2015 Hyundai Genesis Sedan Spy Photos

[Big_tugg]

I think high 50's is to much

 

[Sal Collaziano]

I think high 50's is to much

Just imagine what the next Equus is going to top out at.

Don't worry, the Chinese are coming and will do to South Korea what they did to Japan. Sell you good cars for less. Until some other brand comes and does the same thing to the Chinese.

Hyundais are a great deal but NOTHING lasts forever. Nothing. Get 'em while you can!

 

[larry'sown]

Try optioning up any of the Genesis' competitiors, direct or indirect, and see what you come up with. Even if the price of the next Equus is raised by $10K, it would still be a bargain. The Genesis and Equus are and will xontinue to be a bargain.

 

[italiabrain]

Try optioning up any of the Genesis' competitiors, direct or indirect, and see what you come up with. Even if the price of the next Equus is raised by $10K, it would still be a bargain. The Genesis and Equus are and will xontinue to be a bargain.

I would grant that the Genesis is still priced well, but the price argument gets very subjective with this car very quickly. It very much depends on whether you credit luxury competitors for their separate dealer network, showrooms, services, loaner cars, etc. Hyundai has made a conscious decision not to go that route (which I agree with), but there is some kind of value lost there. If you take the $8k/car that Hyundai said it would have cost them and add it back into the price it still undercuts the Germans, but the margin shrinks a lot. Then there's the issue of drivetrain/gas mileage. Again, I'm actually totally fine with the NA engines, but turbos, intercoolers, and associated plumbing are expensive and virtually every competitor has them.

The Genesis is still a pretty good deal to me because I'd rather keep the $8k and go to the same dealer as the guy who buys an Accent (though a guaranteed loaner would be nice). I'd also rather have an NA engine than pay another (guessing) $4k for a smaller, FI V8 that gets better gas mileage. With just those 2 factors it is expected that the Genesis should be $10-12k less option-for-option than its German competitors.

An E550 is $61k, and comes with AWD. IF you assume full face value for the two differences above and another $2500 for AWD, the Genesis is actually no deal at all. At $51k for the 5.0 + $8 for the Lux Name/Network/Benefits + $4k for an FI engine setup and +$2.5k for AWD the Genesis would be more.

Now I would never voluntarily pay $8k just for the lux stuff, and given two engines of roughly equal performance I wouldn't pay thousands more for the FI version either. If you're in the same camp as me then the Genesis is still a good deal, but it's not nearly the deal it was before. IMO it went from excellent, skipped very good, and landed on good.

If, however, you think that luxury name/rep/service-center is worth a few thousand and you would willingly pay a few thousand for the turbo's low-end torque and better gas mileage then the Genesis is only a marginal deal if at all.

 

[Sal Collaziano]

Try optioning up any of the Genesis' competitiors, direct or indirect, and see what you come up with. Even if the price of the next Equus is raised by $10K, it would still be a bargain. The Genesis and Equus are and will xontinue to be a bargain.

I'm pretty sure that when all is said and done, Hyundai wants to sell it's products at the same price (if not more) than competitors. They're in business to make money. Right now, sure, their products are a "bargain". But they don't want to be considered a "bargain brand" or "entry level luxury" forever. They want to be on par/equal - at least - with the big brands.

So Hyundai products are not going to be "great deals" forever. Once everyone realizes Hyundai is building quality products on par with BMW and Mercedes, Hyundai is going to increase prices to be on par price-wise as well.

Get 'em while you can...

 

[ksoze]

I would grant that the Genesis is still priced well, but the price argument gets very subjective with this car very quickly.

Italianbrain is right on here. When one moves into the upper $50's and above, the buyers are no longer coming up from Sonatas. The value system and statement a car makes is different in this territory. They are now in the range of cars whose cachet will be difficult to shrug off if the price delta is too close, too fast. It's one thing to say to your neighbor, "yeah it's a Hyundai, but it's a lot less than XXXX", if it's actually true.

 

[YEH]

I would grant that the Genesis is still priced well, but the price argument gets very subjective with this car very quickly. It very much depends on whether you credit luxury competitors for their separate dealer network, showrooms, services, loaner cars, etc. Hyundai has made a conscious decision not to go that route (which I agree with), but there is some kind of value lost there. If you take the $8k/car that Hyundai said it would have cost them and add it back into the price it still undercuts the Germans, but the margin shrinks a lot. Then there's the issue of drivetrain/gas mileage. Again, I'm actually totally fine with the NA engines, but turbos, intercoolers, and associated plumbing are expensive and virtually every competitor has them.

An E550 is $61k, and comes with AWD. IF you assume full face value for the two differences above and another $2500 for AWD, the Genesis is actually no deal at all. At $51k for the 5.0 + $8 for the Lux Name/Network/Benefits + $4k for an FI engine setup and +$2.5k for AWD the Genesis would be more.

Doesn't the margin actually increase once you add the V8, all the options, tech?

A loaded E550 4Matic and we're talking in the mid-$80k range.

Despite the pricing of the R-Spec, Hyundai did a pretty good business in the $45k+ sedan.

Italianbrain is right on here. When one moves into the upper $50's and above, the buyers are no longer coming up from Sonatas. The value system and statement a car makes is different in this territory. They are now in the range of cars whose cachet will be difficult to shrug off if the price delta is too close, too fast. It's one thing to say to your neighbor, "yeah it's a Hyundai, but it's a lot less than XXXX", if it's actually true.

Doubt that there were too many buyers coming from Sonatas (unless they were loaded) and even then, those were probably many buyers who either didn't buy the maximum of what they could afford or saw a big rise in their income.

A Sonata starts at $21.3k and even if we are talking about the most commonly purchased Sonata trim - probably around $25-26k, still a quite a way from the $35.2k starting price of the 2014 Genesis.

Hyundai was doing around a 30-35% take on the R-Spec, so there was a decent amount of sales at the mid-$40k price range.

I would expect to see a drop in the % of Genesis sales for the 5.0, but the 3.8 should get a significant bump in ATP (buyers these days want as much tech/options as they can afford).

 

[italiabrain]

Doesn't the margin actually increase once you add the V8, all the options, tech?

I'm not sure what you mean.

I was talking Genesis 5.0 base vs base E550 since that seems to be the closest comparison to make. Yes the E550 tends to climb faster in price from its base than the Genesis does, but a loaded E550 isn't comparable to a Genesis imo. Too many options that aren't available on the Genesis.

 

[YEH]

^ But a base 5.0 Genesis come w/ more kit than a base E550 (does a base E550 even come w/ leather?).

And I'm talking comparably equipped.

The Germans charge more for options/tech and since they do it a la carte (unlike the Koreans and Japanese) - that's an even greater price differential.

An E550 w/ every option ticked goes beyond the mid-$80k range.

 

[italiabrain]

^
Yes, the E550 comes with leather. It's also rather difficult to push it into the 80's without checking some (imo) silly boxes. This does bring up another point with the luxury brands though. A la carte pricing itself can be seen as worth some amount of money because you're much more likely to get a configuration close to your own ideal, increasing the "value" to you.

My point in this whole conversation is that "cachet" is not the only tangible or intangible thing against the Genesis when comparing it to a traditional luxury marque. You gain price, warranty, and I'm betting insurance rates. You lose cachet, separate dealer networks, loaner vehicles, resale value, a la carte optioning, gas mileage, low-end torque, etc...

I still might buy one depending on what the "street price" is after a couple months, but as the options list stands I wouldn't pay mid 50's for it.

Give me an RSpec adding leather upper dash, sportier wheels (19 is still okay), AWD with sport+ type setting that locked it 90/10 or so, heated rear and steering wheel and I'd pony up $60k.

In other words, it's not just that the cost for the model I would buy went up $8k vs last year it's also a moderate disappointment to me in a couple areas regardless of price. This is where a la carte gets its "value". I'd rather have 99% of the car I want for $60k than 80% of the car I want for $55k.

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[YEH]

^ Don't be so sure about the resale value.

The Germans at the mid to higher price-points tend to be among the worst.

And the last I looked the Genesis has about a $7-8k price advantage over the Japanese - so probably higher than that for the Germans (at least for BMW and MB).

 

[italiabrain]

^ Don't be so sure about the resale value.

The Germans at the mid to higher price-points tend to be among the worst.

And the last I looked the Genesis has about a $7-8k price advantage over the Japanese - so probably higher than that for the Germans (at least for BMW and MB).

Could you provide an example of what cars you might be referring to? According to numbers I've run on KBB the Genesis only beats American competitors on residual value. I can't imagine the Genesis retaining $7-8k more value than a Japanese competitor at resale.

 

[Seattle Genesis]

So I was watching a spanish review of the 2015 MY Genesis and I notice while he was driving there was a large numerical readout of the MPH in the center console... very cool ! Also in the same video at the very end he was taking a left turn with the turn signal on. Looks like the LED lights progressively light up from center outward. Not sure if that was an optical illusion or what. Sure would like to get that verified for all us car nuts that cant wait for it to arrive in the showrooms...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFAV2IT_HN0

Edited:... just notice the center readout in another image. Nice !

 

[YEH]

Could you provide an example of what cars you might be referring to? According to numbers I've run on KBB the Genesis only beats American competitors on residual value. I can't imagine the Genesis retaining $7-8k more value than a Japanese competitor at resale.

Been a while since I last looked at this - but for the Germans, the residuals drop like a stone once the warranty period is up.

The 1G Genesis did beat the domestics, but that was for models like the STS, so doesn't really count (think the new CTS will be around the same, if not beat the 2G Genesis in residual value), but it also beat out the previous Infiniti M.

The current M has better residuals, but wouldn't be surprised if the new Genesis comes out ahead again, tho beating the GS is another matter.

The $7-8k I was referring to was regarding the price, not residual value.

With 2014 Genesis models now supposedly having $10k or so off the MSRP, not going to help the residuals on the 1G model (in particular the '13 Genesis).

While the LS460 has very good residuals, the LS600h does not b/c Lexus has to discount them heavily from MSRP.

 

[DominicJE]

I'm so confused, they claimed that the daytime running lights are the LED's but yet in those test drives in Arizona, every single model had the basic yellow light for the DRL.

When I went to the Detroit auto show, they were LED DRL, even at the New York Autoshow (http://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/hottest-cars-at-new-york-auto-show-2014/7/)

So which is it? I sure hope it is the LED DRL since the yellow ones looks ugly.

 

[italiabrain]

I'm so confused, they claimed that the daytime running lights are the LED's but yet in those test drives in Arizona, every single model had the basic yellow light for the DRL.

When I went to the Detroit auto show, they were LED DRL, even at the New York Autoshow (http://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/hottest-cars-at-new-york-auto-show-2014/7/)

So which is it? I sure hope it is the LED DRL since the yellow ones looks ugly.

I completely agree.

 

[marty5marty]

I'm so confused, they claimed that the daytime running lights are the LED's but yet in those test drives in Arizona, every single model had the basic yellow light for the DRL.

When I went to the Detroit auto show, they were LED DRL, even at the New York Autoshow (http://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/hottest-cars-at-new-york-auto-show-2014/7/)

So which is it? I sure hope it is the LED DRL since the yellow ones looks ugly.

The 2015 genesis in Korea have white LEDs. Btw...if you go to Gangnam in Seoul you will see so many Genesis and Equus like 80%...it doesn't feel unique here anymore lol

 

[italiabrain]

The 2015 genesis in Korea have white LEDs. Btw...if you go to Gangnam in Seoul you will see so many Genesis and Equus like 80%...it doesn't feel unique here anymore lol

The US models have the same headlights as the base KDM version. The issue here is that they refer to the white LED strip in the headlight as an "LED daytime running light", however in the pictures the LED strip only comes on when the headlights are also on. With the headlights off the LEDs also appear to stay off, and the turn signals are used as running lights.

 

[PMCErnie]

The US models have the same headlights as the base KDM version. The issue here is that they refer to the white LED strip in the headlight as an "LED daytime running light", however in the pictures the LED strip only comes on when the headlights are also on. With the headlights off the LEDs also appear to stay off, and the turn signals are used as running lights.

How many cars have you seen with amber (turn signal) running lights?

Answer: None

So, why do you expect the new Genesis to have them?

 

[italiabrain]

How many cars have you seen with amber (turn signal) running lights?

Answer: None

So, why do you expect the new Genesis to have them?

If you want to ask a question without reading even the last page of the thread in which we tell you were this idea came from multiple times, fine. You asked it, sarcastically answered it, and answered it incorrectly. There have most definitely been multiple cars with amber running lights. I've personally driven at least two different cars with them. Regardless, I wasn't advocating them, or saying they were stylish. I think they look awful and that concern was the reason for discussing it.

To answer the question I shouldn't have to: There was a photo shoot for journalists we have been referring to. During that photo shoot the amber lights were on in several pictures (and they were the only lights on). The LED strips in the headlights were on in some photos, but they were never on without the HID main beam (and imo that disqualifies the term running light applying to them).

It's possible that these aren't configured as final production, etc. However, these are presumably more recent production than the auto show cars were.