Subwoofer under front seats?

[CobraBob]

So, I read about those who were/are having an issue with no bass, or very little base in their G70. I've had my 2023 G70 since February and assumed that my audio system was working normally with what felt like minimal base. I have using up to now FM radio, Pandora Premium and Sirius/XM. After reading through this thread and asking a few questions in a thread I started, I learned enough to make me cancel Pandora Friday and switching to Apple Music on Saturday. My wife and I then went for a long drive and I was surprised that I suddenly had normal base while listening to Apple Music. Great! So why wasn't it working with the radio or Pandora or Sirius/XM? Still don't have the answer to that one. I also noticed that the quality of the music was night and day different with Apple Music. I was hearing nuances that just weren't being projected to my ears with Pandora, Sirius/XM or FM radio. It was like I had a brand new, enhanced audio system. The sound is so much more defined and just POPs. I'm totally loving rides in my G70 now with Apple Music.

 

[Volfy]

So why wasn't it working with the radio or Pandora or Sirius/XM?

FM radio's frequency response is theoretically 50-15kHz with a dynamic range of about 50db. No where near CD quality, but not exactly horrible. Also, the old FM transmission is analog, so no compression. That said, real world transmission & reception can be - and often is - worse than ideal. For the most part though, if the signal is strong and the broadcast equipment is tuned well, good ol' FM is listenable.

Pandora and Spotify, as mentioned, are at best MP3 quality. Lots of folks are okay with that. However, because it is a lossy compression, the algorithm plays psychoacoustics tricks to delete a lot of subtle details and nuanced information in the original uncompressed soundtrack and only transmit the dominant parts of the signal that most people "hear" and key in on. This effect can range from mild (high-bit-rate minimum compression) to horribly mangled (low bit-rate high compression). Satellite radio is inherently bandwidth limited, so in order to pack in hundreds of channels into the downlink, they compress the living daylight out of the original materials. The only channels I can barely tolerate are the standup comedy channels. The jokes distracts me just enough to make me not throw up on the sound quality. The rest of the so-called "music"... blehhh

 

[gdevine]

Bear in mind that while Amazon and Apple both have premium tiers that offer high-bitrate uncompressed HD audio, Spotify has yet to offer even lossless CD-quality streaming. Spotify HiFi: release date news, price prediction, quality, and latest rumours It has been talked about for years, literally, but as of yet... no dice.

My daughter has been pushing me to switch to Spotify family account, but I have so far resisted because of their lack of high-res audio. I have auditioned Spotify and AMU "side-by-side" in both G70's Lexicon and Stinger's HK systems, and the difference is enough for me to shy away from Spotify... at least for now. My son has Apply Music and its highest quality is on par with AMU.

You could check out Tidal. They have a family plan offering lossless and master-quality recordings. I think it is the best.

 

[CobraBob]

@Volfy, that doesn't explain why I wasn't getting any bass with the radio, Sirius/XM or Pandora. My previous 2019 G70 had NO bass issues with any streaming service or the radio. This missing bass has been reported by other owners here in other threads. No bass is no bass. Since I have cancelled my Pandora Premium account and cancelled my Sirius/XM accounts a few months ago, I will use Apple Music exclusively. No need for FM, either because the song lists are short (repeating frequently) and lack the quality of Apple Music.

@gdevine, thanks for that tip on Tidal. I checked it out but it seems to more focus on up and coming artists and I'm more interested in current and past mainstream artists. I see it being limited in that way.

 

[Volfy]

Dunno any specifics with your '23 vs. '19. I'm just relating on what I've heard on and known of the various services. With any lossy compression, whether it be streaming, broadcast, or playing off a music file, the deep bass (<80Hz) is quite commonly the first on the chopping block. So are the high frequencies above 16kHz.

A standard CD-quality audio track that can faithfully reproduce the entire frequency range from 20Hz to 20kHz with about 90dB dynamic range, takes 1411 kbps bit rate. MP3 and Spotify does from around 96 to 160 kbps. That means potentially 9/10ths of the frequency contents are removed in the lossy compression algorithm. This is possible because even with a full orchestra symphony, the entire audible range does not contain live and active content at every frequency. There are usually only a number of peaks that dominate the whole 20-20kHz range. A lossy compression preserves these dominant peaks and eskew other lesser amplitude content. A crude comparison would be the difference between a 4k resolution picture of Taylor Swift vs. a 480p of the same pic. At a quick glance, a casual observer might not be able to tell much difference, but a keen eye can definitely pick out the details missing in the lower resolution version.

What complicates the matter even more is that when you hear a bass drum hit, it is never just a single frequency. Yes, in the frequency domain, there is a dominant peak, but there a other harmonics that accompany and color it. Also, in the time domain, a bass drum hit quite often starts with a sharp midbass punch, followed by deeper bass reverberation. It's that midbass "slap" that defines that bass note as a drum "hit". Cut out these finer details, the drum hit will sound tubby and monotonous. Alternatively, reducing the deeper bass reverberation, and the bass note will sound shallow and less dramatic.

Depending on what material you are listening to on what streaming service, these effects can vary greatly. It's good to have some reference materials you like, have listened to a thousand times, and know very very well, when auditioning a new service or new audio system.

 

[CobraBob]

Dunno any specifics with your '23 vs. '19. I'm just relating on what I've heard on and known of the various services. With any lossy compression, whether it be streaming, broadcast, or playing off a music file, the deep bass (<80Hz) is quite commonly the first on the chopping block. So are the high frequencies above 16kHz.

A standard CD-quality audio track that can faithfully reproduce the entire frequency range from 20Hz to 20kHz with about 90dB dynamic range, takes 1411 kbps bit rate. MP3 and Spotify does from around 96 to 160 kbps. That means potentially 9/10ths of the frequency contents are removed in the lossy compression algorithm. This is possible because even with a full orchestra symphony, the entire audible range does not contain live and active content at every frequency. There are usually only a number of peaks that dominate the whole 20-20kHz range. A lossy compression preserves these dominant peaks and eskew other lesser amplitude content. A crude comparison would be the difference between a 4k resolution picture of Taylor Swift vs. a 480p of the same pic. At a quick glance, a casual observer might not be able to tell much difference, but a keen eye can definitely pick out the details missing in the lower resolution version.

What complicates the matter even more is that when you hear a bass drum hit, it is never just a single frequency. Yes, in the frequency domain, there is a dominant peak, but there a other harmonics that accompany and color it. Also, in the time domain, a bass drum hit quite often starts with a sharp midbass punch, followed by deeper bass reverberation. It's that midbass "slap" that defines that bass note as a drum "hit". Cut out these finer details, the drum hit will sound tubby and monotonous. Alternatively, reducing the deeper bass reverberation, and the bass note will sound shallow and less dramatic.

Depending on what material you are listening to on what streaming service, these effects can vary greatly. It's good to have some reference materials you like, have listened to a thousand times, and know very very well, when auditioning a new service or new audio system.

Thanks for that info. Definitely educational.