2015 Hyundai Genesis Sedan Spy Photos

[EXBMWGUY]

So is there a consensus that the 5.0 AWD will be available?
http://www.hyundainews.ca/ProductArticle.aspx?cont_id=283

Their table listing specs for the V8 certainly indicates AWD as being standard.

 

[italiabrain]

So is there a consensus that the 5.0 AWD will be available?
http://www.hyundainews.ca/ProductArticle.aspx?cont_id=283

The consensus right now is yes for Canada, and no for the US. The US and Canadian models have always been a little different. If I recall correctly the Canadians have had the heated wheel for years.

 

[tompass]

So then it seems that it is up to Hyundai USA to make the decision to release that model in States. If they do not, they are missing a huge market of prospective "up north" buyers.

 

[italiabrain]

I would bet that Hyundai did some internal study that said something along these lines (totally made up numbers):
If we offer the 5.0 AWD in the US we will sell 3k units of them
If we do not offer the 5.0 AWD in the US 2k of the units we would have sold will still be retained sales as either 5.0 RWD or 3.8 AWD
And the part most people forget; If we raise the "loaded" price of the car the perception of hitting $52k for a Hyundai, combined with the decreased perceived price advantage vs Germans -- which will be echoed in auto mag reviews -- we will lose more than 1k sales [not real loss, loss compared to having $49.9k as the top price]

Therefore we will net a loss of sales by offering an AWD 5.0 in the US

 

[NSXNEXT]

So then it seems that it is up to Hyundai USA to make the decision to release that model in States. If they do not, they are missing a huge market of prospective "up north" buyers.

It's a delicate balance. Add too many options and it's priced out of their sweet spot. Pricing it too high (too close to their German and Japanese competitors) and they will lose market share.

I think they are making the right decision. Maybe in ~5 years when they are truly an established brand and can justify the price will they start ramping up options and price.

 

[NSXNEXT]

I would bet that Hyundai did some internal study that said something along these lines (totally made up numbers):
If we offer the 5.0 AWD in the US we will sell 3k units of them
If we do not offer the 5.0 AWD in the US 2k of the units we would have sold will still be retained sales as either 5.0 RWD or 3.8 AWD
And the part most people forget; If we raise the "loaded" price of the car the perception of hitting $52k for a Hyundai, combined with the decreased perceived price advantage vs Germans -- which will be echoed in auto mag reviews we -- will lose more than 1k sales [not real loss, loss compared to having $49.9k as the top price]

Therefore we will net a loss of sales by offering an AWD 5.0 in the US

Ah beat me to it.

 

[Mark_888]

So then it seems that it is up to Hyundai USA to make the decision to release that model in States. If they do not, they are missing a huge market of prospective "up north" buyers.

Back in 2012, Hyundai decided to relegate the V8 to the R-Spec only. So I think that in 2012 they made a decision that most people who want more of a luxury car would be OK with the 333 HP V6, and only those who wanted more of a performance car with sport tuned suspension would hold out for a V8. In other words, they thought (rightly or wrongly) that most people up north would be satisfied with the V6. Given that decision, I don't it is a much of a leap to say that those who want a performance car don't care as much about AWD, especially since AWD reduces performance a bit. I know that scottdk (member) has stated that he would not want an R-Spec with AWD, even though he lives in Minnesota.

It is hard to say whether Hyundai was right or wrong. Based on comments from some very vocal members of this forum it sounds like they were wrong, but I am not sure how representative this forum is to the overall marketplace.

 

[Mark_888]

The consensus right now is yes for Canada, and no for the US. The US and Canadian models have always been a little different. If I recall correctly the Canadians have had the heated wheel for years.

That is correct. Canadian versions have always been slightly different all the way back to 2009. Of course, the US version has always been different than the KDM version.

One thing to keep in mind is that the US version is noticeably less expensive than the Canadian version, and much less expensive than the KDM version, even when comparatively equipped. That means that Hyundai Motor America profit margin is much lower in the US, and they may even be selling at no profit or at a loss in order to gain market share. The US market is much more competitive than Korea, and Canadian sales of a RWD car are so low it doesn't make that much difference to them how many they sell.

So Hyundai Motor America needs to choose the options carefully that they need to have on the car to sell it at such low prices compared to the competition. Many (or maybe all) of the advanced Tech features on the KDM version that don't make to the US are using systems or components purchased from outside vendors specializing in those things, and the cost to Hyundai of including them is quite high.

 

[pizzaguy]

Ever since 2009 Genesis, the KDM version has always had more options than the US version. That is not likely to change. Keep in mind that the KDM version of Genesis sedan costs significantly more than the US version.

Given that the Genesis is made in Korea, and the lead time involved for getting cars to the US, one cannot order individual options on the Genesis, only predetermined trim packages. This is just like all other Asian manufacturers, and even most US manufacturers these days.

These are exactly the types of things I'm talking about when I say that the new model has really let me down. Wraparound cameras aren't exactly exotic at this point in time. To not even offer it on a new model refresh for what is supposed to be a legitimate luxury car really confuses me and makes me question Hyundai's vision for the Genesis.

 

[DominicJE]

Hyundai Think Tank had a feedback survey of the new Genesis and one of the questions was
"What do you think about the idea of a high performance 5.0 AWD Genesis? Please tell us why in the comment box"

So 5.0 AWD will be here more than likely. "Love it" was the most chosen answer

I didn't get a chance to read all the comments on here yet in case someone else already confirmed it. I just got back from my trip.

______________________________

Help support this site so it can continue supporting you!

 

[tompass]

All great informed comments for sure. My point is if they are already producing the AWD V8, why not make it available to neighboring market. Could also be a scenario where the AWD V8 does not sell well in Canada and they then make the anticipated excess inventory available here. Dropping the HP on V6 down to 311 does not make a whole lot of sense to me either.

 

[NSXNEXT]

These are exactly the types of things I'm talking about when I say that the new model has really let me down. Wraparound cameras aren't exactly exotic at this point in time. To not even offer it on a new model refresh for what is supposed to be a legitimate luxury car really confuses me and makes me question Hyundai's vision for the Genesis.

Price price price. More features = higher MSRP which they are trying to control.
Honestly when I was shopping for cars had the Genny been a few thousand more I probably would have gone German.

 

[Mark_888]

These are exactly the types of things I'm talking about when I say that the new model has really let me down. Wraparound cameras aren't exactly exotic at this point in time. To not even offer it on a new model refresh for what is supposed to be a legitimate luxury car really confuses me and makes me question Hyundai's vision for the Genesis.

The vision is that the Genesis is to be affordable in the entry level luxury market, starting at about $35K. The Genesis is not supposed to be a "legitimate luxury car." If you want true luxury from Hyundai, you get an Equus. The current version of the Equus may not have all the goodies (I don't really know) but I am sure they next version will.

 

[Mark_888]

All great informed comments for sure. My point is if they are already producing the AWD V8, why not make it available to neighboring market. Could also be a scenario where the AWD V8 does not sell well in Canada and they then make the anticipated excess inventory available here. Dropping the HP on V6 down to 311 does not make a whole lot of sense to me either.

We don't know exactly why the V6 HP rating was decreased. It may be to improve reliability, reduce soot, or some other similar reason. The 3.8L displacement did not change. Recall that when they introduced GDI, the HP went from 285 to 333, and maybe that rather large increase created some problems that have not been disclosed. I would give them a pass on that until you drive it and determine for yourself whether it has acceleration that is as good as before.

Hyundai Genesis cars made for the Canadian market probably cannot be sold as new in the US, due regulations such as TPMS, etc. I don't for sure about the 2015, but there have previously been differences in the US and Canadian versions, some of which were related to government regulations.

 

[Mark_888]

Hyundai Think Tank had a feedback survey of the new Genesis and one of the questions was
"What do you think about the idea of a high performance 5.0 AWD Genesis? Please tell us why in the comment box"

So 5.0 AWD will be here more than likely. "Love it" was the most chosen answer

I didn't get a chance to read all the comments on here yet in case someone else already confirmed it. I just got back from my trip.

You may be right about the likelihood of an AWD V8, but I think survey's like that are ridiculous since:

• Most people responding are not current Genesis or Equus owners, but anyone who is a member of the Think Tank, including Elantra and Acent owners.
• I would bet a lot of money that less than 5% of those who answered "love it" would actually buy the 5.0 AWD.

 

[italiabrain]

Price price price. More features = higher MSRP which they are trying to control.
Honestly when I was shopping for cars had the Genny been a few thousand more I probably would have gone German.

I agree completely, but this is exactly why things like the CO2 sensor bother me. It seems like with a fixed price target everything they choose to include is at the cost of something else. Maybe we could have had the around-view instead of the rear radars. Maybe we could have had the heated steering wheel instead of a CO2 sensor.

I get that they want something "cutting edge" and that they want to include some things that aren't available on mainstream cars... but it also appears they're cutting things that are available on mainstream cars to make up the difference since they effectively have a fixed price cap. Heated steering wheels and around view monitors aren't just becoming par for the segment, there are vehicles under $30k that offer them (not vehicles starting at $30k, vehicles that are under $30k with the option). As stated before, the heated rear seat is available throughout Hyundai's own lineup all the way down to the Elantra.

I'm not upset that it appears they're going to make the compromises necessary to keep the 5.0 around $50k (probably). I'm just not happy with the compromises it appears they chose.

 

[Mark_888]

I agree completely, but this is exactly why things like the CO2 sensor bother me. It seems like with a fixed price target everything they choose to include is at the cost of something else. Maybe we could have had the around-view instead of the rear radars. Maybe we could have had the heated steering wheel instead of a CO2 sensor.

I get that they want something "cutting edge" and that they want to include some things that aren't available on mainstream cars... but it also appears they're cutting things that are available on mainstream cars to make up the difference since they effectively have a fixed price cap. Heated steering wheels and around view monitors aren't just becoming par for the segment, there are vehicles under $30k that offer them (not vehicles starting at $30k, vehicles that are under $30k with the option). As stated before, the heated rear seat is available throughout Hyundai's own lineup all the way down to the Elantra.

I'm not upset that it appears they're going to make the compromises necessary to keep the 5.0 around $50k (probably). I'm just not happy with the compromises it appears they chose.

I was looking at some other cars on the internet, and it is not unusual for heating steering wheels to only come on cars with AWD. They are obviously linking AWD with cold weather owners. I am not including those cars where one can custom order individual items (like MB and BMW), rather those who have several trim packages with options that are bundled.

 

[italiabrain]

I was looking at some other cars on the internet, and it is not unusual for heating steering wheels to only come on cars with AWD. They are obviously linking AWD with cold weather owners. I am not including those cars where one can custom order individual items (like MB and BMW), rather those who have several trim packages with options that are bundled.

I know the E, 5, A6, and CTS all offer the rear seat heating on their 2WD models. I'm not sure about the steering wheel. I understand your logic, my problem is applying that logic to the US V8 when AWD can't be had. I think it would be fine to have them paired IF AWD were offered.

I have no interest in a FWD midsize, but my grandparents' Altima has a heated steering wheel.

 

[pizzaguy]

The vision is that the Genesis is to be affordable in the entry level luxury market, starting at about $35K. The Genesis is not supposed to be a "legitimate luxury car." If you want true luxury from Hyundai, you get an Equus. The current version of the Equus may not have all the goodies (I don't really know) but I am sure they next version will.

My impression has always been--and I'm pretty sure I've read Hyundai exec statements to this effect--that the Genesis is aimed squarely at the 500 series, E-series, M-level, A6 level of competition. If that's what you mean by "entry level," then I guess we simply disagree where that line falls. For me, it would be the small-body style sedans (300 series or C-class, etc.) and not the mid size ones.

Where we agree for sure is that it is about the price point for Hyundai. I get that and think that's exactly the plan they need to have. But I don't think they're going to make serious headway into the realm they're aiming at (500s, E-class, etc.) by failing to include features their competition has or will very soon have. They need to be packing essentially all the big things in and do so at a lower price. It's crazy to think they put a CO2-sensing system in but skimped on features (like surround camera system and contemporary headlamps) that really matter every day.

 

[italiabrain]

My impression has always been--and I'm pretty sure I've read Hyundai exec statements to this effect--that the Genesis is aimed squarely at the 500 series, E-series, M-level, A6 level of competition. If that's what you mean by "entry level," then I guess we simply disagree where that line falls. For me, it would be the small-body style sedans (300 series or C-class, etc.) and not the mid size ones.

Where we agree for sure is that it is about the price point for Hyundai. I get that and think that's exactly the plan they need to have. But I don't think they're going to make serious headway into the realm they're aiming at (500s, E-class, etc.) by failing to include features their competition has or will very soon have. They need to be packing essentially all the big things in and do so at a lower price. It's crazy to think they put a CO2-sensing system in but skimped on features (like surround camera system and contemporary headlamps) that really matter every day.

I agree completely. I think the only argument that can be made for the use of the term "entry level" in referring to the Genesis is that if Hyundai were to create a luxury brand right now it would be their lowest priced model in the brand.