TTV6 coming in 2017 or 2018

[YEH]

We knew the 3.3TT V6 was coming but now have a more definite time-frame.

Dave Zuchowski, CEO of Hyundai Motor America, said the all-new engine would arrive on the Genesis sedan in 2017 or 2018 and have power in the ballpark of the company's 420-hp, 5.0-liter Tau V-8 but weigh far less.

http://www.autonews.com/article/20150405/OEM03/304069967/hyundai-genesis-gets-twin-turbo-v-6


- So seems to be about the time the 2G Genesis is due for an MCE, so wouldn't be surprised if we see it coupled with the new 10 spd AT.

I'm betting that Hyundai also adds the TT as a powerplant option on the 3G Equus.

 

[jimb100]

We knew the 3.3TT V6 was coming but now have a more definite time-frame.



http://www.autonews.com/article/20150405/OEM03/304069967/hyundai-genesis-gets-twin-turbo-v-6


- So seems to be about the time the 2G Genesis is due for an MCE, so wouldn't be surprised if we see it coupled with the new 10 spd AT.

I'm betting that Hyundai also adds the TT as a powerplant option on the 3G Equus.

If the new engine with its associated twin turbo plumbing will weigh "a lot" less, it will need to be a smaller engine than the current 3.8. If it produces 420 hp it will be interesting to see what the hp and torque curves look like.

If its a 3.5l engine it will be interesting to see if they stage the turbos to minimize lag. Likely they'll need to increase cooling either with adjustments to radiator or oil as keeping the revs up with that setup will generate lots of heat.

I guess we'll need to wait for the gen 3 to get a hybrid with a couple of 100 hp electric motors to provide good off the line power before the turbos get spooled up.

 

[Aquineas]

I am skeptical that it will weigh a lot less. Ford's 5.0 Coyote engine weighs less (444 pounds) than their TT V6. (449 pounds).

 

[Midnightsun]

Time to buy a V8 before they dump this gem of an engine IMHO. Even the article says they are doing this based entirely on strict CAFE regulations.

As mentioned, cutting out 2 cylinders and replacing this with 2 turbo chargers and it's related plumbing and intercooler is not going to make a huge weigh difference. One cannot argue less weight improves fuel economy but the turbo portion is more because of the convenient way of legally fudging numbers to improve tested/posted fuel economy.

"We're going to go forward more broadly with that in the portfolio," Zuchowski said. "You're going to see smaller displacement, more use of turbocharging. A lot of it is weight-related, all of it is CAFE-related."

 

[Iostream]

I told my son shortly after buying this car that this would likely be my last V8. Not by choice, it seems that everyone is dropping the V8 on anything that isn't in the supercar/ultra lux range ($100k+). I plan to keep this Genesis for 5-6 years. Everyone will have time for a refresh and the V8s will disappear. Even if they can get the same or more power from a TT, they are never quite as smooth and refined as a V8.

 

[greekgeek]

If they get serious about cylinder deactivation and structural aluminum there is no reason that 10 speed NA V8 can't be part of the offering.

 

[RSPEC429]

I can see Hyundai massaging the V8 or turboing it and making a high performance model. Using a TTV6 where the V8 Genesis sits now will open up some room for a performance model in the upper tier.

 

[RSPEC429]

Like most mainstream manufacturers, the V8s will be reserved to the one off/high performance offerings.

 

[Mark_888]

I am skeptical that it will weigh a lot less. Ford's 5.0 Coyote engine weighs less (444 pounds) than their TT V6. (449 pounds).

The V8 Genesis weighs about 200 lbs more than the V6 now.

 

[YEH]

If the new engine with its associated twin turbo plumbing will weigh "a lot" less, it will need to be a smaller engine than the current 3.8. If it produces 420 hp it will be interesting to see what the hp and torque curves look like.

It's a 3.3L and there's already some prelim info. on it.

http://thekoreancarblog.com/2015/02/19/exclusive-hyundai-3-3-turbo-gdi-v6-engine/

I can see Hyundai massaging the V8 or turboing it and making a high performance model. Using a TTV6 where the V8 Genesis sits now will open up some room for a performance model in the upper tier.

Like most mainstream manufacturers, the V8s will be reserved to the one off/high performance offerings.

Yeah, don't think Hyundai will be abandoning V8, but probably will go for a smaller displacement (4.0L?) FI V8 for a future performance variant of the Genesis and the top engine for the Equus (not a performance model).

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[Aquineas]

The V8 Genesis weighs about 200 lbs more than the V6 now.

1. Turbos, intercoolers, and piping add more weight, especially more than one turbo. It's not really a relevant comparison.

2. Even if they were directly comparable, how much of that weight is engine vs. additional equipment?

 

[DRS]

I am skeptical that it will weigh a lot less. Ford's 5.0 Coyote engine weighs less (444 pounds) than their TT V6. (449 pounds).

Agreed... His statement on the V6 weighing a bunch less is BS... He has been turned to the dark side of forcing down people's throat wheezing buzzing, noise piped into cabin, turbos due to special EPA testing preference that makes turbos look better..

 

[ksoze]

forcing down people's throat wheezing buzzing, noise piped into cabin, turbos...

Maybe a tad bit melodramtic. Have you recently driven a modern TT? Drive a 2011 Mercedes E550 with the V8 and then the 2012 after the move to TT's. No wheezing or buzzing or piped in sound. They are getting better than the old days.

 

[Mark_888]

Agreed... His statement on the V6 weighing a bunch less is BS... He has been turned to the dark side of forcing down people's throat wheezing buzzing, noise piped into cabin, turbos due to special EPA testing preference that makes turbos look better..

Really? You think the CEO of Hyundai Motor America is lying about the weight?

 

[Midnightsun]

Really? You think the CEO of Hyundai Motor America is lying about the weight?

No he is not lying because in fact a V6 weighs less than V8 however he did not mention the weight of the turbo chargerS and associated plumbing need to be added to this. This is called marketing, there are no lies involved yet the bottom line is deceptive.

Kinda like McDonalds when they say there patties are made with 100% pure beef. Yes the beef that goes into them is in fact 100% pure however the rest of the stuff like 50% of it is bread crumbs and fillers. The advertising leads us to believe the patio has no fillers, again, deceptive yet no lies while remaining accurate.

 

[Nikgen]

No he is not lying because in fact a V6 weighs less than V8 however he did not mention the weight of the turbo chargerS and associated plumbing need to be added to this. This is called marketing, there are no lies involved yet the bottom line is deceptive.

Kinda like McDonalds when they say there patties are made with 100% pure beef. Yes the beef that goes into them is in fact 100% pure however the rest of the stuff like 50% of it is bread crumbs and fillers. The advertising leads us to believe the patio has no fillers, again, deceptive yet no lies while remaining accurate.

Actually, you're 100% wrong - the real FACTS on a McDonalds beef patty are as follows:

100% BEEF PATTY: 100% Pure USDA Inspected Beef; No Fillers, No Extenders. Prepared with Grill Seasoning (Salt, Black Pepper).

http://nutrition.mcdonalds.com/getnutrition/ingredientslist.pdf

With respect to the V6 versus V8 the actual weight difference between the 2 cars is 401 lb (4,541 V8 vs 4,138 V6). The difference between the V8 and AWD V6 is 246 lb (4,541 V8 vs 4,295 AWD V6). There are larger wheels/tires/brakes and the CDC suspension on the V8, but i doubt that all weighs much more than, if even, the AWD add-on on the V6 - so we definitely appear to have a significant weight differential on just the motor.

Even if the V6 weight advantage gets chewed up with the turbos, intercooler, plumbing (maybe not, as it's also dropping from 3.8 to 3.3 L), you still end up with a motor that has a flatter torque curve with better low end torque than the V8. If you push the car hard, you won't get great mileage, but if you don't you can have a car that returns decent mpg in daily driving, but will have equal or better acceleration to the V8 when pushed (albeit with higher complexity and what might come along with that in terms of cost over life of vehicle). I just don't get why there seems to be so much venom from some (not you) in the V8 crowd for anything with less than 8 cylinders?

 

[Sal Collaziano]

If the new engine with its associated twin turbo plumbing will weigh "a lot" less, it will need to be a smaller engine than the current 3.8. If it produces 420 hp it will be interesting to see what the hp and torque curves look like.

If its a 3.5l engine it will be interesting to see if they stage the turbos to minimize lag. Likely they'll need to increase cooling either with adjustments to radiator or oil as keeping the revs up with that setup will generate lots of heat.

I guess we'll need to wait for the gen 3 to get a hybrid with a couple of 100 hp electric motors to provide good off the line power before the turbos get spooled up.

You don't need to stage turbos anymore. Two small turbos pretty much do away with any noticeable lag in cars these days - and provide plenty of power. 420hp will be easily achieved with two small turbos.

I am skeptical that it will weigh a lot less. Ford's 5.0 Coyote engine weighs less (444 pounds) than their TT V6. (449 pounds).

It won't weigh "a lot" less but it'll be 100 or 200 pounds lighter considering it'll be the 3.3 liter V6 and not the 3.8. Reduced weight will result in lower gas consumption and better handling attributes but the main benefit will be using much less gas when the turbos are not spooled. You'll have V8 power and torque all over the place - and use V8-like gas - when the turbos are spooling. Otherwise you'll be using a V6 just like an ordinary V6...

Time to buy a V8 before they dump this gem of an engine IMHO. Even the article says they are doing this based entirely on strict CAFE regulations.

As mentioned, cutting out 2 cylinders and replacing this with 2 turbo chargers and it's related plumbing and intercooler is not going to make a huge weigh difference. One cannot argue less weight improves fuel economy but the turbo portion is more because of the convenient way of legally fudging numbers to improve tested/posted fuel economy.

Not entirely true. Gas use will be much less when you're not spooling the turbos. A V8 is always drinking gas like a V8. A V6 does not until you are pushing the engine for performance. You'll easily save gas with the V6 and still have the V8 power when you want it.

 

[jimb100]

You don't need to stage turbos anymore. Two small turbos pretty much do away with any noticeable lag in cars these days - and provide plenty of power. 420hp will be easily achieved with two small turbos.


It won't weigh "a lot" less but it'll be 100 or 200 pounds lighter considering it'll be the 3.3 liter V6 and not the 3.8. Reduced weight will result in lower gas consumption and better handling attributes but the main benefit will be using much less gas when the turbos are not spooled. You'll have V8 power and torque all over the place - and use V8-like gas - when the turbos are spooling. Otherwise you'll be using a V6 just like an ordinary V6...


Not entirely true. Gas use will be much less when you're not spooling the turbos. A V8 is always drinking gas like a V8. A V6 does not until you are pushing the engine for performance. You'll easily save gas with the V6 and still have the V8 power when you want it.

Its a shame Mercedes and Audi don't get it. Still using V8 in their larger cars even with turbos.

Hopefully they read this forum so they can learn.

And before I hear the BMW 6 cyl with twin turbos, magazine hype doesn't equal real world performance. I'll wait to hear what people are saying after its been out for a while.

While the turbo crowd believes in "free lunch" it still take a certain amount of energy to move a certain amount of weight at a certain rate of acceleration. With techniques like cylinder deactivation a V8 can provide excellent gas mileage with good low end torque without turbo lag or complicated plumbing.

 

[Midnightsun]

Not entirely true. Gas use will be much less when you're not spooling the turbos. A V8 is always drinking gas like a V8. A V6 does not until you are pushing the engine for performance. You'll easily save gas with the V6 and still have the V8 power when you want it.

This opens some eyes for sure. http://autoweek.com/article/car-news/mpg-or-performance-its-trade-turbos

 

[Sal Collaziano]

There are two issues when moving from a V8 to a smaller engine with boost.

1. People like the "boost" and abuse it.
2. It doesn't work well in very heavy vehicles - because you need to use boost too much.

Turbos and superchargers aren't going to work well to replace V8s in "all" applications. I'm not married to boost and I wasn't birthed by boost so I have no emotional connection TO it. However, sense must tell you that your average "car" will benefit in gas mileage while running as a naturally aspirated V6 over a naturally aspirated V8. And while you're out of boost, that's exactly what's happening. If you're going to be "in" boost all the time - you should have stuck with a V8.