the good work!

Peace.

 

[CoasterG]

I guess trying to get the best deal in a business negotiation is a chore.

Car buying is a business deal, plain and simple - most people dread it due to how dealers handle it.

The fun part occurs once its all over and you have a great car and your satisfied for how much you paid for it.

 

[JohnnyK]

I guess trying to get the best deal in a business negotiation is a chore.

Car buying is a business deal, plain and simple - most people dread it due to how dealers handle it.

The fun part occurs once its all over and you have a great car and your satisfied for how much you paid for it.

Exactly, those who go into it looking at it as anything other than a business deal are going to leave unsatisfied.

Good Luck to all those still heading into the dealer! If you know your stuff going in you will be happier for it in the end.

 

[Gimli]

As Dimitry discussed in another thread it is a good idea to start your negotiations for the car at the Dealer Invoice Price and work your way up rather than starting at the MSRP and working your way down.

What? You start your negociations at invoice price and work your way DOWN, not up! The dealer pays nowhere near the invoice price, no matter what he tells you, unless the car sits on his lot for months. You need to read up on what they call "holdbacks".

http://autos.aol.com/article/car-news/what-is-dealer-holdback/20071118102409990001

But then again, in a market where there's very little offer and lots of demand, your success rate to negociate at all is greatly diminished.

 

[ImInPA]

Agreed. A common misunderstanding that folks have about buying a car is the notion of Dealer Invoice. The dealer invoice is what a dealer would pay for a car if they were buying just one. In reality, a dealer is making a decent profit at "invoice." The dealer invoice does not tell you about factory incentives, holdbacks, floor planning, etc. I have bought several cars for considerably less than "dealer invoice." The dealer was not losing money, be assured of that.

 

[PriorityHyundaiVA]

What? You start your negociations at invoice price and work your way DOWN, not up! The dealer pays nowhere near the invoice price, no matter what he tells you, unless the car sits on his lot for months. You need to read up on what they call "holdbacks".

http://autos.aol.com/article/car-news/what-is-dealer-holdback/20071118102409990001

But then again, in a market where there's very little offer and lots of demand, your success rate to negociate at all is greatly diminished.

please explain. yes there are holdbacks but what in the world you think they are 2 and 3000 dollars, lol.

 

[monblanc]

From my cacluations with the published money factor, residual, and down payment, the sample rates with current lease special seems to convert to about $500 over invoice price.

But I am not sure if the aquisition fee of $599 is being rolled in or not.